Why boxer engine now that it's liquid cooled?

[Visian]

The R80 weighed 462#'s and made 50HP. How's it feel to want?

R80 G/SPD+ … 410lbs wet, R100 sleeper motor… I have no want!

 

[oldcamper]

The R80 weighed 462#'s and made 50HP. How's it feel to want?

In many ways, I think the r80 line hit the “sweet spot” for a general use motorcycle. Big enough for the occasional cross-county tour, but light enough for routine in-town use. Fairly reliable and easy to maintain, if they had only been improved with a better charging system, FI, abs brakes, and a more robust transmission input shaft they might still sell well today. Although this is a boxer engine thread, I will mention the same might be said for the K75 line of bikes. They were good machines, too.

 

[chadhargis]

They have soul. They feel different, sound different, look different and contribute to my happiness! Low center of gravity, mine have been solid performers. Stay ahead of the maintenance.

I have never had my ass on any bike that had less soul. It was like riding a refrigerator.

I fall into this camp. BMW boxers have a soul, personality, quirkiness, whatever you want to call it. I rode my Suzuki V-Strom for 8 years and never really bonded with that bike. It was absolutely perfect. Never had a single issue. Started and ran flawlessly. So what's the problem? That's just it...there were no quirks, no oddness, no individuality, no personality. The bike just went where you pointed it. It was such a dead reliable, quiet, smooth, unengaging motorcycle...I almost quit riding figuring that maybe I just wasn't into motorcycles anymore. Then I visited my local BMW dealer and took a test ride on a R NineT and a used Triumph. OH! THIS is why I love riding. Both bikes were fun. They had life in them. That convinced me to trade the V-Strom on my R1200R.

In my own 58 years of riding, after 700k miles and 40 different motorcycles, I’m still not sure what “soul” in a bike is. They are machines, tools to get you there and back.

I understand what you are saying. If you have done that many miles, then perhaps a motorcycle is just transportation for you. But for me (to quote a Rush song), the point of a journey is not to arrive. I don't want a bike that gets me to a destination. I want a bike that IS the destination. Sitting on that seat, feeling the engine twist the bike underneath me when I rev it. Feeling the heat from the cylinders rising up. Smelling the gunk that's roasting on the headers after hitting them. The clunk of the transmission. The feel of the dry clutch. The sound of the boxer engine. It's not a machine to me. It's my friend. My buddy. My companion. It needs me and I need it. I care for it and feed it, and it puts a smile on my face and makes my heart rate go up.

No...it's not about getting me there and back. It's about enjoying the miles between here and there.

 

[cajunrider]

I understand what you are saying. If you have done that many miles, then perhaps a motorcycle is just transportation for you. But for me (to quote a Rush song), the point of a journey is not to arrive. I don't want a bike that gets me to a destination. I want a bike that IS the destination. Sitting on that seat, feeling the engine twist the bike underneath me when I rev it. Feeling the heat from the cylinders rising up. Smelling the gunk that's roasting on the headers after hitting them. The clunk of the transmission. The feel of the dry clutch. The sound of the boxer engine. It's not a machine to me. It's my friend. My buddy. My companion. It needs me and I need it. I care for it and feed it, and it puts a smile on my face and makes my heart rate go up.

No...it's not about getting me there and back. It's about enjoying the miles between here and there.

Nice explanation.

Exchange the word "soul" with "feel" and you're almost there...
- The way the bike "feels" as you ride
- The way the bike makes YOU "feel" as you ride

I too sold a V-Strom for reasons very similar to what you described. It was "TOO perfect" of a bike... just bland and boring to ride.
I enjoy the weirdness of the boxer acceleration much more, even though I don't really consider it "as good" as the V-Strom (new parallel twin V-Strom excluded).

 

[chadhargis]

I too sold a V-Strom for reasons very similar to what you described. It was "TOO perfect" of a bike... just bland and boring to ride.
I enjoy the weirdness of the boxer acceleration much more, even though I don't really consider it "as good" as the V-Strom (new parallel twin V-Strom excluded).

Spot on. Every Japanese motorcycle I've owned was less maintenance intensive and overall more reliable than any of my BMWs (excepting my current one as I've only owned it a couple of months). People say shaft drive is easier to maintain...bull crap. Spritzing a chain with lube every other ride is a lot easier, cheaper, and faster that draining the rear drive oil, disconnecting the speed sensor, rotating the rear drive down, lubing the splines, trying to line it all back up, then refilling the oil. While valve adjustments on a boxer are a piece of cake, they are required a lot more frequently. Most of my Japanese bikes required adjustment every 25,000 miles or so. Granted, they are MUCH more difficult to do. Parts are much cheaper for Japanese bikes too. Something that costs $5 for a Suzuki would be $50 for a BMW. But...doing that work yourself is enjoyable if you are like me and enjoy spinning a wrench. If you enjoy tracking your maintenance items and look forward to doing them.

There are always rainy days, too hot days, too cold days, and a couple of months of winter where I want to ride, but I can't....so I enjoy keeping the bike in top condition.

It's hard to put it in words, but European bikes seem to have something inherent to their design that make them more fun to own. Yet every Euro bike I've had was finicky, expensive to repair/maintain, had some odd quirks. But I loved them all.

I sincerely hope BMW keeps making great inline engines that pump out absurd power. But I also hope they keep the boxer. I don't need a 200hp motorcycle for the street. My bike only has 110hp and I honestly seldom use full throttle.

 

[milo]

In many ways, I think the r80 line hit the “sweet spot” for a general use motorcycle. Big enough for the occasional cross-county tour, but light enough for routine in-town use. Fairly reliable and easy to maintain, if they had only been improved with a better charging system, FI, abs brakes, and a more robust transmission input shaft they might still sell well today......

There's Guzzi's V7 and V85TT line. They're not quite as light as an R80 was but they include all the updates / improvements mentioned, plus some more.

 

[brownie0486]

There's Guzzi's V7 and V85TT line. They're not quite as light as an R80 was but they include all the updates / improvements mentioned, plus some more.

64 Moto Guzzi dealers in US. 147 BMW motorcycle dealers. It's hard enough to find a bmw shop when traveling, let alone a Guzzi shop. I'm not looking for less potential servicing dealers when traveling, but more dealers that the bike can be serviced at.

 

[oldcamper]

I fall into this camp. BMW boxers have a soul, personality, quirkiness, whatever you want to call it. I rode my Suzuki V-Strom for 8 years and never really bonded with that bike. It was absolutely perfect. Never had a single issue. Started and ran flawlessly. So what's the problem? That's just it...there were no quirks, no oddness, no individuality, no personality. The bike just went where you pointed it. It was such a dead reliable, quiet, smooth, unengaging motorcycle...I almost quit riding figuring that maybe I just wasn't into motorcycles anymore. Then I visited my local BMW dealer and took a test ride on a R NineT and a used Triumph. OH! THIS is why I love riding. Both bikes were fun. They had life in them. That convinced me to trade the V-Strom on my R1200R.



I understand what you are saying. If you have done that many miles, then perhaps a motorcycle is just transportation for you. But for me (to quote a Rush song), the point of a journey is not to arrive. I don't want a bike that gets me to a destination. I want a bike that IS the destination. Sitting on that seat, feeling the engine twist the bike underneath me when I rev it. Feeling the heat from the cylinders rising up. Smelling the gunk that's roasting on the headers after hitting them. The clunk of the transmission. The feel of the dry clutch. The sound of the boxer engine. It's not a machine to me. It's my friend. My buddy. My companion. It needs me and I need it. I care for it and feed it, and it puts a smile on my face and makes my heart rate go up.

No...it's not about getting me there and back. It's about enjoying the miles between here and there.

If it was just transportation I would take a car, bus or even a plane, but I too have always loved motorcycling as a mode of travel. I just don’t want the bike to intrude on that experience. To me, the best bikes are those that kind of “disappear” under me, and respond predictably to input. I don’t like continually fighting the machine for control, nor do I appreciate unexpected “surprises” that leave me walking to the destination. “Character” in a motorcycle may add some excitement to the ride, but it can get to be tiring after a while too.

 

[milo]

Understood, a dealer near by would be convenient but certainly isn't necessary and hasn't stopped me from owning BMW's (there's not a dealer in the entire State).
When it comes to the Guzzi's I referenced they're as simple to work on as an airhead and parts are a mouse click or phone call away.

 

[glenfiddich]

To me, the best bikes are those that kind of “disappear” under me

That's close to what I look for in a bike. With previous bikes in my 54 years of riding I sat on them. With the GSA it feels like sitting in the bike, almost as if it becomes part of me, seeming to respond to my thoughts like any other part of my body. It might not be "soul," but we've certainly bonded.

Pete

 

[rangerreece]

Soooo… a dirt bike. Excellent choice for a 16-20 year old rider.

 

[chadhargis]

That's close to what I look for in a bike. With previous bikes in my 54 years of riding I sat on them. With the GSA it feels like sitting in the bike, almost as if it becomes part of me, seeming to respond to my thoughts like any other part of my body. It might not be "soul," but we've certainly bonded.

The GS is one of the most character filled bikes in production. That's why it's so popular.

 

[skibum69]

I don't know about that, I think the new Beemers have a lot less character than the old ones.

 

[elementist]

Based on some recent threads, what some call soul or character others call a maintenance nightmare or see in different ways.

I'm not sure when we use terms like character, soul or similar we're ever talking about the same things.

Some want to interact with their machine beyond riding. Some just want to ride it. Some find the boxer noise part of the experience some find it an annoying distraction from ride. Neither is right or wrong I don't think, but highly subjective.

But ultimately we picked our bikes for a reason. So what's character to you?

Then again character seems such a bad term to describe a bike. One can have LOTS of character and be horrible for it, and my old quadruple hand well worn versys taught me.

 

[chadhargis]

So what's character to you?

It's a rawness. An almost human personality. It's hard to describe, but you know it when you feel it.

If you really wanted a "perfect" bike, that would be electric. No maintenance. No noise. No pollution. Just change brakes and tires and ride. But having ridden an electric motorcycle before, it's just not my thing. It was so sterile.

 

[brownie0486]

Character is a subjective term at best.

 

[ebell]

I’ve had bikes with character, both kinds.

Some were trustworthy and reliable “of good and sound character”, if you will.

Others were “right characters”… those were the other kind, that took my money without shame.

YMMV

 

[skibum69]

Yup 'character' is totally subjective. It's part of why I own no Japanese bikes-none of them stir any emotion in me with the sole exception being the TW200.

 

[fmdualexhaust]

Yup 'character' is totally subjective. It's part of why I own no Japanese bikes-none of them stir any emotion in me with the sole exception being the TW200.

 

[pglaves]

Character is a subjective term at best.

I have a G310GS that has "blown" two engines: one a misplaced valve keeper at 30,000 miles other a destroyed counter shaft bearing at 34,000 miles. I still like/love that bike. Pick your poison and have fun.