greenwald
New member
This is proving to be an interesting winter thread!
An entertaining mix of some thought-provoking anecdotal tales, and some kooky theories.
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Visible Riding Gear
- Thread starter amadison
- Start date
This is proving to be an interesting winter thread!
An entertaining mix of some thought-provoking anecdotal tales, and some kooky theories.
This is proving to be an interesting winter thread!
An entertaining mix of some thought-provoking anecdotal tales, and some kooky theories.
My anecdote: About 15-18 years ago I was riding in SoCal, having visited and documented the southwestern corner of the USA. Heading north on the interstate from San Ysidro, I was leading the pack of cages and trucks. Heavy, fast traffic, almost bumper to bumper and all moving at about 20 over the limit. I was watching my mirrors closely for LEOs when I spied a couple sets of yellow lights. They were the only things I picked out of the nearly solid sea of white headlights behind me. The yellow lights were weaving in and out of traffic in perfect synchronization and moving fast. When they caught up with me I saw they were two CHiPS on RTs. No sirens, no flashing authority lights, just the yellow conspicuity lights.
My point and I repeat for effect: those yellow lights were the only things I noticed and picked out of the sea of car and truck headlights behind me. I told myself right then that when I got back home I would put yellow LED conspicuity lights on my bike. I did and have ridden with them on every single bike I've owned since then. In lots of miles, I have had few vehicles turn in front of me. I credit the yellow lights with that.
Good luck.
akbeemer
SURVIVOR
This is proving to be an interesting winter thread!
An entertaining mix of some thought-provoking anecdotal tales, and some kooky theories.
Am I thought provoking or kooky? Or do I just provoke kooky thoughts?
greenwald
New member
You, sir, are consistently thought-provoking.
Way different from a few whom are just 'provoking.'
Royce's account of the amber lighting is quite interesting.
There are many things to do to be 'conspicuous' in traffic, such as weaving as you approach intersections, high-intensity riding lights forward and flashing LED brake lights rearward. Modulating headlamps a huge advantage. Hi-Viz gear (especially the helmet - white) a proven factor. Following distances, lane selection and controlling your speed - all important.
But riding intelligently trumps riding brightly. Learning good road-survival tactics and then employing them every time you ride has more to do with a safe return at the end of the day.
No "Holy Grail" for safety in traffic - it's a combination of all these elements.
AKsuited
New member
Being visible, more specifically catching motorists' attention behind you is also a good thing to try to ward off rear-ender wrecks, which are the most common accident on Interstates. I also have auxiliary lights on my GS, but they point forwards and not backwards. Plenty of YouTube videos of motorcyclists being rear-ended, many in town. My experience wearing hiz-viz jackets and vests has been that many motorists take note of that, give me more room, and stop farther behind me. They give me credit for trying to address safety.
Back when Motolights first showed up, most in our group added them after this picture and another I had of five behind her you could barely see.
On a Canada trip and I too had hi-vis, so not a hater
The cow noticed!
Local interagency escort training before heading out for live rolling drills...not picking on them as they are not the only folks where tradition may trump modern thoughts. The cool thing to see is the female Moto a few riders ahead of the hi-viz left rear. APD has two I know of and a friend of mine actually had a chat with the one in pic...still got the ticket he justly deserved that day.
Tail/brake ight
About 6 weeks ago a rider went through town with something similar to this https://www.amazon.com/Wireless-Helmet-Brake-Light-Receiver/dp/B0042ASTT8 on his helmet. It did stand out when he came up to the stoplight at dusk.
About 6 weeks ago a rider went through town with something similar to this https://www.amazon.com/Wireless-Helmet-Brake-Light-Receiver/dp/B0042ASTT8 on his helmet. It did stand out when he came up to the stoplight at dusk.
greenwald
New member
As many of you are discovering, it's really all about creative and very noticeable lighting.
Hi-Vis gear can help, and I wear plenty of it, but the reality of some recent research is that the problem with Hi-Viz/reflective attire is that, since we are on a moving object, our backgrounds (colors, shapes, shadows, rain, fog, etc.) are constantly in flux. This often reduces that 'cloak of visibility' to near zero.
The military used to require al service members wear a reflective belt when doing PT, jogging or riding a motorcycle, to increase awareness. They found it did nothing for safety on bases, and have since discontinued the practice.
Yes - dress to be noticed. But lots of flashy lighting makes you far more noticeable than neon yellow from head to toe,
Hi-Vis gear can help, and I wear plenty of it, but the reality of some recent research is that the problem with Hi-Viz/reflective attire is that, since we are on a moving object, our backgrounds (colors, shapes, shadows, rain, fog, etc.) are constantly in flux. This often reduces that 'cloak of visibility' to near zero.
The military used to require al service members wear a reflective belt when doing PT, jogging or riding a motorcycle, to increase awareness. They found it did nothing for safety on bases, and have since discontinued the practice.
Yes - dress to be noticed. But lots of flashy lighting makes you far more noticeable than neon yellow from head to toe,
cam_on_van_isle
Member
I wear black and I don't trust anyone, or anything.
Cars, bicycles, kids. dogs, deer, ambulances, scooters, pedestrians (especially walking with their nose in direct line of their cellphone), cops, birds, crackheads, bears, boulders, balls, ice, sand, asphalt sealer, raccoons, corners banked the wrong way, drunks, skateboards, stones thrown off of flatbeds, moving day insecurely tied down crap on the road, firewood, turning right in front of you...
My opinion is HiVis personal attire doesn't matter, loud pipes as well, and it could never console you in a crash. Ride defensively, you are the vulnerable one.
Cars, bicycles, kids. dogs, deer, ambulances, scooters, pedestrians (especially walking with their nose in direct line of their cellphone), cops, birds, crackheads, bears, boulders, balls, ice, sand, asphalt sealer, raccoons, corners banked the wrong way, drunks, skateboards, stones thrown off of flatbeds, moving day insecurely tied down crap on the road, firewood, turning right in front of you...
My opinion is HiVis personal attire doesn't matter, loud pipes as well, and it could never console you in a crash. Ride defensively, you are the vulnerable one.
AKsuited
New member
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but it conflicts with the findings of safety studies.
That said, I confess I do not wear Hi-Viz all the time.
AKsuited
New member
Contrast that with standard UK practice:
<iframe width="940" height="529" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/oeO3cLP2FDw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Like most other issues that have personal opinions attached to them, I wonder if this thread will change any of our opinions? I suspect it will not. For sure, it will not change my opinion. I will continue to wear as much Hi-Viz gear as I can wrap around my fragile carcass. I will continue to hang bright YELLOW lights on the front of my bike(s). And I will continue to think negative thoughts ("There goes another dummy.") about other riders who make different choices.
Good luck to all of us.
Good luck to all of us.
brownie0486
Well-known member
It's my opinion every little bit helps, I'll take all I can get for being more visible
greenwald
New member
Well ………… in this "Butterfly-chasing, tree-hugging, no one does anything bad, everyone makes the team, we're all winners, all forms of drugs and behavior are acceptable, let's re-write history, no one should be criticized" bunch of cell-phone zombies walking around on egg shells, I find your personal philosophy a breath of fresh air.
Shocking news World: there is right and wrong; there is smart and dumb; there is good and bad," and the only way a society evolves is to voice opinions (currently rebadged as 'bullying'), and get people to at least reconsider improving their path. Get over it.
As for Hi-Viz, though not the only factor, definitely an important one. Dress to be seen - not creamed.
One thing that we should be careful of when attempting to stand out more, is how by applying decals/stickers, we can actually be camouflaging ourselves.
Case in point: We see the UK police using the Battenburg (checkerboard) marking pattern and automatically assume that it must be safer. It wasn't ever designed to be safer, it was designed to be recognizable.
"Both the chequered and the miniature permutations of the Battenburg marking scheme are remarkably effective in breaking up the bike’s visual profile (especially when the bike is seen from the front). All this significantly increases the time taken by drivers to detect and recognize a motorcycle on response duty, thus reducing the valuable time they need to avoid the bike."
For an absolutely fascinating discussion on actually standing out from the crowd (and where I stole the above images and quote from), check out John Killeen's blog on Ambulance Visibility
He also did a talk in 2010 where he went through all of the pro/cons of different markings and colors:
http://www.ambulancevisibility.com/web_images/Colorado%20EMS%20Safety%20Summit%202010%20presentation%20-%20John%20Killeen%20-%20Ambulance%20Visibility.pdf
*Note: I'm not saying you should attempt to be mistaken as an ambulance or police motorcycle
Case in point: We see the UK police using the Battenburg (checkerboard) marking pattern and automatically assume that it must be safer. It wasn't ever designed to be safer, it was designed to be recognizable.
"Both the chequered and the miniature permutations of the Battenburg marking scheme are remarkably effective in breaking up the bike’s visual profile (especially when the bike is seen from the front). All this significantly increases the time taken by drivers to detect and recognize a motorcycle on response duty, thus reducing the valuable time they need to avoid the bike."
For an absolutely fascinating discussion on actually standing out from the crowd (and where I stole the above images and quote from), check out John Killeen's blog on Ambulance Visibility
He also did a talk in 2010 where he went through all of the pro/cons of different markings and colors:
http://www.ambulancevisibility.com/web_images/Colorado%20EMS%20Safety%20Summit%202010%20presentation%20-%20John%20Killeen%20-%20Ambulance%20Visibility.pdf
*Note: I'm not saying you should attempt to be mistaken as an ambulance or police motorcycle
Recall all the years of "what color works for fire trucks?"
Our local was red, lime, white, and now back to red. The ambulance is white, seems was lime for a bit.
Those patterns do stand out.
And without quoting...voicing an opinion and bullying falls in the same approach? ...really
Either snowing or out of oatmeal K?
Our local was red, lime, white, and now back to red. The ambulance is white, seems was lime for a bit.
Those patterns do stand out.
And without quoting...voicing an opinion and bullying falls in the same approach? ...really
Either snowing or out of oatmeal K?
greenwald
New member
Recall all the years of "what color works for fire trucks?"
Our local was red, lime, white, and now back to red. The ambulance is white, seems was lime for a bit.
Those patterns do stand out.
And without quoting...voicing an opinion and bullying falls in the same approach? ...really
Either snowing or out of oatmeal K?
Neither, but made my first chuckle of the morning!
Actually, 2-4 inches predicted for tonight and tomorrow, but I'm bugging out by plane Saturday to Colorado Springs - son just bought his first home - need to see 'The Ponderosa.'
As for that comment of mine 'you didn't quote,' five years ago, opinions were just opinions. Now, the media taints and interlocks them with accusations of bullying at every turn. I didn't create this mess - I also don't play in their sandbox.
Off to the mini-mart for Oatmeal!
