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2005, R1200RT, Clunky shift?
- Thread starter Spinakr
- Start date
roborider
God? What god?
Of course there could be a problem, but if your clunk is mainly 1st to 2d, and not so much in other gears, then it is really the character of that transmission. An IPOD or earplugs helps a lot!
Also, shifting to 1st from second is a very clunky shift. I tend to stay in second even if there is a bit of lugging around 2000 RPM. I shift to 1st after or very near a complete stop.
My guess is all is fine.
Also, shifting to 1st from second is a very clunky shift. I tend to stay in second even if there is a bit of lugging around 2000 RPM. I shift to 1st after or very near a complete stop.
My guess is all is fine.
classicvw
Active member
On my 2011 RT going into 2nd or 3rd many times will sound a 'clunk'. Going into 4th is very smooth, and shifting into 5th is so smooth I can't believe it actually shifted. My 1200CLC, which also has a 6 speed trans, also clunked similarly. Probably just that particular transmission's quirks like RoboRider stated. Or, I'm wondering if it's OUR shifting style....who knows? Nothing to worry about, IMO also.
Theo
Touring Panpsychist
For your upshifts, try pre-loading the shifter before the upshift. By this, I mean move the shifter up but stop just shy of the upshift position. Then, pull in the clutch and finish the upshift. I have absolutely no idea why it helps (smarter folks can explain) but it works on my 09 RT.
I have found downshifts to first to be unavoidably clunky. I have found it helps a bit to wait until you are almost stopped before engaging first. Again, I have absolutely no idea why it helps and trust that smarter folks will explain.
I have found downshifts to first to be unavoidably clunky. I have found it helps a bit to wait until you are almost stopped before engaging first. Again, I have absolutely no idea why it helps and trust that smarter folks will explain.
Spinakr
New member
New strategy...
So, first thing I'll try is pre-loading the lever before I shift, and I think I'll up my RPM's from my 3500rpm target to 4-4500rpm's.
Second, I am getting ready to change the tranny oil and do the final drive service.
I bought the bike exactly one year ago, and have tried several times to get ANY service history on the bike. According to the documentation/Service history I have, the bike was bought in the bay area, then several years later wound up in Portland Oregon. The original dealer in Santa Cruz, CA is now out of business. The dealer I bought it from in Tigard, Oregon has been unable/unwilling to provide information, despite my emailing them multiple times with the serial number. The bike has a keyfob from European Motorsports in Eugene Oregon, and I have also emailed them a request with the make, year, model, serial #. And have been ignored.
Back in February I did however change the oil, and adjust the valves, referencing the DIY tech forum here. It sure would be nice to know what the last several years of service history was on the bike though.
So, first thing I'll try is pre-loading the lever before I shift, and I think I'll up my RPM's from my 3500rpm target to 4-4500rpm's.
Second, I am getting ready to change the tranny oil and do the final drive service.
I bought the bike exactly one year ago, and have tried several times to get ANY service history on the bike. According to the documentation/Service history I have, the bike was bought in the bay area, then several years later wound up in Portland Oregon. The original dealer in Santa Cruz, CA is now out of business. The dealer I bought it from in Tigard, Oregon has been unable/unwilling to provide information, despite my emailing them multiple times with the serial number. The bike has a keyfob from European Motorsports in Eugene Oregon, and I have also emailed them a request with the make, year, model, serial #. And have been ignored.
Back in February I did however change the oil, and adjust the valves, referencing the DIY tech forum here. It sure would be nice to know what the last several years of service history was on the bike though.
roborider
God? What god?
You can definitely up your RPMs. Shift at 5k or higher, keeping the engine running at about 4k RPM for cruising. You'll find you drop about 1000RPMs per shift. Shifting at 3500 RPM is lugging the engine. Keep the boxer up at the 4k and higher RPM.
Artiee
R1200RT
I have a 2005 RT and as RoboRider said.... it's the nature of the beast.
P
planepaul1949
Guest
Be careful of whose advice you give creedence to. There is nothing really different about a hexhead gearbox and any other, except the dry clutch. It is robust, to handle the relative power, but all it requires is proper timing of the shift, relative to riding conditions.
Any notion of using a preload to facilitate the shift should be dismissed as totally unnecessary, and potentially harmful to the gearbox. All preloading does is thrust a shift fork against its gear channel, robbing it of lubrication and causing friction generated heat. I liken it to eating a Big Mac....One won't kill you but 10,000 just might. Oh, and it doesn't help the shift, either.
The key to smooth shifting of a hexhead is to match the speed of the shift to the engine speed. Again, there is no need to use any given RPM as a shift point. I often use 3,000 RPM as a shift point in town. Very little load, and no need to use higher revs. In general, the slower the shift speed, the slower the shift, and vice versa. A light foot action will feel the gear dogs mesh to the next gear. Conversely, a heavy foot will often get you the clunk you don't want.
As an aside, I shift a little faster when the gearbox is cold, due to the rapid bleed-off of shaft speed in cool, thicker oil.
The 1st to 2nd shift is the easiest to make like butter. All you do is feel neutral for a split-second before completing the shift. All I can say is try it. 95% of my shifts are smooth as the aforementioned butter. It's all timing, period. The only time I get a clunk is if I get lazy.
And when the bike doesn't want to engage 1st from a standstill there is no need to fan the clutch. Just roll the bike back a few inches while you gently hold pressure on the shift lever (clutch pulled). It will get you smoothly into 1st 100% of the time.
I was a shop mechanic for many years, and have ridden thousands of motorcycles. I pretty much know what I'm talking about. Do what you want, for sure, but if you care about conserving the machine, try to understand what's actually going on inside.
Paul in CA
'05 R1200RT
Any notion of using a preload to facilitate the shift should be dismissed as totally unnecessary, and potentially harmful to the gearbox. All preloading does is thrust a shift fork against its gear channel, robbing it of lubrication and causing friction generated heat. I liken it to eating a Big Mac....One won't kill you but 10,000 just might. Oh, and it doesn't help the shift, either.
The key to smooth shifting of a hexhead is to match the speed of the shift to the engine speed. Again, there is no need to use any given RPM as a shift point. I often use 3,000 RPM as a shift point in town. Very little load, and no need to use higher revs. In general, the slower the shift speed, the slower the shift, and vice versa. A light foot action will feel the gear dogs mesh to the next gear. Conversely, a heavy foot will often get you the clunk you don't want.
As an aside, I shift a little faster when the gearbox is cold, due to the rapid bleed-off of shaft speed in cool, thicker oil.
The 1st to 2nd shift is the easiest to make like butter. All you do is feel neutral for a split-second before completing the shift. All I can say is try it. 95% of my shifts are smooth as the aforementioned butter. It's all timing, period. The only time I get a clunk is if I get lazy.
And when the bike doesn't want to engage 1st from a standstill there is no need to fan the clutch. Just roll the bike back a few inches while you gently hold pressure on the shift lever (clutch pulled). It will get you smoothly into 1st 100% of the time.
I was a shop mechanic for many years, and have ridden thousands of motorcycles. I pretty much know what I'm talking about. Do what you want, for sure, but if you care about conserving the machine, try to understand what's actually going on inside.
Paul in CA
'05 R1200RT
roborider
God? What god?
When I say it is the nature of the gearbox, I mean as opposed to the various Japanese bikes I own that shift with inaudible clicks and tiny throws. The BMWs I've owned from /5 up shift with a clunk. Not a problem, but shocking to someone coming from a CBR, etc.
Shifting at 5000 RPMs and up is for the engine. The engine lugs at 2000 RPM (which is about where you will be if you shift at 3000). Romp on the throttle at 2k RPM and of course you'll feel the lugging and, depending on the bike, pinging. Now, if you ride like a grandma, you can shift at 3000 RPM. But I ride hard and am trying to keep the engine in the power band where it responds most favorably. I'm not concerned about the transmission as I've never had one be a point of wear or concern.
I don't preload either. I've never found it to make much difference. My RT shifts just fine.
Shifting at 5000 RPMs and up is for the engine. The engine lugs at 2000 RPM (which is about where you will be if you shift at 3000). Romp on the throttle at 2k RPM and of course you'll feel the lugging and, depending on the bike, pinging. Now, if you ride like a grandma, you can shift at 3000 RPM. But I ride hard and am trying to keep the engine in the power band where it responds most favorably. I'm not concerned about the transmission as I've never had one be a point of wear or concern.
I don't preload either. I've never found it to make much difference. My RT shifts just fine.
My challenge is not on upshifts, but the 3 - 2 downshift. had a 2009 GS that was very clunky, the new 2012 RT I traded it for is not quite as bad, but close. I have found that if I blip the throttle then ease the clutch out as I engage 2nd it is smoother, but it is critical timing. I'm getting better at it, but still clunk most of the time. I think it is an issue of shafts not spinning to allow things to slip into place, getting some things spinning via easing the clutch out and timing it right allows the gear to ease in.
Mind you I have never had a transmission apart, and have no valid way to confirm my beliefs. Others that know how these things work are welcome to contribute their techniques to get the crash boxes to downshift smoothly. Please jump in and educate us.
Jim
Canton, OH
Mind you I have never had a transmission apart, and have no valid way to confirm my beliefs. Others that know how these things work are welcome to contribute their techniques to get the crash boxes to downshift smoothly. Please jump in and educate us.
Jim
Canton, OH
wrenchbender
New member
Double Clutch R1200RT 06
When going from 2nd to 1st try the old double clutch. As you are approaching the stop sign or light shift from second to neutral let clutch out for a split second, and as your bike is still rolling
pull clutch lever and then shift to first just like buttah!
When going from 2nd to 1st try the old double clutch. As you are approaching the stop sign or light shift from second to neutral let clutch out for a split second, and as your bike is still rolling
pull clutch lever and then shift to first just like buttah!Yep, pretty much the same thing. I rarely try to go to first except when coming to a full stop, and I ease it into gear as coming to a stop easing out the clutch a bit to get things inside the transmission spinning.
Sure wish that 3 to 2 was smoother, in much of any traffic that is where you live.
Jim
Canton, OH
Sure wish that 3 to 2 was smoother, in much of any traffic that is where you live.
Jim
Canton, OH
Atomicman52
New member
My '09 shifts into 1st easily. I almost always downshift to 1st when turning at a 90 degree intersection, 2nd is just too high and too much lugging.
I find my bike shifts smoothly and handsomely into all gears, up or down but I have never been ginger about shifting it, including to 1st on the move. The tranny shifts very positevly with a solid thunk that I rather like. I beleive if you shift into 1st with any trepidation (read ease it into 1st on the go, there lies the problem)
Bike has just over 9k in it now!
I find my bike shifts smoothly and handsomely into all gears, up or down but I have never been ginger about shifting it, including to 1st on the move. The tranny shifts very positevly with a solid thunk that I rather like. I beleive if you shift into 1st with any trepidation (read ease it into 1st on the go, there lies the problem)
Bike has just over 9k in it now!
Quality of shifting varies, my 2009 GS was horrible, my new RT is better but still is clunky downshifting from 3rd to 2nd. My buddy has a 2010 GS that shifts like buttah. Seems quality control is uneven both at BMW and their gearbox provider.
Ya pays ya money and takes yer chances!
Obviously the likes outweight the dislikes, I keep coming back for more.
Jim
Canton, OH
Ya pays ya money and takes yer chances!
Obviously the likes outweight the dislikes, I keep coming back for more.
Jim
Canton, OH
wrenchbender
New member
'06 rt
I also would like to add that I changed the transmission to Amsoil of the appropriate weight. This made a tremendous difference in shift quality for me.
I also would like to add that I changed the transmission to Amsoil of the appropriate weight. This made a tremendous difference in shift quality for me.
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