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Time to Change Oil? (Brands)
- Thread starter VIEJO
- Start date
greenwald
New member
alancoles
Dress for fall & avoid it
Agreed, I've used Amsoil for ages, including in my race cars and never had any problems. For any newer bikes that don't require high levels of ZDDP, any of the top brands mentioned will be perfectly good and your engine likely won't be able to tell the difference, especially if one sticks to proper change intervals (factory ones are fine) and puts fresh oil in at the end of the season. Anything more than that is merely someone obsessing over things, but should never be considered proper or desirable. Unless of course it is a Motorcycle obsession, in which case that is perfectly fine and should be encouraged. ;-)
Don't know if it's considered "blown" but a friend continued to use an oil which had depleted amounts of ZDDP in the oil for his '65 R60/2. He was unaware that the manufacturer had done that. The result was flaking of the metal from the faces of the cam followers. Bits of metal were floating around in the oil, filling up his slinger. There's no proof that the oil caused the situation but there is a known relationship between missing ZDDP and health of tappets/lifters in those old engines.
greenwald
New member
To which my response would be, "Yeah, well, you're just lucky cuz I heard of a guy who blew his engine to smithereens using that stuff."
We have finally arrived at the logical conclusion of an oil thread. I'm kinda surprised no one got called a fascist.
I move that we terminate the membership of anyone who starts an oil thread. Hang on, that seems a little harsh in light of the hilarity which usually ensues.
blacque jacque shellacque
Member
This is why airheads should be using an SG rated oil which contains higher levels of ZDDP. Castrol 20-50 Motorcycle oil is still SG rated. I have no doubt this is what happened to your buddies cam followers. The same thing happened to my 84 R80RT. In my case the cam followers pitted. Fortunately the cams were not damaged. The engine did have 189K miles on it when this happened though.
alancoles
Dress for fall & avoid it
Marty, I think most oil threads are to some extent a joke, and I appreciate your tongue-in-cheek humour.
Other have also expressed frustration with these threads, and I completely understand that, however, I do think these can definitely be legitimate questions from someone who hasn't had exposure to this stuff for very long and/or who is having trouble sifting through all the garbage oil-threads that exist on the internet. Like others, I often get frustrated trying to sift through the largest repository of mis-information known to mankind.
The biggest problem with any, and virtually all, oil threads is that too few of the participants have any clue whatsoever about the differences between causation and correlation, and are actually capable of "Critical Thinking" let alone know what it is. The internet is an ideal breeding ground for people with little to no actual knowledge or understanding of even the most basic principals of cause and effect to pontificate (woops I may be pontificating here), and spread misinformation.
What is known is that for some specific applications (wet-clutch, flat-tappets, etc., etc.) there are good and bad oils and good and bad oil weights. Where the problems comes in is that many of the oil-thread participants have not spent the significant time and effort required to educate themselves by digesting good, science-based research and properly understood and digested it. Everyone believes they are, or wants to be seen to be, an expert, but few are, myself included.
All too often the actual situations being discussed aren't specific enough to produce good results and then you have those who take a good valid point and extrapolate it into another discussion or area where it is not appropriate and therefore inaccurate at best and completely wrong at worst, but they don't have sufficient knowledge on the subject to realize that. Hence, garbage in garbage out.
jad01
New member
This is one reason I think Kurt's oil analysis data is so helpful. He had a variety of common MC oils analyzed for ZDDP content, viscosity, and total base number so that we could compare the data and select oil for our bikes knowledgeably. Neat stuff. Check it out here:
March 2013 ON: www.bmwmoa.org/default.asp?page=Owners_News_Index
or here (results start on p6, post 83):
http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?63581-Oil-Analysis-Update/page6
Cheers to Kurt for his efforts for our MOA members
Yes, Spectro was the supplier of BMW oil until 2015. At the Salem OR. rally I spoke with the rep for Spectro , we had a very good talk. I do not know who makes it now.
Castrol is the supplier for BMW's once again.
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 8 years and 35000 miles in my 190HP ZX14 and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 6 years and ?? miles in my 160HP GSXR 750 race bike (usually at or near redline for 20 minutes each track session 6-7 sessions per day) and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 5 years and 5000 miles in my wife's EX500 (HP? not so much) and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
Using BMW oil for now in my GS just due to warranty paranoia.
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 6 years and ?? miles in my 160HP GSXR 750 race bike (usually at or near redline for 20 minutes each track session 6-7 sessions per day) and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 5 years and 5000 miles in my wife's EX500 (HP? not so much) and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
Using BMW oil for now in my GS just due to warranty paranoia.
PGlaves
#13338
Do these bikes have flat tappet cam followers or roller followers? Curious
jeffkruger
New member
In the real world you hear of VERY few failures attributed to the oil used. As has been mentioned, time and time again, ZDDP has been shown to be an issue for older, flat tappet motors. Use an oil that meets the spec's of the motor and change it at recommended interval, or sooner. I am a believer in having oil analysis done periodically.
That being said, I am the CEO of a decent sized company, and a fleet owner, in addition to more than a few motorcycles, quad's, boats, etc. I have pretty much switched to Amsoil products for everything. Previous oil analysis showed that whatever we were using was working well, and that has been continued and slightly improved on with the use of Amsoil products. I believe in their products (though I think any of the major oil's would be great too), and as much as I enjoy a good oil thread (tongue in cheek), I like not having to debate what I'm using or doing additional research or shopping. Amsoil offers a range of products that work well in my stuff, old and new. The ease of one stop/source shopping.
That being said, I am the CEO of a decent sized company, and a fleet owner, in addition to more than a few motorcycles, quad's, boats, etc. I have pretty much switched to Amsoil products for everything. Previous oil analysis showed that whatever we were using was working well, and that has been continued and slightly improved on with the use of Amsoil products. I believe in their products (though I think any of the major oil's would be great too), and as much as I enjoy a good oil thread (tongue in cheek), I like not having to debate what I'm using or doing additional research or shopping. Amsoil offers a range of products that work well in my stuff, old and new. The ease of one stop/source shopping.
Flat cam followers; all bikes.
I forgot...
I've used Mobil 1 15w-50 CAR OIL (OMG!) for over 8 years and 38000 miles in my 1998 ZX11 (I forget the HP - 160ish I think) and I've never had a problem. Yes, a wet clutch.
I'm sure I used car oil in my 1982 Yamaha Seca 750 as well as all my dirt bikes over the years. Just too long ago to remember but knowing my finances back then, I'm sure it was the cheapest oil I could find.
