The older Beemers have reserve switches. In traffic, you can just flip the lever when it starts to sputter. Mine never died in such a situation. My '10 RT, just died in the fast lane of the interstate at a very awkward place. No left shoulder, I had to coast over to the right shoulder across three lanes of traffic. And that had to be done just right, in order to weave between cars in rush hour with no power whatsoever. Talk about high drama! OK, so, once I knew the strips were unreliable, and what with no reserve switch, I used a dry-erase marker to write the mileage until the next needed gas stop that did include ample reserve. After my 3rd strip on the '10 RT, it never failed in the next 20,000 miles. My '11 RT fuel strip has been reliable thus far (10,000 miles).
-
Welcome, Guest! We hope you enjoy the excellent technical knowledge, event information and discussions that the BMW MOA forum provides. Some forum content will be hidden from you if you remain logged out. If you want to view all content, please click the 'Log in' button above and enter your BMW MOA username and password. If you are not an MOA member, why not take the time to join the club, so you can enjoy posting on the forum, the BMW Owners News magazine, and all of the discounts and benefits the BMW MOA offers?
-
Beginning April 1st, and running through April 30th, there is a new 2024 BMW MOA Election discussion area within The Club section of the forum. Within this forum area is also a sticky post that provides the ground rules for participating in the Election forum area. Also, the candidates statements are provided. Please read before joining the conversation, because the rules are very specific to maintain civility.
The Election forum is here: Election Forum
BMW Motorcycle Reliability Quality Support Failure
- Thread starter JayElDee
- Start date
I love my bike but for a $20K motorcycle I shouldn't have to be working formulas in my head, writing notes, resetting odometers, lighting candles, making offers to the BMW gods, stopping every 200 miles, or whatever. The D gauge we paid for should work. Does running out of gas present a danger to the rider? YES! Keep in mind that these FI engines die suddenly unlike the old carburetor engines.
Just my opinion...
tsp
http://www.airheadmoto.com
Just my opinion...
tsp
http://www.airheadmoto.com
yup
What naivete to believe that it is the owner's fault somehow, yet even many of the bmwmoa sophisticates are ready to jump down the throat of anyone who dares to speak ill, no matter what. Yet you see this in every bmw forum. Just take what Hans and Franz gives you and be quiet.
It is a non issue if you prefer to have no gas gauge; that is far from the point. I recognize that it may be useless in your riding; problem is it can be useless in mine too. I'll honor your position if you honor mine. They are both valid.
As Don has pointed out, we paid for this, often as an ordered item, not just "coming with the bike." The D thing is supposed to work. It does not have to be perfect, but it needs to be reasonably reliable, and it's not for many owners.
Trick me once shame on you; trick me twice shame on me. Wise up. You're being taken.
Yup, correctomundo.
No I have not named them/him and probably won't, though it wouldn't be very hard to figure out. I am a bit reluctant to because the other people who work there thought it sucked also, or at least that was their demeanor and they were surprised also by his response. The service tech told me after replacing number one to come back every year and he'll replace it whether it needs it or not. I don't think that is necessarily good advice but it shows that he knows they fail and that it was maybe poor form to deny the reapir gratis in the first place.
If you throw a name out there I will tell you who it is not.
Kudos though...I have had good service on the road from Bentonville BMW in Bentonville, Ark and Sandia BMW in ABQ, actually twice in each store on different trips.
marchyman
Cam Killer
Because modern bikes use fuel pumps and injectors that don't like running out of gas. A reserve that you switched to after "running out of gas" was fine with a gravity feed into carbs. Even then some were surprised that their reserve wasn't very good with either water at the bottom of the tank or crap that blocked the lower pick up tube.
An odometer is not an accurate replacement for a fuel gauge. On the same bike I can get anywhere between 35 MPG and 50 MPG. With a 5 gal tank that's 175 - 250 miles. I want to have a better estimate than 75 miles as to when I might need to look for fuel.. especially since most of the time I can count on getting 180-200 miles on a tank.
You're exactly right. I've made the same argument. I ran out at 180 and 202 and I had gas left at 223. The variability of distance/tank is great. That range is a gallon of gas in a 5 gallon total. Pretty high %.
If all you're doing is riding to the dealership to have coffee with your buds on Sat morning, or riding the same stretches of road all the time in a pastoral or urban commute or filling up once a week whether the tank is 1/4 or 3/4, then you don't need one. But with mixed riding and unknown terrain or weather and no certainty of where the next gas is, depending on your maps and gps and extra fuel in the back, well, BMW had a terrific idea to put a fuel gauge on the bike. They need to make it work. They created a boil, and lancing it every so often is only a temporary fix. It will flare up again, likely.
They got too fancy with the doodads and they often do not work, but, for many, there is not reliable workaround for it.
A functioning low fuel light and an odometer is all you need. I know how to figure out MPG and I don't need average speed or miles to empty. Just relaibly tell me when I am hitting reserve, so I can plan ahead and stop for fuel. I promise to look at the odometer and do the little mental computation to decide the binary decision, good mileage or bad mileage. I just don't want a gauge to fool me or try to, even if it's obviously doing so. That is a built in distraction I don't want oir need.
Bmw put it there, they need to make it right. That is their responsibility.
This may appear a tempest in a teapot for some, many, riders. I respect that. For some though, it is/has the potential to be/has been a major headache in an otherwise very fine bike. That should be respected also.
cjack
K Bikes Complex by Choice
Well in spite of my factious comment above, there is quite a variability in gas empty range. I mainly wanted a way to shut the thing up when it was blinking at me, but ultimately, I would fix it for the reasons you state. Now that I know how to replace it on the K1200S without removing the tank, and how to possibly fix it without replacing it on the GS, I am only left with not being to turn it off on a long trip.
ka5ysy
2011 R1200RT
At last, conscious thought in replies. I was beginning to wonder about this place
to be clear about two things, well three, four
my flavor of fuel strip failure has no yellow light. My gauge giddily tells me I have LOTS of fuel left when I don't. I don't have the failure where the gauge is yelling FUEL FUEL FUEL and the yellow light goes on. That's the better/safer one. Again, that is not the way mine fails, at least on the first two.
I know the lying ways of the sensor when it fails, and felt it had failed again, so I was ready to feel the sputter and deal with an unpowered stop.
I had time to choose where I would stop and I chose under an overpass for the shade.
Re the clutch lever. Situational awareness is paramount on a motorcycle. I had a plan and was ready to execute it to controllably stop in a safe area. I knew I would be hitting rumble strips. Not my first rumble strips. I know how they feel and fully anticipated them. They were clearly visible. What got me was the sudden change from one anticipated feeling to one that was an UN anticpated feel. I looked down to see my tires, thinking Did they blow and not knowing what would cause that. I don't know if the rear locked up, but I think mechanics would demand that it would. And I almost caught it. As there was a concret barricade, I only went over about 40 degrees. Panicking? Not at all. It was one of those mishaps at nearly 0 mph in which you're saying F! F! F! and gravity wins another one, in slo motion.
I have relived it over the weeks and I think pulling the clutch lever in, in that particular situation, or maybe most situations, would be the proper course. Just like "altitude in an airplane." In this case rolling forward smoothly and having more time to decide wouldn't hurt.
and finally, my main point in all of this was what I felt to be the shabby customer hostile way I was treated by the dealer, via its owner, aka prev owner of the bike, who probably lied to me about the fuel sensor pre sale, and the take it or leave it cut you loose attitude of BMW. I think it sucked. It was not the crash, or the fuel strip being the cause; all that's arguable.
This type of treatment reflects poorly on a once proud company and gives the KoolAde a bitter aftertaste.
Thanks again for the comments
John
Instructor hat on :
You just clearly stated, besides improper use of clutch, why you hit the barrier: Looking down at your tires instead of where you were going. The fuel strip had nothing at all to do with anything.
Attorney hat on:
You seem to confusing the former owner of the bike, who now happens to be the new owner of the dealership, with purchasing anything from the dealership, a business corporation having nothing whatsoever to do with the purchase transaction. These are two separate and distinct legal "persons" for all purposes. There is no duty for the dealership corporation to do anything about the used bike you purchased, other than to service the bike or sell you a new fuel strip. BMW corporate probably owes you no duty for anything either, due to the used bike status.
As to pre-purchase status of your fuel strip last highlighted, I strongly suggest you look up the definition of "libel".
I stand (partially) corrected!
If a fuel gauge was RELIABLE and ACCURATE I might actually want to pay for one for the good reasons mentioned by other readers. But they just don't seem to be very reliable. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it just seems to me that many of the mechanical problems with the newer models discussed here don't really relate to issues that will leave you stranded by the roadside. They seem to be related to Accesories. More accessories equals more problems equals more repair bills. In the 25 years and 65,000 miles that I owned my R75/5 the only factory parts I ever bought were oil filters, drain plug washers, points and a set of mufflers. My R1100RS has been a different and sadder story and I am now in the market for a good airhead.
If a fuel gauge was RELIABLE and ACCURATE I might actually want to pay for one for the good reasons mentioned by other readers. But they just don't seem to be very reliable. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it just seems to me that many of the mechanical problems with the newer models discussed here don't really relate to issues that will leave you stranded by the roadside. They seem to be related to Accesories. More accessories equals more problems equals more repair bills. In the 25 years and 65,000 miles that I owned my R75/5 the only factory parts I ever bought were oil filters, drain plug washers, points and a set of mufflers. My R1100RS has been a different and sadder story and I am now in the market for a good airhead.
cjack
K Bikes Complex by Choice
Well, nothing wrong with simplicity, but you miss out, even though there is a price to pay for the latest tech.
I'm willing to pay it, but to have the license to crab about it too. I figure when they come to the house for the meal after my funeral, the UPS guy will be standing at the front door with the latest version of something I just ordered.
I'm willing to pay it, but to have the license to crab about it too. I figure when they come to the house for the meal after my funeral, the UPS guy will be standing at the front door with the latest version of something I just ordered.
The barrier was parallel to the direction of travel. I leaned on it. At close to 0mph, if not 0mph. I didn't hit it with forward motion. There was only open shoulder, clear and without obstruction in front of me. Maybe I didn't make that clear enough?
Do you turn your head when you hear a horn? Do you turn your head when you're changing lanes? Do you avert your gaze from the road when you look at your speedometer? Of course you do. Are you aware of everything 360 degrees around you. Yes, that's what instructors teach, right? So,if there is a sudden unexpected shuddering coming from the road, tires, wheels you look down to see if you can ascertain what's going on. Don't you teach that? I did not become fixated to the extent of paralysis and you seem to be suggesting that and that is false. This is a very momentary thing, and in no way did it mean I wasn't looking where I was going. I looked down then up then down again then up all the while trying to stop cleanly on the shoulder, safely. I think the ability to quickly glance at something, assess and make a decision in important. Don't you? To be even clearer, we are talking split seconds and not at all anything like not being aware of my direction of travel. To state otherwise is false. And in fact, this happened from nearly 80 mph, and the only damage was to a windscreen and bracket. A minor sprain of my wrist. I didn't talk to a doctor or a lawyer about it, other than now you. In all, other than the hassle, a $202 mishap. It could have been much worse and likely would have been had your suggestions of my behavior been close to true, other than pulling in the clutch sooner.
The owner of the dealership and prev owner are the same person, the one who told me there was no prob with the fiuel strip pre sale and the one who refused to help with it when it failed actually with the first fillup. I filled with 103 miles remaining and the tank took nearly 5 gallons. The same person who did not suggest contacting BMWNA for reimbursement. Just No. So, maybe I am confused. It looked like the same person to me. And what is this purchasing anything from the dealership statement? I didn't say that. That is false also. I said I am still in the BMW fold because I still think their bikes are the best. I also refused to say the name of the dealership because I know there are many concerned competent nice people working there, hustling to make a living and I didn't want to hurt them. They have been nothing but courteous to me over the years.
And I looked up libel as you suggested. The truth is not libel. I know what I was told.
But, Doug, I have no beef with you and I don't want to. You helped me out with a local ride once a while back and that was appreciated.
This was a series of at least "unfortunate" events that were made worse by other behaviors. And the common thread is the D Fuel Strip.
BMW does owe its customers a solution to this, don't you think?
take care
John
PPARKER1024
New member
New York Times / BMW Is Recalling 51,000 Motorcycles for Fuel Leak
BMW Is Recalling 51,000 Motorcycles for Fuel Leak
Following an investigation by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, BMW says it isrecalling almost 51,000 motorcycles because of a possible fuel leak, according to a report the automaker posted on the agency?s website. Most of the recalled motorcycles are 2005-11 R and K series models.
The action comes almost 14 months after N.H.T.S.A. began investigating consumer complaints about fuel leaks. BMW said it would recall the motorcycles, although the automaker said the leaks do not pose ?an unreasonable risk to motor vehicle safety.?
The problem involves cracks developing in a plastic flange on the fuel pump, possibly after a maintenance procedure is performed incorrectly. In addition, BMW said, corrosive fluids could damage a seal, causing ?a small leak.?
At least one owner told the safety agency that the leak was not small.
?I started the motorcycle engine ? a few seconds after it started, gasoline started to gush from the front of the bike onto the engine,? one owner wrote to the agency. ?Before I knew it, I was in a puddle of gasoline. I shut it off as soon as I realized what was happening. I mopped up the gasoline off of the floor to eliminate the fire danger.?
Some other owners told the agency that, after finishing a ride, they found a pant leg soaked in gasoline.
BMW told the agency it was not aware of any accidents, injuries or fires related to the issue.
BMW?s report said that the automaker received its first complaint of a leak in 2006 and several more the following year. By early 2010, the company had investigated the problem and concluded that the leaks were because of improper servicing techniques. During the first half of 2010, BMW made manufacturing changes to new models to prevent such problems.
The full list of recalled motorcycles can be seen here.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/07/a...ing-51000-motorcycles-for-fuel-leak.html?_r=0
BMW Is Recalling 51,000 Motorcycles for Fuel Leak
Following an investigation by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, BMW says it isrecalling almost 51,000 motorcycles because of a possible fuel leak, according to a report the automaker posted on the agency?s website. Most of the recalled motorcycles are 2005-11 R and K series models.
The action comes almost 14 months after N.H.T.S.A. began investigating consumer complaints about fuel leaks. BMW said it would recall the motorcycles, although the automaker said the leaks do not pose ?an unreasonable risk to motor vehicle safety.?
The problem involves cracks developing in a plastic flange on the fuel pump, possibly after a maintenance procedure is performed incorrectly. In addition, BMW said, corrosive fluids could damage a seal, causing ?a small leak.?
At least one owner told the safety agency that the leak was not small.
?I started the motorcycle engine ? a few seconds after it started, gasoline started to gush from the front of the bike onto the engine,? one owner wrote to the agency. ?Before I knew it, I was in a puddle of gasoline. I shut it off as soon as I realized what was happening. I mopped up the gasoline off of the floor to eliminate the fire danger.?
Some other owners told the agency that, after finishing a ride, they found a pant leg soaked in gasoline.
BMW told the agency it was not aware of any accidents, injuries or fires related to the issue.
BMW?s report said that the automaker received its first complaint of a leak in 2006 and several more the following year. By early 2010, the company had investigated the problem and concluded that the leaks were because of improper servicing techniques. During the first half of 2010, BMW made manufacturing changes to new models to prevent such problems.
The full list of recalled motorcycles can be seen here.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/07/a...ing-51000-motorcycles-for-fuel-leak.html?_r=0
Royal Tiger
New member
^Thank you for the link. My ST is listed in the recall.
mika
Still Wondering
Did not realize the NHTSA direct link to the recall had not been posted:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/owners...searchCriteria.nhtsa_ids=13V617000&refurl=rss
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/owners...searchCriteria.nhtsa_ids=13V617000&refurl=rss
deilenberger
A bozo on the bus
And since recalls have been put into play in this thread - I'd like to again point out that the only way the fuel strip problem will become a recall is IF people experiencing the problem complain to NHTSA.
See: http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?64037-Fuel-strip-poll&p=858929&viewfull=1#post858929 for some specific details on how to, and how to report it so it makes the most impact (standardization of the failing system..)
BMW has been forced to issue recalls on CARS that had failing fuel sensors (NHTSA found they increased the risk of an accident due to stopping at inopportune times in inopportune locations - sound familiar?) so no reason I can think of that the same logic wouldn't apply with motorcycles experiencing the same failure mode.
For those who see fuel-gauges as frippery or baubles on a bike - good for you. I don't see it that way, so please let those of us who are deluded into thinking we should get what we pay for have our say and see if the government agency responsible for vehicle safety issues agrees.
See: http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?64037-Fuel-strip-poll&p=858929&viewfull=1#post858929 for some specific details on how to, and how to report it so it makes the most impact (standardization of the failing system..)
BMW has been forced to issue recalls on CARS that had failing fuel sensors (NHTSA found they increased the risk of an accident due to stopping at inopportune times in inopportune locations - sound familiar?) so no reason I can think of that the same logic wouldn't apply with motorcycles experiencing the same failure mode.
For those who see fuel-gauges as frippery or baubles on a bike - good for you. I don't see it that way, so please let those of us who are deluded into thinking we should get what we pay for have our say and see if the government agency responsible for vehicle safety issues agrees.
