U joint failure? 2007 R1200RT

[ohbobh]

While finishing up a 2000 mile trip on my 2007 R1200RT (58k miles) on an Interstate Hwy, the bike suddenly let out with a loud, staccato noise. I promptly pulled over to the shoulder and the bike came to an abrupt halt. The tires appeared to be fine, but I noticed that the rubber boot enclosing the universal joint was shredded. Upon further inspection I noticed that the U joint was severely mangled.

The back wheel was locked up, verified by the skid mark behind the tire and the inability to move the bike even with the clutch pulled in.

The bike was eventually towed to a certified BMW dealer last Tue, but they won't be able to tear it down until this Thurs, 9 days later.

Questions:
1. Is it possible that the U joint on it's own self-destructed?
2. Could the final drive or tranny have locked up, causing the u joint to fail?

Any thoughts are welcome. I'll hopefully know more this Thurs.

 

[advenbob]

Had the same type failure on my 07 GSA at 88k. Strong vibration and slowing to a complete halt. Locked up driveline.

Dealer reported front u joint broke and drive shaft damaged internal of rear drive arm. All replaced under extended warrarnty (service contract). Now I have a drain plug for the final drive.

Dealer stated final drive was begining to fail, so it was replaced at same time.

There are other reports out there with the same failure with the u joint. Bruno's offers rebuild and serviceable drive shaft/u joints. Linky: http://www.brunos.us/index.html

best

bob

 

[deilenberger]

ObobH (real name?)

Please read: http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?t=46055 - I'm adding that info to your thread title. Please do so yourself on any threads you start in the tech forums.

Yours is the 3rd instance of this sort of U joint failure I've heard of. It's the 2nd RT.. one was a local club members where his went while we were riding together. His rear wheel didn't lock, but it certainly was not happy.

I'd suggest going and reading this thread: http://www.r1150r.org/board/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=25005 end to end. It's on another forum that I'm active on, and in it I explain what I think causes the failure (and that gives you the means to avoid it happening.) Basically - not installing the rubber boots that couple the swingarm to the rear-drive (and transmission) correctly appear to be the cause of the failure.

Please ask your dealer to take some digital pics of the failed shaft, I'd be quite curious to see it.. the others that failed both showed rust caused by the boots not being installed correctly.

It's not a common failure mode - but it has been known to happen. I think it can be avoided.

BTW - Bruno will not be able to repair these driveshafts. By the time they seize or start flopping around, the u-joint is torn up too much to be rebuilt.

 

[Polarbear]

Boots ;

They are tricky, having serviced dozens of 'em. Get them back on right is a good idea. If you do your own, pay close attention to the plastic inner rings, supporting the boot! They are too easily messed up, as one attempts to get the splines back together. Rust inside the unit is a poor job done and should not happen, if done correctly. I ride hard offroad, through creeks, just about all the bad stuff one would want to ride in. My final drive splines stay dry or drain well any water getting in. Service'em every tire change, no fail to miss this service at tire time. All that said, maybe this is a point of concern and I WILL watch mine, so thanks for the heads up. '07GSA @ 83000+. Randy

 

[siman00]

On my 05 1200 RT, the rear U joint failed at 82K miles. Not a catastrophic failure, but it would have been such if I had not caught it in time. I was preparing the bike for a cross-country ride, and decided to change the final drive oil.

As I was putting it back together, I noted some rust at one arm of the U joint. Upon closer inspection, I could see that several of the needle bearings were missing from two (opposite) ends of the joint. Wish I had known about rebuilding them; might have saved me some cash.

Bought a used one on eBay and had it installed. Sold bike and bought 09 Rt.

Glad I caught it before leaving town for California!

 

[Polarbear]

Yeah, me too!

I am about to cross the country again, lots of miles, so I LOOK see soon, before depart. I WILL ask my dealer too, about these numbers and how many they see? Thanks. Mine still covered in 7 year plan, but I want no issue on the road. Randy

 

[beemergirl]

Here's mine

http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?t=54749
There are additional photos if you scroll down that thread and I have a few more unposted.

2009 RT with 36,838 miles.

I've heard about many u-joint failures at this point. Please be sure to report yours to the NHTSA.
One problem with NHTSA however, seems to be they look at each model year separately, when multiple years and multiple models have the same design.

 

[deilenberger]

Nancy - thanks for reminding me of that one. In your case - I don't see any rust in the U-joint.. which is interesting and indicates a bearing failure due to? Dunno..

 

[Polarbear]

Question?

I could not pull the pics up, so I ask! Are both joints weak or the rear one only failing? I have not ever seen the front ujoint, so is it the same kind a joint at the tranny end of shaft? Just curious. Seems there is probably 2 ujoints, so which is the failing one most often, or both. Whats BMW do, change out the whoile shaft assembly? Thanks for your words here, sorry i cannot get the pics. Randy

 

[Polarbear]

Just chatted with BMW;

Phone chat revealed 2 recent drive shaft failures at my dealer, both '07 GSA bikes. The front joint on one and the rear joint the other. One came apart, the other rider felt it going and saved it doing same. Now I really have to do a extensive look see on mine before MO. Rally trip. Also, the price is 600$+ I'm told by dealer for part. I'm still under my 7 year plan, hope not needing it for this. RandyGSA1200'07

 

[marchyman]

I pulled the DS out of my '05 GS at the 60K service because I was curious as to U-joint condition. That, and it is no big deal to pull the DS on a GS. FWIW both U-joints seemed fine. I'll not bother pulling the DS again at 72K. Maybe at some future time, if I still own the bike.

 

[ohbobh]

Yesterday the BMW dealer was able to tear the bike down. Apparently the only damage was indeed the U joint at the rear of the drive shaft, which was totally trashed. To further clarify, the drive shaft looks like 2 shafts married together, with the rear part (smaller OD) going into the larger ID front shaft. Both the front and rear of the drive shaft have a U joint attached with a female spline, which in turn connects with the transmission and final drive output shafts. Neither U joint can be replaced as you have to get the whole enchilada, in this case the entire drive shaft which has the U joints factory-installed at each end. The front U joint looked to be in perfect working order.

Here is the rub: the MSRP for the drive shaft is something over $700.00! I have checked with 2 salvage businesses for used drive shafts, but to no avail. Next I'll go to E-Bay. Any further suggestions would be gratefully appreciated.

Now that I've finished whining about the costs involved, not to mention the 5 hours of labor at almost $100.00/ hour, let's review the findings. The bearings fell out of the U joint and a touch of rust was present. Evidently, some water got into the rear U joint and washed the lubricant out of the factory lubricated and sealed U joint, causing it to fail. The final drive AND transmission appear to be functioning normally.

Now that the horse is out of the barn, as one poster previously suggested, perhaps it might be prudent for one to check the rear U joint at every rear tire change.

Thanks for the input and suggestions rendered by all!

 

[Polarbear]

Please

GIVE us some details on pulling the entire shaft out for inspection? I have a GSA. You say its not to bad to do and I've never done mine. Would love to check mine too, taking it all out for a look see. I don't want to remove the housing, hoping it just pops out the back??? My BMW dealer just gave me a price in the 600$ range for replacement part. Is it hard to pop back into tranny link side? You can't see up in there. Randy

 

[ohbobh]

GIVE us some details on pulling the entire shaft out for inspection? I have a GSA. You say its not to bad to do and I've never done mine. Would love to check mine too, taking it all out for a look see. I don't want to remove the housing, hoping it just pops out the back??? My BMW dealer just gave me a price in the 600$ range for replacement part. Is it hard to pop back into tranny link side? You can't see up in there. Randy

Randy,
The dealer's tech removed the rear swingarm and driveshaft together, then took the drive shaft out of the swingarm. If one were to pull the driveshaft out of the swingarm, I don't know if it would be possible to couple the front U joint spline of the driveshaft with the transmission output shaft.

Perhaps someone more knowledgeable about this might chime in.

Bob

 

[thumperbum]

2008 1200rt 23,103miles

Some thing is not happy in my drive line. It sounds like tire road noise but remains after new skins installed. While changing FD oil today noticed I can feel the rear gear set meshing. I don't know if this is normal or should there be no vibrations feel or noises heard. There also seems to have a tight spot during wheel rotation. I am crossing my fingers there's another 1000 miles in it as we are leaving for Skyline Drive in the morning.
Any thoughts as to what I'm experiencing here?

 

[racer7]

Did you have it dropped, brake caliper off the disc and driveshaft disconnected or ar you feeling effects of bakes and other parts?

 

[marchyman]

GIVE us some details on pulling the entire shaft out for inspection?

I did it as part of an FD fluid change where I'd already dropped the FD and had access to the rear of the DS. I snipped the cable tie that holds the boot at the front of the drive shaft to the transmission. After pushing the boot back I used a screwdriver to lever off the front of the DS from the transmission output splines. There is a spring clip that is part of the DS so it needs a bit of leverage. I then pulled the shaft out of the swing-arm. Total extra time: maybe 3 minutes.

Randy,
The dealer's tech removed the rear swingarm and driveshaft together, then took the drive shaft out of the swingarm. If one were to pull the driveshaft out of the swingarm, I don't know if it would be possible to couple the front U joint spline of the driveshaft with the transmission output shaft.

On a GS it is very easy to get them back together once you realize that you can NOT see what is going on so don't bother trying. It took me 30 minutes to learn that lesson. Once I gave up trying to use my eyes and instead depend upon what I can feel with my fingers it took maybe 5 minutes to re-install the drive shaft. The key was to position the U-joint yokes so the end of the drive shaft didn't flop up and down, but instead side-to-side where I could guide it with my fingers.

Pictures of part of the the procedure are on this page (snafu.org).

 

[Polarbear]

Makes sense

Thanks for heads up on shaft removal. The boot up front coming loose is a factor I see clearly for obvious reason you describe. Taking the swingarm off is not on my list to do and your help is appreciated. I will remove mine before any more long journeys, for good inspection. If I have any doubts to its lifespan, it goes to dealer for replacement under warantee. I can put it back in. I was just telling my wife, outsourcing is so common in this world today and BMW has no handle on this either. Parts seem to be less scrutinized for quality,as in many years past. Today, the parts come from all corners of the planet, including China, a big player. I guess the result is less than a perfect machine and this includes everybody from Ford/Chevy to HD/BMW to all others. Now its our drive shafts, latest I've heard. Randy

 

[PaulWitt]

After reading this post I went to check out my 2008 RT and noticed that I can pull the forward part of the boot back from the swing arm. Is this indicating that the boot was not installed correctly? If it is, I'm really going to spool up after spending a mint on a new final drive that was 2 weeks out of warranty.

 

[deilenberger]

After reading this post I went to check out my 2008 RT and noticed that I can pull the forward part of the boot back from the swing arm. Is this indicating that the boot was not installed correctly? If it is, I'm really going to spool up after spending a mint on a new final drive that was 2 weeks out of warranty.

Aassuming you mean the rearmost boot (swingarm to rear-drive) - it's normal to be able to pull it away from the swingarm, but you should make certain that the plastic expander/retainer is still inside and in place (and not cracked.) It should fit quite snuggly into the oval hole in the end of the swingarm, and there should be grease smeared generously around the part of the boot that goes into the hole.