This is going to be unpopular

[steviewonder]

Zero to none ... but if part of the argument has been the logistics (how can the car club figure it out but the motorcycle club can't ???), why not try the methodology when the demand is minimal and the impact of any foul ups is kept to a minimum? It's like Gillette was custom made as a proving ground for the day pass concept.

The argument against day passes should be based on the bigger, long term concept rather than any particular location.

 

[braddog]

You won't regret it, Mr. gazoo!

I have never been to a rally of any kind. I got back to riding last year after a 20+ year layoff and joined the MOA. I don't belong to my local club. To be honest, I really like my solo riding with my wife on the pillion. As soon as I heard the 2008 Rally was going to be someplace close (relatively speaking), I began making plans to attend. Everything I have read in this thread regarding the trust and honesty factors (leaving your gear in your tent and key in your bike) make me feel real good about "camping" on site. What I am hearing about hotel room rates is making me seriously go out and buy a tent, ground sheet and appropriate sleeping bag(s). Everything I have read about the self policing of the camping area is giving me the confidence to do something I have never done before.

See you all in Wyoming.

I can relate to MANY points in your post. I came back into riding 7 years ago, after taking 19 years off. I joined the MOA almost 6 years ago right after buying my first BMW. I was aware of the MOA, since 2 of my former neighbors were members and rally rats.

I didn't have the time for rallys, but finally made it to a local one 3 years ago. No tents, my wife came along, and we stayed in a hotel. The years went by until it was announced that the national was to be in West Bend, a mere 350 miles or so from my house. I bought a tent, a new pad, and aired out the old sleeping bag. I strapped it all to my red '77 R100S, and took off.

I had an absolute blast. I met so many great people, we were truly blessed by the fantastic weather, and everything just seemed to fall into place. I had spent many nights in a tent when I was a Cub/Boy Scout leader, but it had been at least 10 years since I had slept on the ground in a tent. I can say with confidence that it won't be 10 years before I do it again. In fact, Dells Rally anyone?

I'm still not a member of any local club. I don't have any real reason, just procrastination, or lack of time, I suppose. But the bottom line is that I'm really going to try to make it to Gillette. I don't expect it to be exactly like West Bend, but I do have a lot of anticipation that only an event like this could warrant.

 

[knary]

Zero to none ... but if part of the argument has been the logistics (how can the car club figure it out but the motorcycle club can't ???), why not try the methodology when the demand is minimal and the impact of any foul ups is kept to a minimum? It's like Gillette was custom made as a proving ground for the day pass concept.

The argument against day passes should be based on the bigger, long term concept rather than any particular location.

I don't disagree, just sort of amused at the idea of thongs of interested civilians clamoring to see what's going on inside when there are dust storms to watch.

 

[BMWK1200LTRIDER]

NO Day Passes

I completely agree!

I have seen a lot of change in the past 20 years with the MOA. The rally attendence has been on the upswing. The rally planning comittee has improved on making accomadations for all in attendence.
No matter how well the MOA throws a rally, someone is going to complain. It is like that all over. Some people enjoy complaining.
I even took it upon myself to tell a rider to leave the rally because he complained about special traetment for commitee chairs and section volunteers. I had stated that he could go to the main pavillion and submit his name to the volunteer booth and get in early. He stated that he rode to the rally and that was good enough. I then asked him in a nice way to leave the rally and not come back.
Along with Sue and Brian, there are numerous people behind the scenes to make an BMWMOA International Rally the success that they are. It is far from a cake walk when working a rally. I guess if someone is not happy then I suggest that you volunteer as a commitee chair or volunteer and work for a section. Even better, if you are not happy then attend the meeting at the rally and state your complaint to the board of directors. Better yet, why don't you run for a board position or MOA president.
Personally, I am glad that there are no day passes at a national rally. That helps keep the riff-raff away. It well worth the money to be camped out with my extended family (the MOA Membership).

Take Care and Ride Safe
Pat Carol

 

[shoeman]

This topic has provided an interesting insight into the personlaities of many of the posters.

 

[REBECCAV]

.. amused at the idea of thongs of interested civilians ....

Yeah, amused.

 

[Rapid_Roy]

The thame old thong.

 

[Emoto]

To the original poster, I would say that if you can, you should try to come to a rally and stay the whole time. Get a thermarest pad and a decent sleeping bag, and check it out. Try the whole experience, and if it is still not for you, then more power to you.

My first Rally was Charleston; I have family there and stayed with them instead of at the rally, and although I enjoyed the vendors, I really didn't "get it" until Lima where I stayed on site the whole time. This opened up the possibilities significantly. I am not the most gregarious person in the world, yet I managed to make some new friends without really trying. Same at VT and same in WI. Lots of good conversations started for no particular reason, but enjoyable just the same. Lots of good music and beer that I would not have enjoyed if I had to jump back on the bike at the end of the day.

Finally, in my opinion, the rally is a party. For us. For MOA members. It is not for random tire kickers and curiosity seekers. It is not a recruitment tool. It is a 4-day party with lots of activities. For us. Is that exclusive rather than inclusive? Yes. It is not an exposition; it is our annual rally.

 

[Mar]

i think even if this rally were held in a fair ground 1 mile down the street from my house i would gladly pay the fee, camp and enjoy the company of all my friends.

+1

 

[Sue]

We go through this every year. A handful of people wish there were day passes. There are many reasons why day passes are NOT a good idea.

ONE reason is that it would be almost impossible to police. Seriously. This is a fact. We already have different colored wristbands for those who are under 21, vendors, regular attendees, etc. Adding yet another wristband (or even more, if we had one for each day) would NOT be a good idea.

TWO is that if I paid $35 to come onto the rally, it would seem unfair that some non-member off the street could get into my own club's event for less. Yeah, I have a problem with that. This is MY club event. If anyone gets in for less, it should be us, the members.

THREE - fiscal responsibility

What must be taken into account, everyone, is the bottom line. Things that must be lined up ahead of time include:

fair ground rental
electrical needs for vendors
radios
golf carts
caterers
Portable toilets
Tables
Chairs
tents
seminar spaces
video equipment
sound equipment
musical performers
pins & patches for attendees
more......​

The cost for renting all of these items will not change, but if we start letting some people in for less, we might not be able to cover these costs. The only way I can see of assuring that these expenses would be covered [if we offered day passes] would be to increase the 3-day fee, so some day-pass people could get in for less. Personally, I wouldn't like that very much either.

The national rally is a GREAT event, everyone. Consider the gate fee as supporting your club.

 

[KHyzer]

Camping

All so true. I felt safe and secure leaving my gear out and about. Nice neighbor settled in around me, they looked out for me, I for them.

Showers, nice and hot. Lines to use them between 6am and 9am. But at all other times, there were open stalls.

My only complaint was the free coffee. I know, it was free, but the line for coffee was longer then then lines for the showers.

Next year I am bringing my own coffee maker to use. I'll be shopping Aerostich and the local Bass Pro Shop for camping comfort goodies to bring next year.

Got to justify my need for a trailer behind the bike.

Camping is the only way to go. Best way to meet folks.

Karl

2003 R1200CLC
Blue, the fastest color

Ride With Pride

Everything I have read in this thread regarding the trust and honesty factors (leaving your gear in your tent and key in your bike) make me feel real good about "camping" on site. What I am hearing about hotel room rates is making me seriously go out and buy a tent, ground sheet and appropriate sleeping bag(s). Everything I have read about the self policing of the camping area is giving me the confidence to do something I have never done before.

See you all in Wyoming.

 

[ahpd1992]

Falling on deaf ears

We go through this every year. A handful of people wish there were day passes. There are many reasons why day passes are NOT a good idea.

ONE reason is that it would be almost impossible to police. Seriously. This is a fact. We already have different colored wristbands for those who are under 21, vendors, regular attendees, etc. Adding yet another wristband (or even more, if we had one for each day) would NOT be a good idea.

TWO is that if I paid $35 to come onto the rally, it would seem unfair that some non-member off the street could get into my own club's event for less. Yeah, I have a problem with that. This is MY club event. If anyone gets in for less, it should be us, the members.

THREE - fiscal responsibility

What must be taken into account, everyone, is the bottom line. Things that must be lined up ahead of time include:

fair ground rental
electrical needs for vendors
radios
golf carts
caterers
Portable toilets
Tables
Chairs
tents
seminar spaces
video equipment
sound equipment
musical performers
pins & patches for attendees
more......​

The cost for renting all of these items will not change, but if we start letting some people in for less, we might not be able to cover these costs. The only way I can see of assuring that these expenses would be covered [if we offered day passes] would be to increase the 3-day fee, so some day-pass people could get in for less. Personally, I wouldn't like that very much either.

The national rally is a GREAT event, everyone. Consider the gate fee as supporting your club.

I still am amazed at how "unpopular" my thread has become. It appears that the above response says it all, oh well it was just a suggestion that has got me labled as a non-conformist, wet t-shirt loving, beer swilling, and "not our kind of people". Good riddance, cheap skate, glad you hated it so now you wont show up at any other of the events. I guess Il stick to riding w/ the guys I already know with whom I have other things in common. It is difficult to explain to non BMW riders this attitude. What this membership should understand is that aside form HD, the most loyal brand identity is the swirling propeller of the BMW logo. You didnt like my criticism of your event, I dont care, I said in a previous post, I paid I have the right to complain. Do nothing to change things, Im sure you still will all enjoy yourselves. This was a 1st time for me, it was up to you to leave a good first impression to a potential long time attendee (member, customer). You all gave the "rally virgin" yell when I paid for the wife and I. Now that Ive had the nerve to bring in an outsiders perspective I get insulted and excuses for why things are the way the are. In addition I have yet to hear back from the rally volunteer who posted that he registered my wife and I and asked everyone to contact him off-line for details. What the heck was that all about? Ive suggested we kill this thread, but it wont die so Il keep on posting as long as there is interest

Tom

 

[beemerPhil]

I think a day pass is a great idea- for a small local rally, held near the sponsoring club's home base. It welcomes the tire-kickers and the general public, enhances enrollment and rally attendance, supports the vendors- looks like a winner all around.

But for the National, the pros are sketchy, and the cons stack up pretty fast.

Our rally is almost totally volunteer-driven; asking volunteers to sort out who should be here and who has to leave at dusk(or whatever the witching hour) on a daily basis is not ever going to work well.

What if we have another big-name entertainer? Even our regular full-fare price is already WAY cheaper than most rock-concert tickets these days- how would we possibly regulate the crowd that might show up at the gate?

The beer garden is always fun, and it's nice that we can all stumble back to our tents at the end of the night. True, a few of us go back to their hotels, but what if it was half of us going out to the parking lot to ride/drive home? Would we be as welcome in the next host town?

I was 10 miles from home at the Essex rally, and I paid the full fee without any second thoughts, and camped with my friends. It wouldn't have been the same if I went home every night.(Is anybody really still whining about $35? If you know where to get more for your money than you get at the National, I wish you'd let me in on it!)

A lot of these posts seem to suggest that attendance is a problem, like the MOA is withering away- where does that come from? The biggest rallies we've ever had are all in the last few years already, what's your goal? If you really think bigger is better, go to Sturgis next year, and lock your stuff up tight.
I don't think I really want the National to get a lot bigger- thriving is fine, but I think something would be lost. Not to mention that it's pretty hard to find a venue that can comfortably handle our current numbers!

Besides all the logical arguments against it- a big part of the party is having us all camped out together. Remember how broken up we were in Charleston, with all the splinter campsites? Lots of friends I didn't see much that year- it was a brave experiment, and it was fun,(apart from the disaster at the beer tent), but it scattered the rally pretty thin.


Nope. I'm for "keeping the riff-raff out". I thought West Bend was just about perfect, not sure I'd change a thing, except for using a different location every year so the ride stays fresh and everybody gets a turn.

Of course, ymmv- you can always chair your own rally and test the waters yourself-

 

[BOKRIJDER]

I believe that you opened a pretty good thread. It seemed there was pretty much an even split between, leave it as it is and let's think about some changes.
The thought that some enjoyed the rally appears to offend.

Motard

 

[ahpd1992]

I believe that you opened a pretty good thread. It seemed there was pretty much an even split between, leave it as it is and let's think about some changes.
The thought that some enjoyed the rally appears to offend.

Motard

Im not offended at anyones enjoyment. Im not offended at any of the comments on this thread. Im glad people enjoyed themselves, I actually liked what was there, just thought I paid too much for it. If I would've stayed and camped out I can see the value, I guess thats my point, this event is all or nothing, no inbetweens.

Tom

 

[Rapid_Roy]

Im not offended at anyones enjoyment. Im not offended at any of the comments on this thread. Im glad people enjoyed themselves, I actually liked what was there, just thought I paid too much for it. If I would've stayed and camped out I can see the value, I guess thats my point, this event is all or nothing, no inbetweens.

Tom

That was the point of others as well, with the opposite viewpoint of yours. If you want a swap meet, that is in April at Pecatonica, Il. I wouldn't go to Sturgis for 3 hours and complain that it wasn't set up for me and my needs. Well, I might go for 3 hours, but I wouldn't complain.
As I recall, the tickets for the 100th here were 85 bucks, considerably more than 35. Elton John was the main act and that seemed to piss people off, but they didn't get a discount. There were also many free events going on all over, but it is a much larger crowd
and there are many more H-D's on the road (some made it home, I'm kidding!) For that many people, that is not bad. I used to go to the Galena Rally and it also turned me off. I wouldn't compare a regional club Rally to the Nat'l however, as they are usually radically different.
So far, you seem to have the one major complaint, even if well stated and polite. Many people complain about the Dells rally because it is held at a resort. I still go and I still have fun. Some of my friends stopped going, that is their choice.

I agree that some people reacted poorly to your criticism/observation. For that, I am sorry. You did nothing to deserve it, just pointed out your opinion (which you are entitled to). When you went to Galena, did you stay? Perhaps rallies are not your thing, that is fine too. When I wave at another rider, I really don't care if they go to Rallies or not. See you on the road Tom.

 

[BOKRIJDER]

Im not offended at anyones enjoyment. Im not offended at any of the comments on this thread. Im glad people enjoyed themselves, I actually liked what was there, just thought I paid too much for it. If I would've stayed and camped out I can see the value, I guess thats my point, this event is all or nothing, no inbetweens.

Tom

Tom,

You're observation is more or less correct that the event is intended to be all or nothing. If I had paid $70, I'd probably feel the same. At the same time, I love the three day format as it is. Not because, it's the way it's always been or that's the BMW tradition, but because I truly enjoy the event.
I do hope that the basic three day closed venue is retained, but at the same time it would be a real shame it a loyal local member just getting by financially and unable to get time off work is locked out by the format.
I've thought about suggesting to the board a one day pass which would be available by advance purchase only. I doubt that few with poor motives would bother purchasing in advance. Another possibility, limit the advance purchase one day ticket to members only.

Motard

 

[Sue]

Im not offended at anyones enjoyment. Im not offended at any of the comments on this thread. Im glad people enjoyed themselves, I actually liked what was there, just thought I paid too much for it. If I would've stayed and camped out I can see the value, I guess thats my point, this event is all or nothing, no inbetweens.

Hey Tom -

No offense was intended from my side of things, and I certainly did not interpret that from yours. We simply have differing opinions. I am looking at it from the logistical point of things. You were looking at it from your viewpoint.

Hope we can meet down the road sometimes to share stories.

Sue

 

[R1100rtp]

I really didn't "get it" until Lima where I stayed on site the whole time. This opened up the possibilities significantly. I am not the most gregarious person in the world, yet I managed to make some new friends without really trying. Same at VT and same in WI. Lots of good conversations started for no particular reason, but enjoyable just the same. Lots of good music and beer that I would not have enjoyed if I had to jump back on the bike at the end of the day.

Finally, in my opinion, the rally is a party. For us. For MOA members. It is not for random tire kickers and curiosity seekers. It is not a recruitment tool. It is a 4-day party with lots of activities. For us. Is that exclusive rather than inclusive? Yes. It is not an exposition; it is our annual rally.

Nicely stated. We had something at one of the rallies posted like Burma Shave signs....(don't quote me on the verse)

Welcome to our rally,
BMW folks and guests.
You've ridden far to join us
From North, South East & West
A private, weekend party
Is really quite a task.
Day passes don't exist here,
So pleasedon't even ask!!

Beemer shave

 

[Emoto]

Im not offended at anyones enjoyment. Im not offended at any of the comments on this thread. Im glad people enjoyed themselves, I actually liked what was there, just thought I paid too much for it. If I would've stayed and camped out I can see the value, I guess thats my point, this event is all or nothing, no inbetweens.

Tom

Tom, how about this. PM me (Emoto) when advance registration opens for Wyoming if you can go. I will then buy the registration for you (not your wife, kids, etc., just you) so you can go and not be concerned about how much it costs. With the monetary issue out of the way, maybe you can have more fun? I am not an officer or board member of anything like that, just a plain member, but I would like to see you have a good time. I am serious, so let me know.

Bob