ooopiperooo
New member
Has anyone tried swapping for a lithium ion battery in their oilhead ride? Wondering how well they hold up and if the stock charging system works ok to keep them charged up
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Lithium battery
- Thread starter ooopiperooo
- Start date
1. Yes
2. Just fine
3. Yes
Prepare for a variety of different views on the subject.
happy wanderer
Day Dreaming ...
IMO lithium batteries on a street bike are a total waste of money. For a race bike where every ounce of weight matters? Sure go ahead.
My opinion is worth exactly what it cost you. Your application may vary. Batteries not included. All standard disclaimers apply.
My opinion is worth exactly what it cost you. Your application may vary. Batteries not included. All standard disclaimers apply.
Mr_Canoehead
Member
If you ride in cold weather, they are not a good idea.
I almost had a trip ruined by a Shorai 14AH on my 1150. Every morning was hit and miss as to whether it would start. After the first start of the day it was fine but it was a total PITA doing the "warm the battery" dance. If the voltage drops below 10v, the oilhead won't fire and mine was dropping to 9v when cold.
The CCA ratings are crap. The SAE CCA test is very specific and there is no way that the Shorai would be anywhere near its rating at 0*F. Some of the LiPo companies have stopped calling the rating CCA and call it surge amps or something similar.
I called Shorai when I got home and they gave me the next bigger size (18AH) for the price differential (and the 18Ah is now the recommended battery) but I lost all confidence. I went to a PC680 and never looked back.
My advice - take the recommended AH size from the LiPo company, double it, if they don't make a battery in that size round up to the next size and then decide if the battery is worth the money. So, in my case, I wouldn't consider anything smaller than 2x 14AH for my bike, so when I round up, I'd look at the 36AH Shorai. I don't think that Shorai is any better or worse than any of the other companies, BTW.
I'll probably take the larger LiPo that they gave me for the 1150 and put it in my DR650 when the crappy Yuasa the PO put in dies.
As far as the weight savings go, for the $250 more I'd have to pay for an equivalent LiPo, I could go to the gym for 6 months and lose more weight than a LiPo would save (and feel better, too).
I almost had a trip ruined by a Shorai 14AH on my 1150. Every morning was hit and miss as to whether it would start. After the first start of the day it was fine but it was a total PITA doing the "warm the battery" dance. If the voltage drops below 10v, the oilhead won't fire and mine was dropping to 9v when cold.
The CCA ratings are crap. The SAE CCA test is very specific and there is no way that the Shorai would be anywhere near its rating at 0*F. Some of the LiPo companies have stopped calling the rating CCA and call it surge amps or something similar.
I called Shorai when I got home and they gave me the next bigger size (18AH) for the price differential (and the 18Ah is now the recommended battery) but I lost all confidence. I went to a PC680 and never looked back.
My advice - take the recommended AH size from the LiPo company, double it, if they don't make a battery in that size round up to the next size and then decide if the battery is worth the money. So, in my case, I wouldn't consider anything smaller than 2x 14AH for my bike, so when I round up, I'd look at the 36AH Shorai. I don't think that Shorai is any better or worse than any of the other companies, BTW.
I'll probably take the larger LiPo that they gave me for the 1150 and put it in my DR650 when the crappy Yuasa the PO put in dies.
As far as the weight savings go, for the $250 more I'd have to pay for an equivalent LiPo, I could go to the gym for 6 months and lose more weight than a LiPo would save (and feel better, too).
lowndes
New member
Cold Weather for the Lithium??
Check this article on Li batteries:
From:https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/art...corpion-stinger-lithium-series-batteries.html
"Ok, I mentioned that there are some pitfalls. The first is that while these are great starting batteries, they are not designed for zero loss, or deep cycle applications. They are designed with weight in mind and will not perform as well as a lead battery when cycled deeply. Secondly, they are a bit more sensitive to temperature than Lead batteries. They don’t perform as well as a comparable AGM type battery when the temperature drops below about 20 degrees, and they also are more sensitive to heat. We don’t recommend these be installed in an application where the battery cannot get any cooling air, such as surrounded by an oil tank, or directly on top of a motor. Third, they must not be charged at over 15.5 volts. ALWAYS check your charging system prior to installation to make sure your stator or alternator never produces more than that 15.5 volts. Higher voltage can cause these batteries to melt down."
Check this article on Li batteries:
From:https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/art...corpion-stinger-lithium-series-batteries.html
"Ok, I mentioned that there are some pitfalls. The first is that while these are great starting batteries, they are not designed for zero loss, or deep cycle applications. They are designed with weight in mind and will not perform as well as a lead battery when cycled deeply. Secondly, they are a bit more sensitive to temperature than Lead batteries. They don’t perform as well as a comparable AGM type battery when the temperature drops below about 20 degrees, and they also are more sensitive to heat. We don’t recommend these be installed in an application where the battery cannot get any cooling air, such as surrounded by an oil tank, or directly on top of a motor. Third, they must not be charged at over 15.5 volts. ALWAYS check your charging system prior to installation to make sure your stator or alternator never produces more than that 15.5 volts. Higher voltage can cause these batteries to melt down."
beemerphile
New member
There are great differences between the lithium ion batteries which have shown potential for fires and the lithium iron phosphate batteries used in these motorcycle batteries. They have some issues, but this is not one of them.
OK...but what is the current benefit of using one? Don't personally see one except on a track bike looking at ounces to shave
OK...but what is the current benefit of using one? Don't personally see one except on a track bike looking at ounces to shave
Saved 8 pounds which are mounted up high. Plus, its a great conversation/fist fight starter.
happy wanderer
Day Dreaming ...
Saved 8 pounds which are mounted up high. Plus, its a great conversation/fist fight starter.
So you're saving the weight of just over one US gallon of gas. So from a full tank to 3/4 full. Do you really notice that?
gsaddict
Pepperfool
Shorai - excessive $$$ for what you don't get
Disappointing to poor cranking performance under 40f
ABS startup faults were regular
Who wants to sit and wait for the battery to heat up internally while it uses up AH?
Also only rated at 7AH compared to the 16 normally
Not practical for northern climes
Back to the trusty PC680
Not ready for prime time,,,,,YRMV
Bottom of battery - part # and rating
Disappointing to poor cranking performance under 40f
ABS startup faults were regular
Who wants to sit and wait for the battery to heat up internally while it uses up AH?
Also only rated at 7AH compared to the 16 normally
Not practical for northern climes
Back to the trusty PC680
Not ready for prime time,,,,,YRMV
Bottom of battery - part # and rating
So you're saving the weight of just over one US gallon of gas. So from a full tank to 3/4 full. Do you really notice that?
Absolutely. Especially going hard left to hard right (or vice versa). Does it improve my Vancouver to LA times? Nope. But hey, I change brands of tire every time I need tires. If one doesn't try new stuff then life gets boring.
beemerphile
New member
OK...but what is the current benefit of using one? Don't personally see one except on a track bike looking at ounces to shave
Beats me. I just wanted to help you dislike them for legitimate reasons.
I have an EarthX ETX36L in my R1200GS. The smaller size makes room for some extra electrical stuff. With an onboard battery management system and 36 Ah capacity (Yes, Pb equivalent) it has been entirely adequate for starting duties - hot or cold - and has an extremely low self-discharge rate.
HOWEVER, I do not think it represents a sound alternative from a financial point of view. Even as an owner who is completely satisfied with what it does, I would not recommend it. A good AGM would have made better sense - even though I'd have to search out somewhere else to mount the added trinkets.
Saved 8 pounds which are mounted up high. Plus, its a great conversation/fist fight starter.
Battery threads were already fun...just adds another player
I saw these at the manufacturer's expo at the rally in Billing last year (the battery, not the bike
). I use a Shorai but it seems that this may be an alternative for the other bikes in the stable. 
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I have the EarthX ETX36D in my K1600GT - for 2 years now. It delivers almost 1 full volt more which means it spins that starter motor as if it's on steroids - the bikes fires up instantly. The lithium iron phosphate battery has a very very low discharge rate meaning you can leave it in the bike all winter and come Spring you just hit the starter button and away you go. It has its own internal circuitry so that you don't need a special charger(unlike the Shorai). It has no acid in it meaning in the unlikely event the battery case gets punctured you're not looking at replacing $2000 worth of motorcycle parts damaged from leaking acid. The battery terminals stay spotlessly clean. The battery has a shelf life of 10 years so I'm hoping it lasts a few years longer than a lead acid battery. And it weighs about the same as a helium balloon. Sure the price is higher but every time I hit the Start button and hear that starter motor whirling away I'm glad I tried out the EarthX battery. No complaints here.
I've been using a Battery Tender on my 4 year old Shorai, no issues. Although I'm sure Shorai would love to sell me their own special charger, they say that what I'm using is fine. Of course, I don't use it at all once the riding season starts. Anyone else using an EarthX battery?
beemerphile
New member
When I used a Shorai, I used their balancing charger, because lacking an internal battery management system, on a standard charger it has no way to balance the cells. This is not an issue with the EarthX as it has its own BMS. I use an Optimate Lithium with the EarthX and will not own another Shorai. One Shorai died early and the other did "ok" but did not distinguish itself. Both were ordered too small by relying on the company's recommendations using "Pb equivalent" capacity. I think EarthX is the top of the heap, but you pay for it. Again, the economics just are not there yet.
