'83 R65 Starter Troubleshooting Advice

[deyoung1983]

Hello! I'm new to the forum but hoping someone with more experience might have some advice about an issue I've recently had with my 1983 BMW R65.

About three weeks ago I noticed a metallic rattle when the engine was running (particularly in low gears). Didn't want to run it much hoping to check it out more.

The next weekend I went to start it up and it wouldn't start. The starter motor was clearly turning and getting power, but somehow didn't seem to be engaging the engine. I was able to bump start it (run it in gear with clutch in and ignition on, jump on and release clutch, started right up). So it didn't seem to be an engine issue. Took it around the block a few times but still getting the metallic rattle.

After some research my best guess was that the starter drive/clutch was not properly engaging the clutch carrier (and maybe not entirely disengaging either, thus the rattle). So, my plan was to just replace the entire starter motor (upgrade the original Bosch for a new Valeo).

Ordered the new starter motor, and got it in a few days later. Last weekend I was going bump start it again to get it 10-12 blocks to a shop where I had more access to tools to remove the tank, replace the starter, etc. But, this time she wouldn't roll in gear. It feels like the clutch is stuck. Will roll in neutral, but not in gear even with the clutch in, so couldn't bump it.

I'm now trying to find someone with a trailer to get it to the shop... But, does anyone have any advice or ideas? Does this sound like a Bendix drive issue? Should replacing the starter solve it? Is the clutch issue related or not? Any advice on that? I love my bike but know I would be in over my head with extensive clutch/transmission work.

Thanks! I truly appreciate any advice.

- Ben

 

[copbike]

Thoughts

Ben... the fact that initially, the starter would not engage seems to be a starter problem, as you first thought. I would start from there... Since you already have the new starter, remove the old one for inspection. It may be that pieces from the old starter have lodged in place, preventing clutch disengagement (Although this seems unlikely to me). But the first step is to inspect the starter... that will tell you a lot.

 

[deyoung1983]

Thanks

Ben... the fact that initially, the starter would not engage seems to be a starter problem, as you first thought. I would start from there... Since you already have the new starter, remove the old one for inspection. It may be that pieces from the old starter have lodged in place, preventing clutch disengagement (Although this seems unlikely to me). But the first step is to inspect the starter... that will tell you a lot.

Thanks for the feedback! I will get the starter off and take a look very soon. Hopefully that will resolve it.... I was just a little concerned about these issues following on each other so close. I noticed there was some feedback on the forum about how to unstick a clutch if you can get the motor running so I may have more questions about that. I will give an update when I can.

Thanks again.

 

[deyoung1983]

Update - Clutch Carrier seperated from clutch housing/flywheel

Ben... the fact that initially, the starter would not engage seems to be a starter problem, as you first thought. I would start from there... Since you already have the new starter, remove the old one for inspection. It may be that pieces from the old starter have lodged in place, preventing clutch disengagement (Although this seems unlikely to me). But the first step is to inspect the starter... that will tell you a lot.

Update... So I removed the starter and looked in to see where the starter drive is supposed to engage with the clutch carrier. I immediately realized that the clutch carrier (the gear on the flywheel) was not fixed to the flywheel/clutch housing itself. So it does not appear to be a starter issue at all. There are supposed to 6 metal pins attaching the outer gear ring to the flywheel/clutch housing itself. The gear ring is just spinning freely.

You can see in the photo two of the empty pin holes, and off to the corner one of the pins bent and pushed out. Where the other 5 pins are I have no idea...probable somewhere in my clutch assembly.

I have never heard of something like this happening. Does anyone have an experience with this sort of issue? Any advice on what a repair like this might entail? A friend of mine was saying that the clutch looked awful dry. My understanding is that this airhead has a "dry" clutch so I wasn't expecting to see a lot out oil in there. Am I wrong?

Thanks.

- Ben

 

[copbike]

I Have

A fix seems to be removal of the transmission and reattaching the component parts. This is not very difficult, and would give you some great experience. I saw a similar thing on a friends bike. He was able to bolt it back together with the repair of two of the holes, and new bolts. It is actually something you can do yourself, and also install a new clutch. It takes a little time and patience, but can be very rewarding for you. Lee