Tragedy

[rad]

Hey Motodan

How are you doing? Seeing something like that can really take a toll on a person, especially when children are involved.

Conrad

 

[jcj78]

You are not looking.
- NHTSA figures show no state reaches total compliance with helmet laws.
- A Michigan study showed nearly 14% non compliance with its law..

LoL. Really? I'm just passing those helmetless riders without noticing them, just like the cops, huh?

The tone of this thread and so many helmet threads seems to imply putting on a helmet makes you impervious to head injuries. Bollox. Any mortality statistics will show helmeted riders still die, but at a lower rate than non helmeted riders. What is a helmet? Full face? Open Face? Puding bowl?

We already covered this on this thread. Any of the above is better than nothing. You should work on your ability to interpret people's tone, because no one here is "imply(ing) putting on a helmet makes you impervious to head injuries". Stop making things up.

I wear a full face and support all riders wear helmets and gear when riding. I support BMW MOA safety training. I just think sending the club on a helmet law quest is a fools errrand.

You can legislate use. You can not legislate stupidity.

Works for seatbelts. Reduced fatalities, almost everywhere, because you don't have to regulate stupidity, just safety equipment use, and lives are saved.

 

[jcj78]

????

Why would single parent pregnancies not be legal?

Regards, Rod.

Because when small government types go looking for something to regulate, "somebody else's uterus" is usually one of the first places that they cast their male WASP gaze.

 

[jcj78]

The federal government has wrested too much power away from the individual states already which is why it is now near impossible to shelter society from carrying the burden of those that make unwise choices.

Seems to me many of those that make unwise choices expect the federal government to carry the burden for them, through the pockets of the taxpayer of course.

Seems to me that the taxpayer saves a bundle by having those safety nets in place. If my kids were hungry, for instance, you'd have to hire lots and lots more police to keep you safe from me, because my kids ain't gonna go hungry, if you've got something that they could eat. If I have to do you harm to get it, that's no problem for me. But my kids are gonna eat. If I can earn that food honestly, great. If I can't, they are still gonna eat. Everything else comes second.

I figure most folks are just like me, and I'd rather we have a mechanism to feed hungry kids before their parents are forced to gunplay. But that's just me.

That's why our society has decided that kids and old people won't go hungry or without medical care. Its for the benefit and safety of us all.

 

[jcj78]

Lane splitting is a lot like the wearing of a helmet or not wearing a helmet, the law is there to either follow it or not, you take your own chances and if you are foolish enough to do either one even though you have the law on your side then as I said go for it and enjoy yourself but if you hurt yourself through the actions of others that you do not have control over as you drive down the road you are responsible ultimately just because you got out of bed in the morning ....... This is my opinion like it or not !

It is a lot like lane splitting. The people who oppose helmet laws, and the people who continually denounce lane splitting have something in common:

Neither understands basic mathematics.

Glad we could clear that up.

 

[mikegalbicka]

I figure most folks are just like me

Probably most of the ones you know and associate with are like you. But that is a pretty wide net you cast and I have my doubts. In the crowd I run with we are going to find a job no matter what and feed our kids without gun play. We also aren't going to have kids until we are relatively sure we have taken the necessary steps to feed them first. I respect your opinion in the matter though.

 

[jcj78]

Probably most of the ones you know and associate with are like you. But that is a pretty wide net you cast and I have my doubts. In the crowd I run with we are going to find a job no matter what and feed our kids without gun play. We also aren't going to have kids until we are relatively sure we have taken the necessary steps to feed them first. I respect your opinion in the matter though.

What you say may be true. I'm a fifth generation farmer, and we don't shirk from work. My daddy bought me a new '92 GN125 for my 14th birthday so I could get to the field or the airport after school without him having to quit and come get me. Sometimes that work involves bloodletting, and that just goes with the job. Most of the people I know are like me, and can smack a La Rue at 600 yards, and walk hard all day in full kit, which they keep on standby. Anyway, I guess we know who's kids'll eat when push comes to shove.
Sometimes kids come along without being planned. My old lady is a nurse, and was on oral contraceptives (97% reliable) when she got knocked up with my boy. We understand medicine, and science, and still it happened. We discussed our options and decided that we COULD raise a child and give him a home that could produce a productive citizen. Not everyone has this luxury. It doesn't behoove anyone to pretend that they do.

OTHER PEOPLE'S REPRODUCTIVE ORGANS ARE NOT YOUR BUSINESS. MIND YOUR BUSINESS. Nobody is asking.

That's why our society has decided that kids and old people won't go hungry or without medical care. Its for the benefit and safety of us all.

 

[mikegalbicka]

What you say may be true. I'm a fifth generation farmer, and we don't shirk from work. Sometimes that work involves bloodletting, and that just goes with the job. Anyway, I guess we know who's kids'll eat when push comes to shove.

You wouldn't have to push, shove or shoot me to get my food. I would willingly give it to you if I had it and you didn't. Not because the government made me but because it is the right thing to do. You ever need help just let me know.

 

[jcj78]

You wouldn't have to push, shove or shoot me to get my food. I would willingly give it to you if I had it and you didn't. Not because the government made me but because it is the right thing to do. You ever need help just let me know.

Ditto, brother. As long as my kids aren't crying because they are hungry, my table is your table. And if your kids are hungry too, I got a spare rifle and armor if you know where we can go get something to eat.
But since none of us is hungry, there's not much reason to whine when the feds coordinate making sure that kids get fed and folks can go to the doctor when they get sick.
Its not an infringement on anyone's rights, or punitive action against someone's success.

With a little imagination, this becomes relevant to the helmet law discussion, I'm pretty sure.

 

[mikegalbicka]

With a little imagination, this becomes relevant to the helmet law discussion, I'm pretty sure.

Love your sense of humor. And that is what can help offset such a tragedy, which is what this thread was about a long time ago. Over and out.

 

[8ninety8]

HANS device thing-a-ma-jig

At a local club meeting last month a helmet rep demonstrated a kinda Hans type harness thingee which went around yer neck/helmet to keep yer head from snapping around and busting yer neck if in an accident.

Most gave it a try and left it up to each for its use. Quite pricey but would likely stop a lot more injuries. Just think where this safety thing could go? Awhile back a western Provence in Canada was experimenting with volunteers mounting an active vehicle recording system on board bikes which could be downloaded and checked in case of accident, but also just plain downloaded. Don't know what came of the exercise, would be interesting to find out.

Letter in the mail comes in from the DMV motorcycling division, "dear sir, we've got you at 110mph out on the slab, please pay enclosed fine, $30 grand, have a nice day, for your own safety, yers truly, LEO."

Think if we tried the entire motorcycling activity could really be made very very safe, incredibly safe. Of course a helmet would be the starting point, next the dept. of motorcycling safety, and so on.

I think all new cages have an active info system. Could be wrong, whatever, cheers.

 

[jcj78]

You have your point ,I don't go for your math thingy ,I try to go by common sense which is not common and I am for your freedom to do as you choose math or not, so you miss my point also. Foolishness is still foolishness .I'll survive as will you too.

lol. freedumb certainly trumps math.

You may make virtue of your dereliction all you like, sir, for what its worth.

 

[jeffkruger]

Ditto, brother. As long as my kids aren't crying because they are hungry, my table is your table. And if your kids are hungry too, I got a spare rifle and armor if you know where we can go get something to eat.
But since none of us is hungry, there's not much reason to whine when the feds coordinate making sure that kids get fed and folks can go to the doctor when they get sick.
Its not an infringement on anyone's rights, or punitive action against someone's success.

With a little imagination, this becomes relevant to the helmet law discussion, I'm pretty sure.

I disagree that making sure folks can go to the doctor isn't an infringement on anyone's rights or punitive actions against their success. My family had the same health insurance for 16+ years. Both of our kids were born under it. It was a health savings account type of plan and we paid for out of pocket expenses with money from the HSA. As happened to many people, our policy was cancelled because it didn't meet the Obamacare criteria. Our new policy, which restricts us to a network (our other plan didn't) and isn't nearly as good of coverage, started out costing us a bit more than 4x what our old policy did. That was the first year. After the first year it went up more than our previous policy had in 16+ years.

When we first found out our old policy would be cancelled my wife called the state exchange to find out what our options were. She was told to not worry, because "everyone" gets a subsidy. My wife told her that she had already done enough reading to know we didn't qualify for any type of subsidy. The lady ended up telling my wife she was the first one she had helped that didn't qualify for any type of subsidy. That says something. Nothing is free and someone is paying for it. We didn't know we had a choice to not go through the state exchange because we didn't get any type of subsidy, so we set up our new insurance through the exchange. My daughter ended up with two fractures in her back from playing volleyball. We got pre-authorization and went through all of the steps. A couple weeks before the surgery we get a call from the doctors office saying they were doing a final authorization and were told our insurance was cancelled. My wife checked and all premiums had been drafted from our account. She called the state exchange and was told that we, along with thousands of others, were showing up as cancelled due to a computer glitch. My wife asked that someone contact the doctors office and explain that to them and was told they don't have anyone that can do that. She asked if there was someone that the doctors office could call for an explanation and she was told no. My wife called the insurance company directly and was asked why we were through the state since we received no subsidy. My wife explained we didn't know there was another option, and right there on the phone she got my family set up directly with the insurance company directly and someone from the company called the doctors office within minutes. Government involvement doesn't typically make things better.

As of right now we are paying about 6x what we paid for our old policy with better coverage. How many of the people that we are paying to help subsidize previously chose to not have health insurance because they wanted to lease new sport utility vehicles every two years and spend their money in other ways instead? How many of them made different (and in our minds, bad) choices and didn't have health insurance coverage because of it? We have no problem with safety nets for those that genuinely need them. In our society of entitlements and cradle to grave government care I can tell you that those of us that are paying for it are getting more than sick and tired of it. The government can't give anyone anything that it didn't first take from someone else. There is no free ride. At the state level people often talk about it being "federal money", and at the county level they talk about it being "state money", etc. In the end it doesn't matter, it is money taken from a citizen somewhere. Successful people ARE being punished for their success. More and more citizens are getting some type of aid from the government. More and more people view the governments role as providing cradle to grave care for everyone.

Before graduating from high school every student should know that the government can't give anyone anything it doesn't take from someone else first. What happens when the job creators and successful are punished to the point that it's not worth it for them any more? What is a recovery like if they go away or fold up in record numbers?

 

[jcj78]

I disagree that making sure folks can go to the doctor isn't an infringement on anyone's rights or punitive actions against their success.

I've been a small business owner since 1999, three years after I graduated high school, and a two years after I lost my academic scholarship because I chased girls and drank beer and shot backyard archery tournaments (that's how I paid my rent in college*) till all hours of the night. Now I own stakes in two small businesses, and remain a FDR Democrat.
I'd be happy to debate economic theory with you in a more appropriate venue. Feel free to PM me.

All due respect, Jeff.

*edit: The backyard archery tournaments are how I paid my rent. i'm pretty sure the statute of limitations is up, . The girls chasing and beer drinking never did make black ink.

 

[Ponch1]

I disagree that making sure folks can go to the doctor isn't an infringement on anyone's rights or punitive actions against their success. My family had the same health insurance for 16+ years. Both of our kids were born under it. It was a health savings account type of plan and we paid for out of pocket expenses with money from the HSA. As happened to many people, our policy was cancelled because it didn't meet the Obamacare criteria. Our new policy, which restricts us to a network (our other plan didn't) and isn't nearly as good of coverage, started out costing us a bit more than 4x what our old policy did. That was the first year. After the first year it went up more than our previous policy had in 16+ years.

When we first found out our old policy would be cancelled my wife called the state exchange to find out what our options were. She was told to not worry, because "everyone" gets a subsidy. My wife told her that she had already done enough reading to know we didn't qualify for any type of subsidy. The lady ended up telling my wife she was the first one she had helped that didn't qualify for any type of subsidy. That says something. Nothing is free and someone is paying for it. We didn't know we had a choice to not go through the state exchange because we didn't get any type of subsidy, so we set up our new insurance through the exchange. My daughter ended up with two fractures in her back from playing volleyball. We got pre-authorization and went through all of the steps. A couple weeks before the surgery we get a call from the doctors office saying they were doing a final authorization and were told our insurance was cancelled. My wife checked and all premiums had been drafted from our account. She called the state exchange and was told that we, along with thousands of others, were showing up as cancelled due to a computer glitch. My wife asked that someone contact the doctors office and explain that to them and was told they don't have anyone that can do that. She asked if there was someone that the doctors office could call for an explanation and she was told no. My wife called the insurance company directly and was asked why we were through the state since we received no subsidy. My wife explained we didn't know there was another option, and right there on the phone she got my family set up directly with the insurance company directly and someone from the company called the doctors office within minutes. Government involvement doesn't typically make things better.

As of right now we are paying about 6x what we paid for our old policy with better coverage. How many of the people that we are paying to help subsidize previously chose to not have health insurance because they wanted to lease new sport utility vehicles every two years and spend their money in other ways instead? How many of them made different (and in our minds, bad) choices and didn't have health insurance coverage because of it? We have no problem with safety nets for those that genuinely need them. In our society of entitlements and cradle to grave government care I can tell you that those of us that are paying for it are getting more than sick and tired of it. The government can't give anyone anything that it didn't first take from someone else. There is no free ride. At the state level people often talk about it being "federal money", and at the county level they talk about it being "state money", etc. In the end it doesn't matter, it is money taken from a citizen somewhere. Successful people ARE being punished for their success. More and more citizens are getting some type of aid from the government. More and more people view the governments role as providing cradle to grave care for everyone.

Before graduating from high school every student should know that the government can't give anyone anything it doesn't take from someone else first. What happens when the job creators and successful are punished to the point that it's not worth it for them any more? What is a recovery like if they go away or fold up in record numbers?

Not to mention that a lot of service jobs went to a 29 hour or less work week to circumvent the mandates.

 

[Ponch1]

I've been a small business owner since 1999, three years after I graduated high school, and a two years after I lost my academic scholarship because I chased and drank beer and shot backyard archery tournaments (that's how I paid my rent in college*) till all hours of the night. Now I own stakes in two small businesses, and remain a FDR Democrat.
I'd be happy to debate economic theory with you in a more appropriate venue. Feel free to PM me.

All due respect, Jeff.

*edit: The backyard archery tournaments are how I paid my rent. i'm pretty sure the statute of limitations is up, . The pussy chasing and beer drinking never did make black ink.

Isn't FDR the president that put Japanese American citizens in prison camps?

 

[jcj78]

Isn't FDR the president that put Japanese American citizens in prison camps?

Yes. And he called Stalin "Uncle Joe". Just run ask Ann Coulter.

I'd be happy to debate economic theory with you in a more appropriate venue. Feel free to PM me.

All due respect.

 

[Ponch1]

Yes. And he called Stalin "Uncle Joe". Just run ask Ann Coulter.

All due respect.

Didn't she play the scarecrow in the wizard of oz?

 

[omega man]

Hey guys- we have women reading this, we are not around a campfire.I need you guys to do an edit- even the quoted material.
Thanks.
OM

 

[jcj78]

Didn't she play the scarecrow in the wizard of oz?

No. I know that even though I wasn't yet a teenager when the 50th Anniversary Edition came out.

Hey guys- we have women reading this, we are not around a campfire.I need you guys to do an edit- even the quoted material.
Thanks.
OM

I edited my post, but ftr, its kind of disingenous to pretend like you're protecting "women's" delicate sensibilities if its really your own. just sayin.