Talking like you would talk to grandma

[statdawg]

From the Ghost of Christmas past.

Long past ?

No our past.

Yes, we're all adults here. Or at least I hope so...

But I don't think it's a big brother issue: nor even a nanny issue. The now-defunct thread was more like a big soap bubble that, try as it might, couldn't belie the limitations of it's own surface tension. There were some great points there and some good fun, but some of the stuff, the juvenalia f'rinstance, expanded to the point of discomfort, bruised feelings and personal attacks.

Like Snoone wisely pointed out "The forum is very good at determining what is appropriate or not."

It's an interesting form of democracy.

And we all still really like each other. (Or at least I hope so...)

Many a time, I've stood around a campfire with friends and we've sparred in just such a fashion. I can imagine a participant picking up a burning stick and proclaiming, "I'll take you all on, who's next!" It's all in good fun, but in the written form, the words take on new meanings, the situation is painted in each members' mind. For some, the picture may be humorous -- for others sinister.

The rub is that our members are not accustomed to a Jo-Mama'ish thread. People take things personally, members may get hurt. I doubt that is any posters' intent but it happens.

In person communication is 55% body language, 35% voice infelction and tone, 10% words. A good deal is lost in translating campfire conversation to the forum.

The internet is a fine line to walk. Also what happens is like M1ka points out, one can not read if someone is offended.

I live in a fairly conservative area, work in a fairly conservative company, I would by no means say I am conservative. So I try to be polite when in doubt and think about the other people who might be around. Not politically correct, but polite.

The key is that I remember that what is benign to me might be offensive to others; conversely what is benign to others is offensive to me.

As far as the forum goes it is the property of a Private Club, the largest of its kind in the world. The rules and regulations are set by itself and processes have been approved by we the members. This club is like that of a private cooperation or a private school in being the rules are set to reflect its mission statement. If the workings of the MOA wanted us to wear a uniform to rallies, or raise our hands to gain permission to speak then we must comply since we accepted the rules of memberships. With that said I can say the posting guidelines are simple. Post as if your grandmother is reading this, if she swears then post as if children are looking over your shoulder ( old guidelines ). Is that as clear as little Johnny to wear a uniform to class or raise his hand to speak in turn ? Really some of us by our background being military or cooperate we had to deal with rules just like them or we couldn't afford a BMW. I get it. Does anyone else ? If you do NOT like the private charm experience go over to the public school system such as Adv Rider........but watch your lunch money, your dippled knot tie and expect your snobby BMW to be moved around in the parking lot.

 

[PGlaves]

From the Ghost of Christmas past.

Long past ?

No our past.











As far as the forum goes it is the property of a Private Club, the largest of its kind in the world. The rules and regulations are set by itself and processes have been approved by we the members. This club is like that of a private cooperation or a private school in being the rules are set to reflect its mission statement. If the workings of the MOA wanted us to wear a uniform to rallies, or raise our hands to gain permission to speak then we must comply since we accepted the rules of memberships. With that said I can say the posting guidelines are simple. Post as if your grandmother is reading this, if she swears then post as if children are looking over your shoulder ( old guidelines ). Is that as clear as little Johnny to wear a uniform to class or raise his hand to speak in turn ? Really some of us by our background being military or cooperate we had to deal with rules just like them or we couldn't afford a BMW. I get it. Does anyone else ? If you do NOT like the private charm experience go over to the public school system such as Adv Rider........but watch your lunch money, your dimpled knot tie and expect your snobby BMW to be moved around in the parking lot.

I couldn't decide if I should say, "Yeah - what he said" ;

or say, "Huh?" ;

so I guess I just won't say anything.

 

[statdawg]

At least correct my spelling its dimple not dipple.

 

[knary]

My 2 cents:
People are too sensitive about over sensitivity. They want a windmill and by doG they will find one!

Be civil, or don't. If the mods step in, don't get all bent. The stepping over a line on occasion is no big deal. Fighting tooth and nail that it is your divine privilege to be a jerk, well, that does get quite old.


cent number 3:
If it were my choice, I'd doghouse every helmet law discussion. Not because of the impending flame fest, but because they're so damn predictable and boring.

 

[akbeemer]

I like helmets.

I think the mods are swell.

Are not a great many of us grandmas (grandpas)?

 

[mika]

FWIW

I walked away from this thread to watch Monday Night Football. Great game but talk about a game full of mixed emotions for a Packer fan to watch. My normal reaction to a Bears Vikings game is along the lines of KnaryÔÇÖs 3rd cent on helmet threads. ÔÇÿOn any give SundayÔÇÖ these are two teams that I normally would ignore or would like to see both loose the game. Yet I found myself rooting for the Bears to win because of the playoff implications and rooting for Favre to work his magic one more time. In a way I got what I wanted. Favre worked his magic during regulation time and was thrilling. The Bears won in overtime and that part of the wish came true also. This outcome, for reasons not known even to me, made me think of this thread.

Technically the infamous helmet thread was never sent to the pound it was just locked up. The thread sent to the dog house followed close on it heals.

I did not follow closely or participate in the former. Helmet threads seem to always end up in boring Freedom from vs. Freedom to debates that are unsolvable to the satisfaction of even a plurality of readers and participants. The former chilled me from posting a related thread about questions the data referred to in the OP of that thread raised for me on a related motorcycle safety topic not involving helmets at all.

In this thread I am fully guilty as charged for tilting at windmills.

As pointed out in the reference to the forum guidelines the rules are spelled out for us in the guidelines. I have no real problem with dealing with and disciplining bad behavior on the forum. I donÔÇÖt always agree with the how but fully understand and support the why of the moderation teams actions and need to take action.

The windmill I am tilting at is found in the part John ÔÇôTexanRT underlined in his quote.

The goal is to improve the membership experience through increased communication, fellowship, and inclusiveness. It is a place for our community to come together.

In five plus years around here I have come to believe we are not the homogeneous group of grumpy old men that outsiders think we are. The forum improved my membership experience. During the increased communication I have read and heard a lot that I did not want too. Yet I have had the fellowship experience and can count several people I have argued with in threads among my MOA friends. The windmill is in questioning if we are inclusive and how to achieve that goal.

I like helmets.

I think the mods are swell.

Are not a great many of us grandmas (grandpas)?

I am a grandpa and still can change diapers. Maybe not as fast as before but as my daughter and my two year old grandson / pit crew members.

 

[36654]

Pardon my cynicism, but if folks don't know how to keep a civil tongue in their heads or a civil pen in their hands by the time they are old enough to be members of this Forum, then they are more than a crew of Moderators can teach.

Paul,

IMHO, you stated the issue very well. If someone is going to make an editorial comment, i.e., advocate a given position on a divisive issue, they should compose their forum posting in the same manner as they would an editorial in their local paper. Of course, in the case of a newspaper editorial, civility is, in-part, enforced by requiring the writer to identify themselves.

Are you suggesting that we consider modifying the forum rules to require members to identify themselves? The proposition does have merit.

BTW - I'm not without sin in this discussion. I've had warnings from the moderators when my some of my posting were viewed as offensive/combative. In my opinion, I thought I was deftly making a point, others held a different opinion.

Jon

 

[texanrt]

I did not follow closely or participate in the former. Helmet threads seem to always end up in boring Freedom from vs. Freedom to debates that are unsolvable to the satisfaction of even a plurality of readers and participants.

It's been an experience over the last year for me to see how topics predictably go awry -- I guess the mods knew this already.

The former chilled me from posting a related thread about questions the data referred to in the OP of that thread raised for me on a related motorcycle safety topic not involving helmets at all.

That's the unintended consequence -- when threads go bad, it actually leads to fewer postings. I usually read anything Mika posts and now I'm wondering what his comment would have been on the related safety topic.

John Huval

 

[Rapid_Roy]

Dale, the search function is your friend.
You are welcome. Stop blaming the women, wouldya?

All I can say is different rules for different audiences.

Nobody swears at grandma's house and nobody preaches around a rally campfire.

Judging by this thread, it's winter, isn't it?

C'mon, we just had Christmas, and the New Year is just around the corner (and I have 12 days off).
Let us be Merry and fill our hearts with love for our fellow human beings (and, yeah verily, that knob on the freeway too!)

 

[108625]

Grandma keeps calling me Chuck... My name's Bob.

In scrolling through this thread, I notice A LOT of quoting going on; a sure sign it's going in circles, and effectively, nowhere.

At times I let myself get caught in discussions which become debates, which is OK until they become arguments, in which case I have to remind myself what my other Grandma used to say;
"The fool usually wins the argument, because the wiser man realizes he's wasting his time."
Words to remember, though I often forget, and feel foolish afterwards.

 

[PGlaves]

Paul,

IMHO, you stated the issue very well. If someone is going to make an editorial comment, i.e., advocate a given position on a divisive issue, they should compose their forum posting in the same manner as they would an editorial in their local paper. Of course, in the case of a newspaper editorial, civility is, in-part, enforced by requiring the writer to identify themselves.

Are you suggesting that we consider modifying the forum rules to require members to identify themselves? The proposition does have merit.

BTW - I'm not without sin in this discussion. I've had warnings from the moderators when my some of my posting were viewed as offensive/combative. In my opinion, I thought I was deftly making a point, others held a different opinion.

Jon

I'm not suggesting that the volunteer forum moderators make such a change because they would be pilloried at the flaming stake. But, if I were still on the MOA Board I would make a motion that such a rule for the Forum be adopted as Board policy. We would then debate it and vote on it, and if approved it would be a rule instituted by the owner of the Forum. For that small handful of individuals being stalked, or enrolled in the witness protection program I would allow the forum administrator to assign a pseudonym on a strict case-by-case basis, monitored by the ED or Board of course. But that's just me.

 

[BUBBAZANETTI]

much of the time, i know what i WANT to type here is too sarcastic and mean spirited for this forum. it's at that time i head over to that "other" forum.

two forums, two tones of voice, it works fine for me.

but i agree with a point scott made, getting your toes stepped on here is not cause for concern.

 

[statdawg]

C'mon, we just had Christmas, and the New Year is just around the corner (and I have 12 days off).
Let us be Merry and fill our hearts with love for our fellow human beings (and, yeah verily, that knob on the freeway too!)

You wouldn't say that over on Adv Rider.

Pass the ammoe Christain soldier.

Signed

Theist

 

[Rapid_Roy]

You wouldn't say that over on Adv Rider.

Pass the ammoe Christain soldier.

Signed

Theist

Now you have done it. You didn't even have to "triple dog dare" me.

 

[Rapid_Roy]

much of the time, i know what i WANT to type here is too sarcastic and mean spirited for this forum. it's at that time i head over to that "other" forum.

two forums, two tones of voice, it works fine for me.

but i agree with a point scott made, getting your toes stepped on here is not cause for concern.

Hammertoes!

 

[bob_m]

If the worst thing to happen to me in 2009 was that I got flamed on the internet, then it would be a very good year.

On Portland's bicycle forum, which is so gently that kittens curl up there, I was called a liar and on another post accused of having "deep psycological problems"

(funny thing, that's what my grandma used to say )

Anyway have a happy new year!!

 

[Voni]

"The fool usually wins the argument, because the wiser man realizes he's wasting his time."
Words to remember, though I often forget, and feel foolish afterwards.

Grandmothers are so wise!

Voni
sMiling

 

[Klay]

Let us be Merry and fill our hearts with love for our fellow human beings (and, yeah verily, that knob on the freeway too!)

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

 

[dennisdarrow]

Originally Posted by 108625

"The fool usually wins the argument, because the wiser man realizes he's wasting his time."


Actually this is pretty much how this forum works. For me, I seldom post on here as in the past the above is totally evident. What is the worst part is that this mindset and behaviour is taken as the "norm" and is becoming the standard for this organization.

If one posts what they actually think, it seems that those with opposite viewpoints dont just discuss their thoughts; but belittle by back-handed comments, innuendo, and sarcasm. Thereby, those who really do NOT live life to argue and be rude don't post or say anything and those who live their lives by oppostion do actually run this outfit.

Originally Posted by BubbaZanetti
much of the time, i know what i WANT to type here is too sarcastic and mean spirited for this forum. it's at that time i head over to that "other" forum.

two forums, two tones of voice, it works fine for me.

but i agree with a point scott made, getting your toes stepped on here is not cause for concern.

Actually, I for one mind getting my toes stepped on by others. It is downright rude to not be considerate. It seems that some think that what ONE does for self-enjoyment/indullgence is just fine as no one but them has to breathe the same air and share the same space.

So, am I thankful that we have the moderators yes. Their task is thankless and full of having to shrug off comments by those outlined above. Thanks guys......A really good example is how this thread began by moaning about the helmet thread being deleted; but none of the moaners started another thread trying to follow the guidlines outlined by the moderators as was suggested that they do.......THANKS GUYS.........

Just my thoughts.....God bless.........Dennis

 

[redclfco]

Originally Posted by 108625

"The fool usually wins the argument, because the wiser man realizes he's wasting his time."


Actually this is pretty much how this forum works. For me, I seldom post on here as in the past the above is totally evident. What is the worst part is that this mindset and behaviour is taken as the "norm" and is becoming the standard for this organization.

If one posts what they actually think, it seems that those with opposite viewpoints dont just discuss their thoughts; but belittle by back-handed comments, innuendo, and sarcasm. Thereby, those who really do NOT live life to argue and be rude don't post or say anything and those who live their lives by oppostion do actually run this outfit.

Originally Posted by BubbaZanetti
much of the time, i know what i WANT to type here is too sarcastic and mean spirited for this forum. it's at that time i head over to that "other" forum.

two forums, two tones of voice, it works fine for me.

but i agree with a point scott made, getting your toes stepped on here is not cause for concern.

Actually, I for one mind getting my toes stepped on by others. It is downright rude to not be considerate. It seems that some think that what ONE does for self-enjoyment/indullgence is just fine as no one but them has to breathe the same air and share the same space.

So, am I thankful that we have the moderators yes. Their task is thankless and full of having to shrug off comments by those outlined above. Thanks guys......A really good example is how this thread began by moaning about the helmet thread being deleted; but none of the moaners started another thread trying to follow the guidlines outlined by the moderators as was suggested that they do.......THANKS GUYS.........

Just my thoughts.....God bless.........Dennis

Dennis,

Thanks for your thoughts on my thread... ouch! My toe!

I think you must have missed the part where I thanked the Mods for their work. the one area we agree. It's start man! I also wanted to find a way to introduce the Helmet thread without running over anyone's foot on the moderators tearm. The tolerance for threads gone bad was really, really low...

The thought behind this thread was to ask questions to the Mods; respectfully asking questions as to how they manage it all. The idea -if you -get it- was to start the helmet thread by starting this thread, about helmets...I seriously thought we all could figure that out! I guess not! Sorry about that!


-The Moaner.

PS, You say whine, I say beer...some of us say Don Julio!

aka...Dale