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Repair DVD availability

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motormike said:
I would still expect Haynes and Clymer to provide service manuals. I've always found their manuals to be considerably easier to follow than the BMW CD's, whose format is not very intuitive, at least to me.
Click to expand...

Alas; I doubt that Haynes and Clymer will pony up the exorbitant fees required to get the technical info from BMW so that they can produce their manuals. Note that they don't produce manuals for recent Ducatis since the folks in Bologna chose to not share service info at a consumer friendly price.
 
stooie said:
While I'm sad to hear that BMW will no longer be making maintenance information available I greatly fear this is where the industry is heading.

Thinking I might add a second bike to my stable I test rode a Ducati 950 S this summer. I found it to be a delightful bike; not perfect but more fun than a barrel of monkeys. One of the big reasons I didn't jump is that Ducati doesn't make maintenance info available. As with BMW, dealers are few and far between. Lacking simple info such as torque values for wheel nuts, chain tension adjuster bolts, etc. and advising that these processes must be done "at an authorized service center" just doesn't make sense in many parts of our large country.

Fortunately my 2018 RT is going strong and, at age 72, may very well last until I "age out" of riding. Should I decide at some point to get another bike I will certainly be looking for one from a company that makes service information available.
Click to expand...

I bought a Ducati Monster 1200s last year. I didn't inquire about manuals and was shocked when I found out they are only available to dealers. It's an incredible bike and I love it. Unfortunately, there isn't even a GS911 look alike to reset the service reminder. It's got to be done at the dealer and many will not reset it for you without doing the work. My dealer has increased his hourly rate to $170/hr. and his work is suspect. I had a warranty issue last winter and the dealer kept it for 3 months because he couldn't put it on the dyno unless temps were above 40° or something like that. Then it wasn't fixed when I got it back.

The internet forums and youtube provide a wealth of maintenance info and videos so it's not the end of the world. There is some legislation being considered but you know how effective our government is in protecting business interests vs. you and me.
 
Speculation on other forums is that BMW is moving motorcycles to a SAE J2534 PassThrough System for all technical documentation and diagnosis. In addition to an interface device, and hefty hardware/software requirements, a subscription to the BMW Technical Information Service would be required at $30/day, $250/month, or $2500/year. This will provide access to online shop "manuals", and some programming capabilities.

The subscription is not a reasonable option for the DIY owner, who needs the information only intermittently.
 
lkraus said:
Speculation on other forums is that BMW is moving motorcycles to a SAE J2534 PassThrough System for all technical documentation and diagnosis. In addition to an interface device, and hefty hardware/software requirements, a subscription to the BMW Technical Information Service would be required at $30/day, $250/month, or $2500/year. This will provide access to online shop "manuals", and some programming capabilities.

The subscription is not a reasonable option for the DIY owner, who needs the information only intermittently.
Click to expand...

This makes it sound like it will be financially feasible for Haynes and Clymer to buy access to the BMW manuals and produce their manuals.
 
lkraus said:
Speculation on other forums is that BMW is moving motorcycles to a SAE J2534 PassThrough System for all technical documentation and diagnosis. In addition to an interface device, and hefty hardware/software requirements, a subscription to the BMW Technical Information Service would be required at $30/day, $250/month, or $2500/year. This will provide access to online shop "manuals", and some programming capabilities.

The subscription is not a reasonable option for the DIY owner, who needs the information only intermittently.
Click to expand...

Again, some enterprising young lad could subscribe and “sub-lease” to those needing access.
I grow tired of operations making problems worse…….I usually vote yay or nay with my wallet.
It’s too bad things are headed this way…..although, with many of the “younger” crowd that thinking pumping their own gas is a big mechanical event, it may only matter to the OF’s :gerg
OM
 
PGlaves said:
I think the new stuff is all in the cloud, accessible by dealer techs on their proprietary computer hardware. It might be difficult to copy.
Click to expand...

There's copies of the R1250 DVD out there now.
I can probably get by with my R1200RS DVD and maybe buy a new R1250 DVD from JVB Productions.
 
stooie said:
Alas; I doubt that Haynes and Clymer will pony up the exorbitant fees required to get the technical info from BMW so that they can produce their manuals. Note that they don't produce manuals for recent Ducatis since the folks in Bologna chose to not share service info at a consumer friendly price.
Click to expand...

I do wonder what Harley's policy is/will be on this matter? There are thousands of independent shops that work on Harleys.
 
I find this kind of ironic. Vehicle (cars, trucks, motorcycle, etc.) are lasting longer than their predecessors. However, some dealers have placed a relatively short 10 to 15-year limit on bikes they will work on, and BMW is no longer providing repair manuals. While a newer bike may last for decades and hundreds of 1,000 miles, it may not be possible to keep it on the road. In 20 to 30 years, I wonder if we’ll see the same number of older bikes on the road as we do today (e.g. Airhead, early K bikes, etc.).

It certainly provides an opportunity for Clymer’s, Haynes to provide repair manuals; however, I wonder how much will be possible without being able to access and analyze the on-board computer(s).
 
Perhaps the MOA could cut a deal with BMW for bulk access to the online system and make it available to members on a cost recovery basis from those members who use it.

Sent from my SM-T813 using Tapatalk
 
RadioFlyer said:
Perhaps the MOA could cut a deal with BMW for bulk access to the online system and make it available to members on a cost recovery basis from those members who use it.

Sent from my SM-T813 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

At that point the hardware compatibility becomes the issue.
 
mikegalbicka said:
Any well designed cloud based product should work within any modern browser on any type of device.
Click to expand...

The hardware and software requirements listed in the link posted earlier would indicate that BMW's current automotive system, which Motorrad may be joining, is not "well designed" by that definition.

The portion of Technical Information System that contains shop procedures is the Aftersales Online System (AOS). So just accessing the "shop manual" requires a PC running 64 bit Windows 10 Professional or Enterprise, Java and Internet Explorer 11. Internet access with a download bandwidth of at least 4 Mbps and an upload bandwidth of at least 400 Kbps is required, so wi-fi to the garage might work. Actual diagnostics or programming requires a 100 Mbps internet connection, with Ethernet being highly recommended for reliability. Some of the Pass Through Tools use a USB connection, but the full featured ones require their own Ethernet connection to the PC, so the PC really needs one Ethernet port for the tool and another for internet.
 
service info from GS911 and common sense has been enough for my 2009 GS. I do not plan to upgrade if something like that is NLA.

Rod
 
A series of emails with Motorrad Customer Service, if this bothers you, as it does me, I suggest you employ the following email address to good use: customerservice@bmwmotorcycles.com


What they told me -

From: Customer Service BMW Motorcycles
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 9:15 AM
To: johnlangdell
Subject: Your Motorrad Correspondence

Dear John,

Thanks for your reply.

After further researching your request, BMW Motorrad no longer offers repair manuals for our motorcycles. However, you can be assured I’ve forwarded your concerns to the appropriate individuals for internal review. We're sorry for any disappointment this may cause.

Should you need to contact BMW Motorrad Customer Relations and Services again, you can reach us at 1-800-831-1117 Monday through Thursday from 9:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. ET and Friday from 9:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. ET.

Wishing you safety and healthy during these challenging times, John.

Kind regards,

Abigail
BMW Motorrad USA
Representative

MAKE LIFE A RIDE.

FEEL EVERYTHING, FEAR NOTHING.
Build your own bike at www.bmwmotorcycles.com.

--------------- Original Message ---------------
From: [johnlangdell]
Sent: 12/27/2021 3:24 PM
To: customerservice@bmwmotorcycles.com
Subject: Re: Your Motorrad Correspondence


I have visited with my dealer regarding Factory Service Manual availability. That is how I learned that they are not available and hence my question to you.

How/When will service data be made available to consumers who need or wish to perform their own maintenance and repairs?

Thank you.

John Langdell

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 13:18 Customer Service BMW Motorcycles <customerservice@bmwmotorcycles.com> wrote:
Dear John,

Thanks for writing to BMW Motorrad USA regarding the service manual for your new 2021 BMW R 1200 GS Adventure and congratulations on your recent purchase! I appreciate your loyalty with us.

I’d suggest speaking with the parts team at your local BMW Motorrad dealer, as they’d be in the best position to assist you with the service manual. For your reference, a list of our authorized dealers can be found on our website: www.bmwmotorcycles.com under the "Find a Dealer" link.

Should you need to contact BMW Motorrad Customer Relations and Services again, you can reach us at 1-800-831-1117 Monday through Thursday from 9:00 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. ET and Friday from 9:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. ET.

I hope you’re enjoying your new bike, John.

Kind regards,

Abigail
BMW Motorrad USA
Representative

MAKE LIFE A RIDE.

FEEL EVERYTHING, FEAR NOTHING.
Build your own bike at www.bmwmotorcycles.com.

--------------- Original Message ---------------
From: [johnlangdell]
Sent: 12/24/2021 2:23 PM
To: customerservice@bmwmotorcycles.com
Subject: Factory Service Manual for 2021 R1200 GS Adventure

I have just traded my ’14 R1200 GS Adv for a ’21 R1200 GS Adv.

In the process of making the acquisition, I learned that BMW Motorrad no longer offers Updatable Factory Service Manual DVDs like I was able to purchase for my ‘14.

Where am I to obtain service and repair information for my new motorcycle?

I’m not sure I would have made this purchase knowing that Service/Repair information is not available.

Thanks in advance for your reply

John Langdell
Click to expand...
 
I made a complaint to the NHTSA - https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem#vehicle

nhtsa-BMW%20Repair%20Manual%20Safety%20Issue%20Report%20%282%29-L.png


I recommend you all make a similar complaint to spur Motorrad into reconsidering their ill-advised decision to no longer provide service data to the end-user/consumer.

Your life may depend upon it!
 
bigjohnsd said:
I made a complaint to the NHTSA - https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem#vehicle

nhtsa-BMW%20Repair%20Manual%20Safety%20Issue%20Report%20%282%29-L.png


I recommend you all make a similar complaint to spur Motorrad into reconsidering their ill-advised decision to no longer provide service data to the end-user/consumer.

Your life may depend upon it!
Click to expand...

I will be interested in how a complaint like this works out. :scratch

Self repair is becoming more complicated as this thread in Campfire helps show-

https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?98653-Right-to-repair-a-larger-movement-than-I-thought

We have Boxflyer, better than a factory DVD. :D

OM
 
Omega Man said:
I will be interested in how a complaint like this works out. :scratch

Self repair is becoming more complicated as this thread in Campfire helps show-

https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?98653-Right-to-repair-a-larger-movement-than-I-thought

We have Boxflyer, better than a factory DVD. :D

OM
Click to expand...

Even @Boxflyer needs Technical Data to work with!

Next step is to write to Senator Thune, Senator Rounds and Representative Johnson, all deeply involved in "Right to Repair" issues from the Farm Equipment side of the state.
 
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