Mesh vs closed textile jacket Airflow.

[dnsmith]

There is defanitly a difference between riding with a textile jacket vs a mesh jacket. One cools the skin and the other cools the body. I just took my R1200rt and test rode a Tourmaster Intake Air 4 Mesh motorcycle jacket and to be honest, I am a little disappointed with the Mesh Jacket. We had a beautiful 80* day and I took a ride with the water repellent liner and was sweating up a storm. I stopped and unzipped the liner and started to take off my jacket and realized I still had to find snaps and buttons to separate the two jackets. When I finally got all situated and ready to ride, my first initial fear was that I would be cold because it's the beginning of April in Allentown PA and the shadows were getting long. Once moving I quickly realized is that I felt a little breeze on my arms which felt good but where there was little to no wind on my chest, it was warm. My back behind the armor was actually sweating. The breeze, where the Wind was directly on my skin felt good. The fairing on my RT blocks a lot of wind and where it doesn't move the air, it felt stagnant and I was warm. Now consider the textile jacket. It is designed so that it utilizes vents to move air through and around the body to keep you cool. My old Joe Rocket Balistic series jacket actually did a better job at keeping me cool and comfortable. Has anyone with a K bike or an RT had the same experience with a Mesh vs a closed vented jacket? I am just not feeling the wrap around air flow like I get out of a jacket with well positioned vents. Has anyone found a jacket that gives a good amount of airflow around them for our kind of bike? I don't believe that a person that rides a naked bike can relate to any of this.

 

[skibumwi]

I have 2 jackets that I use, a Klim Overland (closed textile, gortex) and a Cortech GX sportair 3 (mesh). I really like both Jackets but the Klim is too hot above 70*, IMHO. The Coretech, with no liners installed, really lets the air flow and I've not experienced any sweating - as long as I'm moving. I don't think any jacket will be cool if your sitting still in traffic. I agree that adding/removing liners is a pain but the Coretech has a nice color-coding system for the snaps/loops that make it much more user friendly. While I think that the whole idea of putting you waterproof liner INSIDE the shell is a bit bass-ackwards the strategy does work and leads to much more compact liners. I wear the jacket and keep the liners in a saddle bag for use when necessary.

Ski

 

[36654]

There is defanitly a difference between riding with a textile jacket vs a mesh jacket. One cools the skin and the other cools the body. I just took my R1200rt and test rode a Tourmaster Intake Air 4 Mesh motorcycle jacket and to be honest, I am a little disappointed with the Mesh Jacket. We had a beautiful 80* day and I took a ride with the water repellent liner and was sweating up a storm. I stopped and unzipped the liner and started to take off my jacket and realized I still had to find snaps and buttons to separate the two jackets. When I finally got all situated and ready to ride, my first initial fear was that I would be cold because it's the beginning of April in Allentown PA and the shadows were getting long. Once moving I quickly realized is that I felt a little breeze on my arms which felt good but where there was little to no wind on my chest, it was warm. My back behind the armor was actually sweating. The breeze, where the Wind was directly on my skin felt good. The fairing on my RT blocks a lot of wind and where it doesn't move the air, it felt stagnant and I was warm. Now consider the textile jacket. It is designed so that it utilizes vents to move air through and around the body to keep you cool. My old Joe Rocket Balistic series jacket actually did a better job at keeping me cool and comfortable. Has anyone with a K bike or an RT had the same experience with a Mesh vs a closed vented jacket? I am just not feeling the wrap around air flow like I get out of a jacket with well positioned vents. Has anyone found a jacket that gives a good amount of airflow around them for our kind of bike? I don't believe that a person that rides a naked bike can relate to any of this.

I have a Sonora Air jacket and use a no-name wind shirt as a more convenient liner.

 

[mlytle]

i have an intake air 4 mesh jacket. love it. my go to jacket above 70deg. i ride K75s and K1300s, so i don't have a big barn door windscreen blocking the essential cooling and supporting airflow....

for below 70, i have a rukka armas textile jacket. awesome.

with both jackets i use tourmaster transition pants. they cover 25-90deg easily with a mix of different layers.

 

[61996]

I've been very happy with the BMW Comfort Shell jacket as well as the Klim Induction jacket.
Unless its very hot in the mornings, the BMW jacket is my go-to as its the most flexible for varying temps.The Klim gets the nod if its warm in the morning and hot in the afternoon.
I ride a K16GT if that matters

 

[dnsmith]

I've been very happy with the BMW Comfort Shell jacket as well as the Klim Induction jacket.
Unless its very hot in the mornings, the BMW jacket is my go-to as its the most flexible for varying temps.The Klim gets the nod if its warm in the morning and hot in the afternoon.
I ride a K16GT if that matters

Yes, it does matter to me because I am looking for the right jacket for this bike. I have only had it since September 2016 when I traded in my R1200c bike where I got all sorts of wind to keep me cool. I passed up the GS for the RT and I would do it again because I absolutely love my new bike. I don't know if it was just an off night or I just expected so much more out of the Mesh Jacket but it has put me into research mode to find a jacket that has venting on the perimeter of the jacket where it has more of an ability to catch available air and send it down through the jacket. I must admit, when I read all of the members that live further down south than I, there is a little embarrassment about a complaint of being warm. They must be thinking that he doesn't know what warm it.... and they are right I am sure.

 

[Realshelby]

There is a good bit of difference in mesh jackets and how/where they actually flow air. In the past few years I have owned Tourmaster, Joe Rocket, and Motoport mesh gear. Joe Rocket, Olympia, Aeroflow non mesh gear. I ride in 100+ temps on occasion, sometimes for hours on end. Bikes with fairings and larger windshields limit airflow onto mesh gear. Some claim mesh is not good for high temps, I strongly disagree and have proven it in back to back testing at least for my body. The only substantial airflow you are likely to get on an RT type bike is on the arms. Even then it is not like what you get on a smaller fairing bike. You can leave the sleeve cuffs loose and get air up your sleeve, if you don't mind that doing that usually makes your armor move around. The vents in the bicep area can move a good bit of air, and assuming you have it flowing into the shoulder area and out the back through vents there you will feel like it is cooling well. Partly because you are likely sweating and where that air hits it WILL feel really cool! The problem with non mesh gear comes with slow or stopped traffic. You can quickly overheat to the danger point. You don't recover from that easily even when moving again. Mesh gear may not seem like you have that same cooling effect that the vented non mesh gear can give. But it is over a lot more of your body. Evaporating sweat cools you, and if you can do that over a larger area you will keep your body temperature better regulated. I was out yesterday and the temps were 83-87 degrees with high humidity. Hate to see that come in some ways, there is simply no way to be REALLY comfy when you are in the mid 80's and then into the 90's just by adjusting gear. Takes some getting used to.

My solution is my MotoPort mesh kevlar. This doesn't flow quite as much air as other mesh gear, but there is NO solid panels to block air anywhere on it. This is my third season that I will be using a modified Veskimo cooling system. At my age, the heat is simply something I have to be aware of and limit. For instance, with the cooling system and mesh gear, I was stopped in traffic for 1/2 hour in New Mexico. Shut the bike off and just left the cooling gear running. Sitting in fresh black asphalt. Temperature was 102 degrees F. I never felt like I needed to pull off the road and get out of my gear. Even left the helmet on. It is not quite the same as air conditioning of course, but you NEVER get that drousy, too hot feeling that comes when your body is too hot.

Evaporative vests do work. Better than some might think. So do the cooling towels you put around your neck. Bikes don't have A/C, so you have to learn how to best be comfortable and safe.

 

[61996]

Yes, it does matter to me ...

Good because the fairings on the RT and GT are almost identical.

Good luck with your search.

 

[dnsmith]

There is a good bit of difference in mesh jackets and how/where they actually flow air. In the past few years I have owned Tourmaster, Joe Rocket, and Motoport mesh gear. Joe Rocket, Olympia, Aeroflow non mesh gear. I ride in 100+ temps on occasion, sometimes for hours on end. Bikes with fairings and larger windshields limit airflow onto mesh gear. Some claim mesh is not good for high temps, I strongly disagree and have proven it in back to back testing at least for my body. The only substantial airflow you are likely to get on an RT type bike is on the arms. Even then it is not like what you get on a smaller fairing bike. You can leave the sleeve cuffs loose and get air up your sleeve, if you don't mind that doing that usually makes your armor move around. The vents in the bicep area can move a good bit of air, and assuming you have it flowing into the shoulder area and out the back through vents there you will feel like it is cooling well. Partly because you are likely sweating and where that air hits it WILL feel really cool! The problem with non mesh gear comes with slow or stopped traffic. You can quickly overheat to the danger point. You don't recover from that easily even when moving again. Mesh gear may not seem like you have that same cooling effect that the vented non mesh gear can give. But it is over a lot more of your body. Evaporating sweat cools you, and if you can do that over a larger area you will keep your body temperature better regulated. I was out yesterday and the temps were 83-87 degrees with high humidity. Hate to see that come in some ways, there is simply no way to be REALLY comfy when you are in the mid 80's and then into the 90's just by adjusting gear. Takes some getting used to.

My solution is my MotoPort mesh kevlar. This doesn't flow quite as much air as other mesh gear, but there is NO solid panels to block air anywhere on it. This is my third season that I will be using a modified Veskimo cooling system. At my age, the heat is simply something I have to be aware of and limit. For instance, with the cooling system and mesh gear, I was stopped in traffic for 1/2 hour in New Mexico. Shut the bike off and just left the cooling gear running. Sitting in fresh black asphalt. Temperature was 102 degrees F. I never felt like I needed to pull off the road and get out of my gear. Even left the helmet on. It is not quite the same as air conditioning of course, but you NEVER get that drousy, too hot feeling that comes when your body is too hot.

Evaporative vests do work. Better than some might think. So do the cooling towels you put around your neck. Bikes don't have A/C, so you have to learn how to best be comfortable and safe.

Thank you for this very well thought out answer. I never really considered the equation of hot vs the heat stroke when over heating of my own core temp occurs. Most of my life I rode in jeans and t-shirt and now that I am in my 50's, I am rethinking my gear and want to get it right. I have looked at everything from John Bohn body armor and a Draggin Jeans Kevlar shirt and pants to a Klim Badlands jacket or Blade Jacket and matching pants. It would seem that there is no real "best gear" for every situation but something is of course better than nothing.

 

[skibumwi]

Thank you for this very well thought out answer. I never really considered the equation of hot vs the heat stroke when over heating of my own core temp occurs. Most of my life I rode in jeans and t-shirt and now that I am in my 50's, I am rethinking my gear and want to get it right. I have looked at everything from John Bohn body armor and a Draggin Jeans Kevlar shirt and pants to a Klim Badlands jacket or Blade Jacket and matching pants. It would seem that there is no real "best gear" for every situation but something is of course better than nothing.

I really like using the Bohn body armor - it's the best way I've found to keep the armor where it's supposed to be. I pair it with some Scorpion Kevlar jeans and a Coretech Airtex jacket. Works pretty well for me - but I'm not exposed to 100 degree temps.

Ski

 

[dnsmith]

I really like using the Bohn body armor - it's the best way I've found to keep the armor where it's supposed to be. I pair it with some Scorpion Kevlar jeans and a Coretech Airtex jacket. Works pretty well for me - but I'm not exposed to 100 degree temps.

Ski

We get about 4 weeks (give or take) in the high 90's where we are but high humidity 80%of the time. The humidity is the worst. It can make an otherwise beautiful day kind of nasty. I have read so much about so many brands and review after review. It seems crazy But I have not read very much in the way of negative with the Bohn armor. I would definately be the anomaly at the BMW club breakfast wearing such laid back gear.

 

[beemergirl]

I use a Roadcrafter jacket year round. Works for me and this is why:

http://www.ironbutt.com/ibmagazine/IronButt_1002_62-66_Hot.pdf

 

[pglaves]

I am one of those who WARNS against mesh jackets for really hot weather. So, I will repeat my mantra. When ambient temps are above about 94 degrees F hot air blowing directly on the body through the mesh just dehydrates you. Period. Science. Fact.

If you ride a fully faired bike where the air flow hits your elbos, then no harm, no foul. If your fairing is less protection beware, and be careful.

If you are in the desert southwest, even short trips with full mess is a hazard. In the humid crud of the southeast it is less drastic, but I try to avoid riding there.

There is no single answer. When I rode the Iron Butt Rally in '03 and was approaching Las Vegas in 114 temps, I switched out of my 1st Gear Mesh and into my Roadcrafter with underarm and back vents open as I approached Vegas. The dehydration was becoming deadly in the mesh.

I wear mesh pants and don't see a hazard. It is the jacket that becomes the issue.

Be careful. It can kill you.

 

[AKsuited]

Nancy (beemergirl) and Paul are right. I was reluctant at first to switch to my 'Stich jacket for long road trips from a mesh jacket, but I am now a believer.

So, besides avoiding too much hot air on your skin, how will you stay hydrated? https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?84109-Hydration-System

Harry

 

[daboo]

Agreed. It seems counter-intuitive, but at 94 and above, the mesh gear is worse for you.

I'm heading down to Utah in June, then up through Colorado on a 13 day trip with some others from the Seattle area. From what I can tell, temps will hit that point. I'll probably bring both jackets, mesh and an Olympia AST2 with good venting.

Chris

 

[irish]

When I rode a Yamaha Virago with a very small windscreen I used a leather jacket that had four vents in front and one in back. This worked well until I bought my 2002 RT. The RT blocked so much of the wind that I wasn't getting enough airflow through the vents. I bought a mesh jacket and this solved the problem nicely. MUCH better airflow, I'd switch back to the leather when it got below about 70 F because the mesh was too cool at highway speeds below that temperature.

Last year I upgraded to a Klim Badlands jackets (and Overlands pants). I bought the Badlands over other options primarily because of the venting. 10 vents on that jacket. I figured I'd be warmer than the mesh on hot days but at least have better protection. I was surprised when I tried it back to back on about a 90 F day with the mesh and found I could not really tell much difference in airflow when all the vents were open on the Badlands. IMHO it was as good as the mesh at that temperature.

 

[daboo]

I have one complication in my planning for riding on that trip to Utah in June. I wear an airbag vest. It really blocks a lot of air flow through the front and rear of the jacket.

Unfortunately, it'll be a bit difficult to take a day trip to see which jacket combo would work best. A hot day in Seattle, is 75F.

Chris

 

[dnsmith]

When I rode a Yamaha Virago with a very small windscreen I used a leather jacket that had four vents in front and one in back. This worked well until I bought my 2002 RT. The RT blocked so much of the wind that I wasn't getting enough airflow through the vents. I bought a mesh jacket and this solved the problem nicely. MUCH better airflow, I'd switch back to the leather when it got below about 70 F because the mesh was too cool at highway speeds below that temperature.

Last year I upgraded to a Klim Badlands jackets (and Overlands pants). I bought the Badlands over other options primarily because of the venting. 10 vents on that jacket. I figured I'd be warmer than the mesh on hot days but at least have better protection. I was surprised when I tried it back to back on about a 90 F day with the mesh and found I could not really tell much difference in airflow when all the vents were open on the Badlands. IMHO it was as good as the mesh at that temperature.

I am one of those who WARNS against mesh jackets for really hot weather. So, I will repeat my mantra. When ambient temps are above about 94 degrees F hot air blowing directly on the body through the mesh just dehydrates you. Period. Science. Fact.

If you ride a fully faired bike where the air flow hits your elbos, then no harm, no foul. If your fairing is less protection beware, and be careful.

If you are in the desert southwest, even short trips with full mess is a hazard. In the humid crud of the southeast it is less drastic, but I try to avoid riding there.

There is no single answer. When I rode the Iron Butt Rally in '03 and was approaching Las Vegas in 114 temps, I switched out of my 1st Gear Mesh and into my Roadcrafter with underarm and back vents open as I approached Vegas. The dehydration was becoming deadly in the mesh.

I wear mesh pants and don't see a hazard. It is the jacket that becomes the issue.

Be careful. It can kill you.

Years ago I owned an HVAC company and we did all kinds of installations in the Summer. When ever we would hire a new guy, they would always try to prove themselves by working their heart out up in the hot attic. At times the temperatures would get so hot that you couldn't touch anything metal without burning your hands. The sweat would be rolling off of you and suddenly stop. Unless you were aware of it, you were about 10 min away from a Major heat stroke. I helped many guys out of the attic where they sat in the shade for the rest of the day replenishing their body with water and Gatorade. I know exactly what your talking about and couldn't imagine being on a bike and experiencing the effects. My guess is that it would be more difficult to monitor the dehydration. Point taken, thank you.

 

[dnsmith]

Nancy (beemergirl) and Paul are right. I was reluctant at first to switch to my 'Stich jacket for long road trips from a mesh jacket, but I am now a believer.

So, besides avoiding too much hot air on your skin, how will you stay hydrated? https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?84109-Hydration-System

Harry

SWEET!!
My wife might not like the addition but I do!

 

[dnsmith]

I use a Roadcrafter jacket year round. Works for me and this is why:

http://www.ironbutt.com/ibmagazine/IronButt_1002_62-66_Hot.pdf

I glanced at the article but have been working all day and have not had a chance to read it. That is for tonight.
Do you go with a full body suite or jacket and pants?