-
Welcome, Guest! We hope you enjoy the excellent technical knowledge, event information and discussions that the BMW MOA forum provides. Some forum content will be hidden from you if you remain logged out. If you want to view all content, please click the 'Log in' button above and enter your BMW MOA username and password. If you are not an MOA member, why not take the time to join the club, so you can enjoy posting on the forum, the BMW Owners News magazine, and all of the discounts and benefits the BMW MOA offers?
Stupidity & Smiling
- Thread starter Pat Carol
- Start date
RichardCook
New member
Ride away
I am trying to learn how to ride away from potential interactions like these. In my MSF course they taught us about a space "cushion" that you are supposed to keep between you and other traffic and I found myself using that while riding over the weekend. It's interesting to me that the highways often have bunches of vehicles together with empty space in between them...almost a herd sort of phenomenon. I have tried to get into the spaces in between and stay there. On US 45 in Wisconsin Sunday I had a good 1000 feet between me and the nearest car for much of the trip. I also found that access roads and intersections are incredibly hazardous because of the transition from controlled-access / one-way travel to a more complicated traffic pattern.
OTOH there was absolutely no traffic around on Saturday when I managed to ride off the edge of the road and into an 8' deep irrigation ditch. It was a beautiful day and I was captivated by the sun on the fields when I failed to negotiate a low speed turn and slid on the left side of teh bike down into the ditch. Completely trashed my fairing & Aeroflow screen, broke my shift lever, and twisted the entire clutch handle mounting mechanism about 30 degrees. Somewhat surprisingly the bike was still ride-worthy and I was uninjured...I guess that the grass stains on the shoulders of the Roadcrafter are some sort of badge of honor for that wonderful suit. Maybe the full suit with added spine , shoulder, and elbow armor, hip padding, Oxtar boots, and Schuberth C2 had something to do with my suffering narry a scratch? (Please don't mention it to my wife...she thinks the grass stains are from taking a breather, which is only a slight distortion.)
There was almost not traffic on State Hwy 52 but family passing in an SUV stopped to help me. The woman, who was driving, was an EMT and she checked me out. Her husband was a big fellow who helped me push the bike out of the ditch, cutting his hand in the process. She told me that I was like all the other motorcycle guys she has scraped off the road: "They always ask about their bike. 'Hows my bike?' they say and never mind about my broken leg." I asked her if they ever said anything else. "Yup," said replied, "Don't cut my leathers, please, they cost me a fortune."
Nice people. I'm not sure but I think they were driving an Excursion.
I recently bought the Hurt report and have been working my way through it. It's old but really quite interesting reading. Well worth the price even though the data is 20 years old. Trying to figure out how to avoid becoming a statistic in that sort of report.
Richard "looking for a 1987 K100RS fairing" Cook
I am trying to learn how to ride away from potential interactions like these. In my MSF course they taught us about a space "cushion" that you are supposed to keep between you and other traffic and I found myself using that while riding over the weekend. It's interesting to me that the highways often have bunches of vehicles together with empty space in between them...almost a herd sort of phenomenon. I have tried to get into the spaces in between and stay there. On US 45 in Wisconsin Sunday I had a good 1000 feet between me and the nearest car for much of the trip. I also found that access roads and intersections are incredibly hazardous because of the transition from controlled-access / one-way travel to a more complicated traffic pattern.
OTOH there was absolutely no traffic around on Saturday when I managed to ride off the edge of the road and into an 8' deep irrigation ditch. It was a beautiful day and I was captivated by the sun on the fields when I failed to negotiate a low speed turn and slid on the left side of teh bike down into the ditch. Completely trashed my fairing & Aeroflow screen, broke my shift lever, and twisted the entire clutch handle mounting mechanism about 30 degrees. Somewhat surprisingly the bike was still ride-worthy and I was uninjured...I guess that the grass stains on the shoulders of the Roadcrafter are some sort of badge of honor for that wonderful suit. Maybe the full suit with added spine , shoulder, and elbow armor, hip padding, Oxtar boots, and Schuberth C2 had something to do with my suffering narry a scratch? (Please don't mention it to my wife...she thinks the grass stains are from taking a breather, which is only a slight distortion.)
There was almost not traffic on State Hwy 52 but family passing in an SUV stopped to help me. The woman, who was driving, was an EMT and she checked me out. Her husband was a big fellow who helped me push the bike out of the ditch, cutting his hand in the process. She told me that I was like all the other motorcycle guys she has scraped off the road: "They always ask about their bike. 'Hows my bike?' they say and never mind about my broken leg." I asked her if they ever said anything else. "Yup," said replied, "Don't cut my leathers, please, they cost me a fortune."
Nice people. I'm not sure but I think they were driving an Excursion.
I recently bought the Hurt report and have been working my way through it. It's old but really quite interesting reading. Well worth the price even though the data is 20 years old. Trying to figure out how to avoid becoming a statistic in that sort of report.
Richard "looking for a 1987 K100RS fairing" Cook
B
belquar
Guest
I always try and remember that they weigh more than me. I had a near miss just the other day. Lots of seniors around here. Many retirement villages. SCARY. Anyway...they run shuttles to the grocery store and what not for the folks who are sane and realize that with their limited mobility, significantly impaired reaction time, poor vision and hearing, is reason enough to ride the bus. Only problem is....the bus is usually operated by the member of the community who still thinks he has it all together.
They don't believe much in left turn lanes at lights here in Jersey. Rather than give delineated traffic control they just make wide shoulders so everyone passes on the right. Very normal here. They also don't like to put up multi-functional signals...you know...the ones with the arrows so that folks making lefts can do so with a light rather than sit and yield and try and find a hole to shoot through. So the shoulder ends up as a free for all for people going straight or turning right. An elder bus the other day had one vehicle in front of it. Turning left. I am probably 1500 ft behind the bus. Light goes red. Truck remains with signal flashing to turn left. Bus maintains position and slows almost completely to a stop. I am turning right and the distance is closing but I have my brake covered, and am downshifting to get ready for my turn. I am on the shoulder and just as I am about to pass the rear bumper of the now very slow moving bus he decides to start coming to the right so he can go around the truck when the light turns green. No signal, nothing. He saw me at the last minute as I hit the gas hard and he hit the brakes. It was very clearly a situation of him moving before looking. Scared the crap out of me. I made it by and went on home.
It is situations like that all over around here. Going down the main drags it isn't so bad but at the intersections it is freaky. People come flying up on the right and a left turner is making the turn that they thought was safe and wham. They get a face full of grill and the person who was passing on the shoulder thinks the left turner is wrong.
They don't believe much in left turn lanes at lights here in Jersey. Rather than give delineated traffic control they just make wide shoulders so everyone passes on the right. Very normal here. They also don't like to put up multi-functional signals...you know...the ones with the arrows so that folks making lefts can do so with a light rather than sit and yield and try and find a hole to shoot through. So the shoulder ends up as a free for all for people going straight or turning right. An elder bus the other day had one vehicle in front of it. Turning left. I am probably 1500 ft behind the bus. Light goes red. Truck remains with signal flashing to turn left. Bus maintains position and slows almost completely to a stop. I am turning right and the distance is closing but I have my brake covered, and am downshifting to get ready for my turn. I am on the shoulder and just as I am about to pass the rear bumper of the now very slow moving bus he decides to start coming to the right so he can go around the truck when the light turns green. No signal, nothing. He saw me at the last minute as I hit the gas hard and he hit the brakes. It was very clearly a situation of him moving before looking. Scared the crap out of me. I made it by and went on home.
It is situations like that all over around here. Going down the main drags it isn't so bad but at the intersections it is freaky. People come flying up on the right and a left turner is making the turn that they thought was safe and wham. They get a face full of grill and the person who was passing on the shoulder thinks the left turner is wrong.
dancogan
New member
I especially believe in what RichardCook said-try to keep as big a margin of safety around you as you can. Not always possible, especially in heavy traffic areas, but worth trying.
I've been riding for just a bit over 2 years now, enjoying it, and having fun. This is where I think my greatest danger lies. I'm afraid I'll be so relaxed, so zoned in on the "fun" that I'll get complacent. Concentration is key. I'm constantly reminding myself not to ride the bike the same way I drive a car, be much more defensive, increase following distances, and keep scanning for hazards and escape routes.
And I read all of Dave Hough's posts-they ring true.
I've been riding for just a bit over 2 years now, enjoying it, and having fun. This is where I think my greatest danger lies. I'm afraid I'll be so relaxed, so zoned in on the "fun" that I'll get complacent. Concentration is key. I'm constantly reminding myself not to ride the bike the same way I drive a car, be much more defensive, increase following distances, and keep scanning for hazards and escape routes.
And I read all of Dave Hough's posts-they ring true.
MOTORMAN
Retired and proud of it
My experiances have taught me that the average driver loses about 50% of their IQ the moment the door shuts and their hands hit the steering wheel when they get in. Add a cell phone or alcohol and it drops at least another 50% of the remaining IQ.
Some motorcyclists are capable of the same thing.
Some motorcyclists are capable of the same thing.
U
USERNAME
Guest
dancogan said:
space = time.
C
Crow18
Guest
username said:
space = time.
time = money.
My $.02
Add my last 'Oh sh*t' experience.
Traveling down a four lane city street. I'm in the right lane along side a Ford SUV. Lady driving decides she needs my lane much more than I do. Lucky for me the verge/cub was wide enough for me to slide over and then back behind her.
At the light I pull up along her right door, flip up my face-shield and ask her to roll down her window. While she is still talking on her cell phone, I ask her why she ran me off the road. Her answer! "Well, I didn't see you!" In a tone right out of hell.
I tried so hard to explain to her the proper use of turn signals and mirrors and got the same answer. I promptly turned her right mirror towards the ground explaining she didn't need it anyway.
Add my last 'Oh sh*t' experience.
Traveling down a four lane city street. I'm in the right lane along side a Ford SUV. Lady driving decides she needs my lane much more than I do. Lucky for me the verge/cub was wide enough for me to slide over and then back behind her.
At the light I pull up along her right door, flip up my face-shield and ask her to roll down her window. While she is still talking on her cell phone, I ask her why she ran me off the road. Her answer! "Well, I didn't see you!" In a tone right out of hell.
I tried so hard to explain to her the proper use of turn signals and mirrors and got the same answer. I promptly turned her right mirror towards the ground explaining she didn't need it anyway.
dancogan
New member
boofer said:should there be a difference
my driving habits never change....whether in commercial truck, cage, or bike
(except when I give some dude in a motorhome a thrill)
Yes, I drive much more defensively because I feel much more at risk when I'm on the bike. A mild rear-ender when I'm in a cage likely won't do the damage to me that would happen if I'm on the bike.
BRADFORDBENN
Slowpoke & Proud of It!
Yesterday I saw one that was almost comical. A Lincoln Continental doing a U-Turn across four lanes of Traffic on I-25 in Denver. Why cause they missed their turn....
I did a nice little stoppie and got stopped in time. Yup, people don't see anything!
I did a nice little stoppie and got stopped in time. Yup, people don't see anything!
At the risk of appearing to be blatantly commercial, may I suggest the book Proficient Motorcycling, available from Barnes & Noble, www.amazon.com, wwwWhiteHorsePress.com, or tel 888 738-2665
PM is a lot easier to read than the "Hurt Report". Rumor has it that an update(second edition) is in the works with a proposed release in 2008.
Nick Ienatsch's book "Sport Riding Techniques" is also good, although focused primarily on racetrack skills.
pmdave
PM is a lot easier to read than the "Hurt Report". Rumor has it that an update(second edition) is in the works with a proposed release in 2008.
Nick Ienatsch's book "Sport Riding Techniques" is also good, although focused primarily on racetrack skills.
pmdave
pmdave said:
You mean at the risk of being blatantly helpful. I have both Proficient Motorcycling and More Proficient Moyorcycling here on my shelf and have read them cover to cover. I've also given copies to new rider friends when I've had the chance. Those books have given me a great prospective of riding and allowed me to enjoy miles on the road feeling safe and in control. Those books should be a manditory read for anyone on two wheels (not to mention side cars) as far as I'm concerned. Glad you're here to add wisdom to this forum.
A Must
When I got back into motorcycling two years ago, after a 33 year hiatis, I read every book about motorcycling that I could find. Dave's three books are the best and I make a point of reading each at least twice a year.
Thank you Dave for help keeping me safer on the roads.
When I got back into motorcycling two years ago, after a 33 year hiatis, I read every book about motorcycling that I could find. Dave's three books are the best and I make a point of reading each at least twice a year.
Thank you Dave for help keeping me safer on the roads.
bubbagazoo
I like TANG!
BradfordBenn said:
Reminds me of the day (a Tuesday to be really specific) I was going up the on-ramp onto the 417 (Queensway) in Ottawa and what do I see in front of me? Some moron's front grill. Seems he missed the exit onto the street that I was entering from so he just decided to pull a U-Turn at the on-ramp. Roadway was wide enough so I had no problem missing him (I was driving a mini-van that day).
AirForce
Ozark Limey
Situation: On I-70 coming up on KC in the #1 lane, onramp coming up. Maroon minivan in front of me and Porsche coming down the onramp so I move into the vacant left lane. Porsche driver obviously thinks "YIELD" means the freeway is clear so never a blind spot check or anything and the minivan is still right next to him. Instead of using his cars acceleration to get in front of the van, he taps the brakes, drops in behind the minvan--currently at my 1 o'clock--and then swerves into my lane...no look, signal, nothing. I got on the brakes and then just "tooted" my horn at him. Moron then takes BOTH hands off the wheel, gesturing wildly, and quite rudely, at me!! Who knows.
pmdave...excellent post. I read an article years ago that said something like 75% of cars involved in an accident with a motorcycle, the driver does not ride nor know anyone who does ride. They are out there folks, and more distracted than ever.
Space cushion, leave yourself an out, keep your eyes moving, just because they are looking at you doesn't mean the see you, cover the brake in traffic, when in doubt there is no doubt, ride like you are invisible, and keep your emotions under control. These are a few of my favorite motorcycle things.
pmdave...excellent post. I read an article years ago that said something like 75% of cars involved in an accident with a motorcycle, the driver does not ride nor know anyone who does ride. They are out there folks, and more distracted than ever.
Space cushion, leave yourself an out, keep your eyes moving, just because they are looking at you doesn't mean the see you, cover the brake in traffic, when in doubt there is no doubt, ride like you are invisible, and keep your emotions under control. These are a few of my favorite motorcycle things.
T
tdomek
Guest
So this is what the deposit on the Ural is all about 
moa84843 said:A friend in New Orleans many years ago told me never carry a gun on a motorcycle. Tank bags just will not hold enough ammo to achieve a decent level of satisfaction. Though I do not think he ever considered driving a sidecar rig, yea thatÔÇÖs the ticket!
merrittgene
2006 K1200GT, 1986 K100
Stupidity goes both ways.
I have a friend who is infamous among her friends for doing stupid things...
One day, she is piloting her CX500 with her boyfriend (also a rider) on the back and she finds that her off-ramp is closed for construction. So, she proceeds backwards down the next on-ramp, where they meet a school bus going the other way. The boyfriend was (understandably) upset and was yelling "NO" and "STOP" at her the whole way, and at some point started hitting her on the back to get her to stop. Disaster was averted through combined swerving.
In the end, she claimed to have been distracted by all his yelling and hitting, and that's why she made such a poor choice. (There's an obvious timeline issue here, but I leave that alone.)
For the record, my friend is a total sweetheart, and is otherwise intelligent...she just doesn't think things all the way through sometimes. (Or scarier yet, maybe she's smart enough to be dangerous, i.e. "watch this")
Be careful who you ride with.
bubbagazoo said:
I have a friend who is infamous among her friends for doing stupid things...
One day, she is piloting her CX500 with her boyfriend (also a rider) on the back and she finds that her off-ramp is closed for construction. So, she proceeds backwards down the next on-ramp, where they meet a school bus going the other way. The boyfriend was (understandably) upset and was yelling "NO" and "STOP" at her the whole way, and at some point started hitting her on the back to get her to stop. Disaster was averted through combined swerving.
In the end, she claimed to have been distracted by all his yelling and hitting, and that's why she made such a poor choice. (There's an obvious timeline issue here, but I leave that alone.)
For the record, my friend is a total sweetheart, and is otherwise intelligent...she just doesn't think things all the way through sometimes. (Or scarier yet, maybe she's smart enough to be dangerous, i.e. "watch this")
Be careful who you ride with.
