Mapping software advice

[Ken F]

Okay, I'm about to pull my hair out, and need some advice.

I'm trying to plot out a SS1000 for a buddy & myself this spring. I've done it using an older version of
Rand McNally Tripmaker, and came up with 1,019 miles to our destination.

Yesterday I borrowed a copy of Microsoft streets & trips ('09). Plotted the exact same course, and came up with 891 miles. That's over 10% difference!

Then I got online, and used a mapping software online, and came up with a completly different answer.

Anyone have any suggestions as to what to use that have been found to be accurate?

I don't want to get to the end and discover that we are still 100 miles short!

Thanks,

460

 

[tourunigo]

I used Streets and Trips and just added an extra 100 mile on. Did it in 19 hours so you have lots of time. If you just did 1000 miles then that extra 100 should be a piece of cake eh? Hopefully you don't run into heavy rain like I did. Also, as far as I know. there doesn't seem to be any distinction between turnpike and secondary roads. I touched a bit of 95 on mine but that was in that miserable last 75 miles in rain, traffic and 10 at night. Keep safe and enjoy! - Bob

 

[MLS2GO]

Plotting a Saddlesore

First a couple of things to remember for your first Saddlesore. You have to be able to prove easily what miles you did to the people who check your route. I'm guessing that you were not using a straight line route and some of the programs cut the corners. Cutting off corners can screw up a planned route. The checkers will assume you took the shortest point unless you prove by receipts that you didn't. The perfect route would be straight away from your destination for 1000+ miles. I always shoot for 50 miles over to be safe. Some do no, your choice. The second easier choice is to ride 500 miles out and 500 miles back on a straight line, of course getting receipts at the turn. You can use a squared off route with receipts at every turn. A rounded route in more problematical as cutting corners becomes easier. They are not doing it to be picky, they are doing it to make the certificate a true and fair test for everyone. Go to the discussion forum on the Iron Butt site, and discuss. Ira Agains and other Iron Butt officials monitor and can be very helpful.
Popular routing software can be found online. Google Maps, Mapquest and the trip planner on the HD site are very good.
Good luck on the planning and the ride.

 

[Ken F]

Thanks for the advice guys. My friend and I are coming from different directions and are going to met in the middle of Kansas then continue on to Santa Fe, NM. It will be 390 miles for me and 391 for him to our meeting point.

Thanks again for the advice! My route I had planned was a little helter-skelter (not the straightest track) in order to get it over 1000 miles near the end. Maybe I need to refigure!

460

 

[JIMSHAW]

Go Farther

The IBA used to use S&T to check your mileage on a map. I don't know what they use today. But, all IBA riders use the same technique: They pick a route that's at least 60-100 miles further than needed, as a minimum.

Modern GPSs (not odometers) are very close to perfectly accurate at measuring the mileage you've traveled. Just make sure you go farther than needed, and stop worrying about it.

What defeats most ride contenders is overplanning or underplanning. A thousand miles of any good rural road is really easy to do in a day. I've seen riders get so wrapped up in planning every detail that they build the mountain too high to climb - in their mind. Hey, do the math - 1000 miles in 24 hours is an average of just 42 miles an hour. I could do that in a local church parking lot.

Modern IBA riders consider the Bun Burner Gold to be about the right of passage, although the Saddle Sore still gets you in. The BBG is 1500 miles in 24.

I remember a buddy asking me to ride with him for a SS1000, maybe 10 years ago. He wanted to ride from Hinckley to St. Louis and back. Piece of cake, Interstate all the way. The biggest danger was dying of boredom on that road. I rode along with him, and when we were done he was a mental mess. He did it, but he didn't even bother to send in his paperwork.

Was I mad about that?

Jim
IBA 3278

 

[Ken F]

Jim Thanks. Your words of advice are much appreciated.

This is kind of a training exercise for me. LD riding really intrigues me, and my 'ol service buddy thinks that at 60 years old he's too old to do this kind of riding!
After thinking about it, he refused so I enlisted my 86 year old dad who volunteered to do it with me on his RT. That kind of shamed him into doing it! LOL

Boy, the BBG would mean you have to average 62 mph for 24 hours. That's one that you would just about have to do on interstates isn't it? It's tough to average 62 period, let alone stopping for fuel. I'll have to investigate this one for later in the summer.

Thanks again for your reply

460

 

[JIMSHAW]

Boy, the BBG would mean you have to average 62 mph for 24 hours. That's one that you would just about have to do on interstates isn't it? It's tough to average 62 period, let alone stopping for fuel. I'll have to investigate this one for later in the summer.

Average speed depends on how fast you ride [brilliant, obvious]. If you ride eastern Interstates, you'll need to bend the speed limits a little. If you ride in the West, it's not a problem.

Another advantage of Interstates is they are somewhat safer at night. Deer strikes are a lot more rare.

The ability to succeed at IBA rides seems dependent on your hard wiring. Some folks can go for well over 24 hours and remain alert and awake. Others can't. The IBA will not glue your certificate to your tombstone, so be responsible.

Also, the seasons affect your ride. In the summer, you can be clutch out at 6am and ride until 9pm without riding in darkness. Allowing 6 gas stops at 10 minutes each, that give you 13 hours of daylight at speed. That's 72 mph - no problem on western Interstates.

Most office or factory workers can do 14 hours without getting all drowsy. An 86 year old is darn lucky just to get his leg over a bike.

Just remember: if you fail at a Saddle Sore, it is most likely that your head defeated you, not the road, bike or your butt.

Jim IBA 3278

 

[Ken F]

Jim, interesting, and again thanks for your input! Why do you say that most office/factory workers are able to do 14 hrs without getting drowsy? Because they are used to doing shifts?

Another statement I wish you would clarify/expound upon if you care to:
> if you fail at a Saddle Sore, it is most likely that your head defeated you, not the road, bike or your butt.<

How does ones head defeat them?

Regards,

460

 

[greenwald]

Okay, I'm about to pull my hair out, and need some advice.

I'm trying to plot out a SS1000 for a buddy & myself this spring. I've done it using an older version of
Rand McNally Tripmaker, and came up with 1,019 miles to our destination.

Yesterday I borrowed a copy of Microsoft streets & trips ('09). Plotted the exact same course, and came up with 891 miles. That's over 10% difference!

Then I got online, and used a mapping software online, and came up with a completly different answer.

Anyone have any suggestions as to what to use that have been found to be accurate?

I don't want to get to the end and discover that we are still 100 miles short!

Thanks,

460

Having completed a couple of Iron Butt rides, use MapQuest to plan your route, and make sure you're at least 50 miles above and beyond the 1,000 needed for a SaddleSore. The IBA does not recognize all route planning templates (Yahoo Travel, for example), so be safe rather than sorry.

Good luck with your route and fatigue management.

 

[MLS2GO]

No Jim, but...

I'll take a stab at it as I would view it, Not mentally prepared, or as Jim pointed out overprepared. I know a group that rode 7 bikes together on their first Saddlesore. If a group of 7 can do it any group of one or two can. The problem with riding two or more together is anyone slowing down the group is slowing everyone down.
Get rested, get on the road, remember it is fun and most do fine. Try to eliminate as many questions in your mind as you can, without creating new ones. Remember what's the worst that happens as long as your ride safe? You went riding for a day right? There is no pressure unless you create it for yourself. Always beats a day at work. Good Luck.

 

[JIMSHAW]

I'm not a Psychiatrist

I'm not a psychiatrist, nor do I play one on TV. But, having watched quite a few riders try to execute a Saddle Sore 1000, I have noticed the following:

1. Perception is more than half the chore. Percieving a 1000 mile ride as very difficult will set you up to fail. It isn't difficult. It's actually easy, if you just make a few good choices. However, if you start out by focusing on how difficult it is, it will undermine your resolve, a few hundred miles down the road.

2. Some riders sweat over a plan that will succeed. They plan every gas stop, worry that the gas station will be open, worry about what and when to eat, when to pee, and what clothes to wear.

A SADDLE SORE IS REALLY JUST A LONG RIDE.

Pick a relatively fast route that you'd like to ride. Maybe plan to have a short, light lunch at a good diner near your turnaround. Try to ride mostly in daylight, for lots of reasons. Don't allow your gas tank to go past the reserve light. Keep speeds to what are not likely to get you stopped. If you get sleepy, just find a place to drink some water, take a brisk walk, or even catch a 10 minute snooze on a picnic table.

Be careful with your receipts. Make sure they are from credit/debit cards, so they are computerized. Stay hydrated. Did you see that? Stay hydrated.

But most of all, stand back and notice that, unless you are going to ride a ninja, this ride is really pretty easy. Your riding technique is the same as always, you are just going to do more of it.

The most interesting part comes later. Some riders do the ride, get their IBA certificate, and kiss the ground when the ride is over. Fine. But, others get off their bike after 1050 miles and think, "I could do a lot more than that." Those are the real Iron Butt riders. Some people think it is somehow abhorrent to ride 1000 miles, especially those who haven't/can't. They are the ones who build the mountain in their head so high, they cannot climb it.

That is what I mean by defeating yourself by overplanning or overthinking the ride. If you fear the ride that much, go do something else. Hell, it isn't rocket science nor the Boston Marathon. Just pick a nice day, and go ride it.

You might enjoy it, and come back for more.

Oh, and don't fall off,
Jim

 

[Rob Nye]

Okay, I'm about to pull my hair out, and need some advice.

I'm trying to plot out a SS1000 for a buddy & myself this spring. I've done it using an older version of
Rand McNally Tripmaker, and came up with 1,019 miles to our destination.

Yesterday I borrowed a copy of Microsoft streets & trips ('09). Plotted the exact same course, and came up with 891 miles. That's over 10% difference!

Then I got online, and used a mapping software online, and came up with a completly different answer.

Anyone have any suggestions as to what to use that have been found to be accurate?

I don't want to get to the end and discover that we are still 100 miles short!

Thanks,

460

Hey now,

It sounds like you have a bit of a "convoluted" route, i.e. not 1000 + miles, point to point.

These routes are the hardest to document and get approved because you have to get a computer generated receipt at every corner that got you the distance.

When approving your ride the IBA will plot the locations you provide receipts for then calculate shortest distance between the points. If the distance comes up at under 1,000 miles no certificate, even if shortest routed you through Deals Gap or over a forest road this is obviously not part of a "sane" route. If it calculates at under 1000, no joy.

A perfect example is the Mesquite, NV to Redmond route (one of the three for the Redmond 1000). If you go direct you will be short but we've added one required receipt to the ride that makes it the right distance. This works because with the intermediate receipt there is no way to shortcut the route.

I would hesitate to consider a ride with more than one or at the most two intermediate stops that must be documented. The receipts are just one more little piece of paper that if lost means no certificate.

I would also suggest using a reasonably current version of Streets N Trips, Mapsource or Delorme's Street Atlas to plan your route. If you would like any assistance I'm happy to help. If you only have one stop google maps is pretty good too. As others have said plan a route of 1050 miles or so then you know you'll be good to go.

If the rally is in your summer plans have you considered participating in the Redmond 1000? No need to mail in any documents, we'll be presenting the certificates at the pizza party Friday evening.

Regardless if I can provide any assistance for your first SS1K please do not hesitate to send me a PM. This invitation extends to any and all.

Best,

Rob Nye
IBA 250
Co-Chair Redmond 1000

 

[Rob Nye]

Boy, the BBG would mean you have to average 62 mph for 24 hours. That's one that you would just about have to do on interstates isn't it? It's tough to average 62 period, let alone stopping for fuel. I'll have to investigate this one for later in the summer.

460

Jetboat,

I don't think you and Jim are not comparing apples to apples. He is deducting an hour for fuel stops (and still coming up short) while talking about maintaining a rolling average of 72. He is correct that out west a rolling average of 72 is reasonable, however the answer seems more directed at a BBG attempt then a SS1K.

The key to this game is your overall rate of advance including stops. For example you noted that to complete a BBG you need to average 62mph (62.5 actually). Factor in Jim's six 10 minute fuel stops and your average moving speed goes up to 65 for 23 hours. That's very hard to do without a very well set up bike, perfect weather and no delays. That's why the BBG is considered an extreme ride, today was the first time I've ever heard of it referred to as a "rite of passage." The SS1K serves this purpose.

For all my planning I try to keep it simple. I take the distance, devide it by the time and then I get my required VMG (velocity made good). I have my GPS units hardwired to the battery. This way they never go off so the average speed indicated is equal to my VMG. I can refer to this number at any time to see how I'm doing, if I'm above my target I can bank time for rest or a meal, if I am below I need to reduce the time I'm stopped or increase my speed which is a loosing propostion.

That's why the SS1K works, your VMG needs to only be 42mph. If using the interstate you can easily build up a nice cushion to use for rest or arrive ahead of schedule.

It's a numbers game.

Below is a photo of my GPS after a short ride to the Finger Lakes Rally. The overall average is my VMG. Chace and I were on our way home from California and after five 500 mile days on back roads I really wanted to spend my birthday at the rally. Friday morning Chace told me she "put on her big girl pants" and we knocked the ride off with a sit down breakfast, lunch, fuel stops and a brief powernap. Note the spread between moving and overall speed.

Also note that the above ride was *almost* on BBG pace for 12 hrs but there is no way anyone could ride another 12 and bag the BBG, I've already used up all the stopping time.


Here is a photo of my GPS after a successful BBG. Note the spread between the moving speed and the VMG (average) is much closer and the stopped time is much less. On this ride I had six 5 minute fuel stops and a nap.

The bottom line is only experience will give you a feel for what kind of VMG's you can sustain. Even a SS1K requires effeciency when you stop as it is just about impossible to use speed to make up the time lost while stopped.

To prepare get in the habit of doing routine tasks the same way every time. Figure an effecient way to get fuel and do this everytime you fuel up, even on a short ride. It will make it faster *and* easier to do when you're tired.

Most importantly have fun and know when to pull the plug and get off the bike. Not every IB ride is successful and as Jim said the IBA won't put a certificate on your tombstone.

I've had to bail on a few certificates and while disapointed I have no regret over not finishing the ride.

If you get tired, don't stand around a gas station chugging energy drinks and eating power bars, find a spot to lie down and take a nap. Take time to make time.

 

[Roy.Jackson55@aol.com]

Jetboat,


It's a numbers game.

Below is a photo of my GPS after a short ride to the Finger Lakes Rally. The overall average is my VMG. Chace and I were on our way home from California and after five 500 mile days on back roads I really wanted to spend my birthday at the rally. Friday morning Chace told me she "put on her big girl pants" and we knocked the ride off with a sit down breakfast, lunch, fuel stops and a brief powernap. Note the spread between moving and overall speed.

Also note that the above ride was *almost* on BBG pace for 12 hrs but there is no way anyone could ride another 12 and bag the BBG, I've already used up all the stopping time.

Here is a photo of my GPS after a successful BBG. Note the spread between the moving speed and the VMG (average) is much closer and the stopped time is much less. On this ride I had six 5 minute fuel stops and a nap.

Never mind the moving and Overall, whats with that max speed??

 

[Bud]

I hope Rob will not mind my smart*$$ reply here.

It is the speed you have to go, to get to Max's BMW, from Rob's house when it is five minutes from closing time.

But I bet he wasn't close to the ground when that speed was recorded.


BTW this thread and the Redmond 1000 thread have been very interesting reading.

 

[Rob Nye]

Never mind the moving and Overall, whats with that max speed??

I keep it there on purpose.

It is excellent evidence that the top speed figure is not evidence of anything.

Now if you compare this to the bottom shot you'll see the speed has been reset.

 

[Ken F]

I want to extend a big thank you to all who have replied! I've learned a lot from you guys already, and thanks for taking the time to share your experiences and advice.

I've re-plotted our route, so that my buddy will only have to document two turns, and I will have 3. That's about as simple as I'm able to make it. I'm grateful for your advice on that part Robnye as I had several turns which would have been necessary to document in the original route.

Jim your advice is much appreciated too! Some of your little "offhanded comments"
made me bust out laughing in the middle of some pretty serious stuff!

I'm really excited about doing this! One additional question...what is the name of the packs of water that you carry on your back with a hose into your helmet?
I've already got a BBG mapped out!

Thanks again

460

 

[Bud]

Trade name is Camelback. Lots of generic versions available.

 

[JIMSHAW]

IB Mentality

Try to enjoy your SS1000. When it's right, it's more like a hearty massage than like a tooth extraction.

Hope you enjoy the ride. Send us a note when you get back.

Jim