J
JAMESDUNN
Guest
Yeah. Great tourer if you could get past the looks.
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Huh.... What was Honda thinking?
- Thread starter oldhway
- Start date
S
shire2000
Guest
I think that the new Honda is a great looking bike that will serve a part of the market that has recently been ignored. 1 or even 2 up touring does not need to be on a huge 1300cc bike. 700cc is plenty. Have done my share of touring on 500-750cc bikes over the years. Never had a bit of problem with the amount of power.
I think that there is a market segment that wants this and Honda is willing to provide it. I hope it does very well. Maybe a few other manufacturers will come to the same party.
I think that there is a market segment that wants this and Honda is willing to provide it. I hope it does very well. Maybe a few other manufacturers will come to the same party.
j-budimlya
Jim Bud
Too heavy and too tall for the tarrget market
If you are going to make a mid-size....then make a mid-size...not a tall and heavy mid-size. they are leaving plenty of room for someone else to do this better.
Hint....
If you are going to make a mid-size....then make a mid-size...not a tall and heavy mid-size. they are leaving plenty of room for someone else to do this better.
Hint....
As commuter, it's lacking in bag space. Quite a few of us take laptops to work, and my laptop (12" PowerBook in a ST backpack) pack fits tight in the RTs side and top cases. I don't think it would fit at all in the Honda. But it is a pretty bike...like a smaller RT. It probably gets about 55 mpg to boot.
bikerfish1100
New member
weighs in at well over 100 lbs beyond my F8GS, and 30+ lbs. over my "aging" R11S. not nearly the middleweight it should be. but i guess when you compare it to the porky 700+ lbs ST1300, it's a relative lightweight.
yawn.
yawn.
bubbagazoo
I like TANG!
Most manufacturers think the folks who ride sport-touring bikes are 6'2" tall. The seat height on this bike is 31.7". The ST1300, Yamaha FJ1300, Kawasaki Concours, R1200RT, etc are all in this range.
Now, I think this is a nice looking bike but it is a bit pricey. And the clamouring for a mid-size RT can be countered with the "what's wrong with the F800ST" other than its price. Buy the bike, add the panniers and you've got a mid-size sport touring bike.
J
JAMESDUNN
Guest
that is a sweet looking ride. Getting back to smaller and simpler is the inevitable trend.
I think there is truth in this statement, but it still seems to be going the other direction at the moment. Just check out BMW or nearly any other manufacturers latest.
I like the looks of it too - and it definitely looks more like a motorcycle than the old Pacific Coast 800. As other shave said - that was about as reliable a touring bike as one could find 'cept for the styling that made it look like a cross between a scooter and a sedan. Too bad that BMW didn't do this with the F800 platform already - now they shall have to play catchup, again.
I am curious as to why Honda went with this displacement engine - granted, they might still get 65-70HP out of it but I'd think with an extra 100-200cc displacement it could run more relaxed and be tuned for more midrange torque, what touring riders use more than peak HP.
Still, it shows promise, IMHO.
I am curious as to why Honda went with this displacement engine - granted, they might still get 65-70HP out of it but I'd think with an extra 100-200cc displacement it could run more relaxed and be tuned for more midrange torque, what touring riders use more than peak HP.
Still, it shows promise, IMHO.
B
bob1100rtc
Guest
I like it.
Hmmm? A mid-range touring bike with built in luggage and shaft drive. Probably reliable as hell and no final drive issues to worry about, and Honda dealers everywhere. Also 700cc insurance would be cheap too. Now why would anyone want to buy this?
It might be because of this post I stumbled on from ADV:
I had pleasure. Worked on brand new Deauville of my friend and rode with him for 6000 km.
How difficult? VERY!
It is one of most maintenance un-friendly bikes I worked on. I hated every minute.
To take rear wheel off you need to remove exhaust, which requires 1 foot long extender for wrench, but if you drop exhaust you will break lambda-sensor wire, which can not be unplugged from connector on frame because part of connector that are fixed on frame is the one that comes off exhaust!!! Then take off brake caliper, rear mudguard can stay if you lift bike rear like 2 feet in the air. When my friend dropped it left side front indicator broke mounts and sunk into fairing. We wanted to fix it, but plastic fixed in a way that half of bike must be taken off...
Then he broke Honda original bellypan in first fall at 30 kmph. Went into pieces from slight knock.
Comparing to ST1300 I worked on at same time (prepared bikes of my friends for Norway ride I led them in) it was horrible. Yes, and ST1300 not most maintenance-friendly.
J
JAMESDUNN
Guest
But so are a lot of the newer plastic clad bikes, regardless of brand. It is my understanding the new 800ST must have body work removed to change the spark plugs!
osbornk
Old man in the mountains
An extra 100-200cc here and an extra 100-200cc there is how we gradually got to the hugh engines we have now. I did the same thing. Bigger is better thinking. I started out with a 185 cc bike and went to 350 to 500 to 550 to 700 to 1,100 before I started back down to 1,000 to 750cc to 800 cc and thjen back to 1200 cc (but low HP and plenty of torque). The quickest and most powerful bike I had was the 700 cc bike (Honda Magna). The 750 and 800 cc BMWs were (and are) the nicest bikes for touring (one up) that I have ridden.
I think the new Honda has the right size engine but it is heavier than needed and the seat height is far to high on a bike that is probably aimed at the newer and/or female rider.
108625
New member
When discussing seat height, keep in mind the bike is a V-twin, and probably a lot narrower than most other configurations. My wife is 5'2", and we've found that seat height as a measurement only tells half the story when it comes to how tall or short a bike feels. Being able to put a leg almost straight down goes a long way towards making the bike feel more manageable.
Beyond that, this particular model has been a long running good seller in europe, where I think a lot of people ride and commute on bikes as primary transportation more than we do. (I've lived there twice; for a total of six years.) Maybe the euro moto-journalists find it unexciting compared to a Fireblade (CBR1000RR), but that's not what it's for... It sure looks to me like that K75RT replacement a lot of people here are looking for.
Maybe instead of critiquing Honda's effort; we should be questioning why BMW doesn't make one at all.
Beyond that, this particular model has been a long running good seller in europe, where I think a lot of people ride and commute on bikes as primary transportation more than we do. (I've lived there twice; for a total of six years.) Maybe the euro moto-journalists find it unexciting compared to a Fireblade (CBR1000RR), but that's not what it's for... It sure looks to me like that K75RT replacement a lot of people here are looking for.
Maybe instead of critiquing Honda's effort; we should be questioning why BMW doesn't make one at all.
xp8103
New member
I sat on one of those this past summer.... Oddity for sure. A "Crusing Sports Tourer"? Or a "Touring Sports Cruiser" or a ...... And since I didn't get to ride it, I'll reserve judgment on the trans.
I like the looks of the NT. But before we complain about heavy tall mid-sized tourers, I'll offer up my K75 as a specimen. Only the "low seat" and a LOT of seat time makes it manageable. I agree with those who say that you don't need 1000cc to tour 1 up, but 2 with enough gear to tour? On a heavy bike?
knary
looking for a coal mine
Bodywork has to be removed from most any bike that isn't a boxer to access the sparkplugs.
149769
New member
Interesting to see this thread. Before I bought my R1200R I was having the great debate between the Honda CBF1000 (available in Canada and not the US) and the R1200R. Both bikes had what I was looking for. Lower seat height, removable bags. They could be used for the twisties as a fun bike and touring as well..
I test rode both. The BMW was more expensive so the frugal part of me was leaning towards the Honda.
There were several things that made me change my mind and buy the BMW.
First - I really liked the look of the R1200R. I am not a fan of fairings so the naked look appealed to me.
Second - Build details Better brake lines, instrumentation, fit and finish in the BMW. 3 year warranty vs 1 year warranty. Given almost 1/2 of the year is unrideable in Canada the longer warranty was perferable.
Third - The dealer....I had a great experience with the BMW dealer. They even brought in the low seat for my test ride. The Honda dealer seemed very reluctant to let me ride the bike at all. I had spoken to men who went there for test rides and were not treated like that...
Fourth - The engine....I really like the boxer. It gives me all of the power that I need for the street. The inline 4 is a nice smooth engine but when ever I ride one of those big inline 4's it seems that they are not happy to ride within the posted speed limit...
When it came right down to it the BMW just made me smile more...after 6000 km on it so far I have no regrets...
Celeste
I test rode both. The BMW was more expensive so the frugal part of me was leaning towards the Honda.
There were several things that made me change my mind and buy the BMW.
First - I really liked the look of the R1200R. I am not a fan of fairings so the naked look appealed to me.
Second - Build details Better brake lines, instrumentation, fit and finish in the BMW. 3 year warranty vs 1 year warranty. Given almost 1/2 of the year is unrideable in Canada the longer warranty was perferable.
Third - The dealer....I had a great experience with the BMW dealer. They even brought in the low seat for my test ride. The Honda dealer seemed very reluctant to let me ride the bike at all. I had spoken to men who went there for test rides and were not treated like that...
Fourth - The engine....I really like the boxer. It gives me all of the power that I need for the street. The inline 4 is a nice smooth engine but when ever I ride one of those big inline 4's it seems that they are not happy to ride within the posted speed limit...
When it came right down to it the BMW just made me smile more...after 6000 km on it so far I have no regrets...
Celeste
osbornk
Old man in the mountains
I sold my K75RT purely because it was a top heavy and tall bike. I liked everything else about it but after 3 or 4 years, I realized my short legs would never allow me to be comfortable with it. It was not a low seat model and the Russell seat I installed made the problem worse because it was wider. The original seat made a rock seem soft.
Ken
Greg_K
New member
Looks nice, probably reliable. Fits a much needed middle-weight touring catagory.
Too tall and heavy for what it is. Weighs almost as much dry as my RT and makes a good bit less HP and torque. Wouldn't want to try it 2-up with lotsa luggage.
A 600CC inline 4 tuned for torque with a lower seat would be perfect as a lightweight touring bike for a single rider and occasional 2-up shorter rides.
Too tall and heavy for what it is. Weighs almost as much dry as my RT and makes a good bit less HP and torque. Wouldn't want to try it 2-up with lotsa luggage.
A 600CC inline 4 tuned for torque with a lower seat would be perfect as a lightweight touring bike for a single rider and occasional 2-up shorter rides.
