• Welcome, Guest! We hope you enjoy the excellent technical knowledge, event information and discussions that the BMW MOA forum provides. Some forum content will be hidden from you if you remain logged out. If you want to view all content, please click the 'Log in' button above and enter your BMW MOA username and password.

    If you are not an MOA member, why not take the time to join the club, so you can enjoy posting on the forum, the BMW Owners News magazine, and all of the discounts and benefits the BMW MOA offers?

  • Beginning April 1st, and running through April 30th, there is a new 2024 BMW MOA Election discussion area within The Club section of the forum. Within this forum area is also a sticky post that provides the ground rules for participating in the Election forum area. Also, the candidates statements are provided. Please read before joining the conversation, because the rules are very specific to maintain civility.

    The Election forum is here: Election Forum

Dead R1100RS - Troubleshooting Tips?

bwanajames

New member
DSC_6516_Resized.jpg

A guy you never want to meet...

Greetings all,

I've been trying to revive my beloved R1100RS to no avail. :scratch I've gone through the basics, but she still won't spring to life. If any of you gurus have any handy suggestions :bow , I'd love to hear them! (P.S. I joined the ranks of the Beemer crowd two years ago, and have found that the people who ride them are half the reason for owning one. Really great folks. Thanks in advance!)

The Bike: 2000 R1100RS with 54k on the clock.

Symptoms/Behavior:

1. At idle, it seemed the bike would "stumble" a bit. It was instantaneous, but noticeable.

2. On a spirited run one day, reaching 90mph, but bike began to sputter, miss and lose power. But as soon as I backed off the throttle, it resumed normal operation.

3. The day it died: I was in the middle of nowhere, and attempting to pass a pick-up truck pulling a long horse trailer. To get around him, I started pouring on the coal. Just as I reached his front bumper (about 80mph) the bike again began to lose power. Backing off the throttle didn't help this time. It died in the act of passing. Fortunately I had enough momentum to get around the truck and coast to the shoulder without getting run over. :eek It never would restart, even when cool (a problematic Hall Effect Sensor (HES) will sometimes allow the bike to restart when cool. And, it was a clear day. No moisture to foul a deteriorating HES). A tow truck was called, and it's been dead ever since.

4. Now that its home, when I attempt to start the bike, the starter motor engages and the engine turns (ruling out faults in the side stand, clutch and kill switches...) but the sound it makes is rather curious: not that of simply an engine spinning, but it makes a "chugging" sound (like its trying to start) often accompanied by a backfire (timing?).

Checking the Basics:

Okay, before we get into this; I'd read a great deal about the known issue of failing HES sensors in the 1100 series (basically Bosch neglected to use high-temp wiring on the unit, leading to insulation degradation, and thus the commonly heard failures while riding in the rain, or just after a Sunday wash, etc.). Though I wasn't seeing the bouncing tach (another tell-tale sign of a failing HES...) when the bike quit, my mind immediately suspected the HES.

But, when I called up Beemer Boneyard to order a new one, I happened to mention what the bike was doing and he said: "Sounds more like a bad coil or leads..."

So, I've now installed the new HES (a good idea anyway...) and swapped in a coil and leads from a bike with half the miles (for testing) and have seen virtually no change in the bike's behavior (dead, chugs, backfires, won't start...)

Spark:

I've attached a spark tester (with the in-line light bulb) and have an orange spark on both cylinders (Actually, it looked a little weak. But I tested running bikes and it looks the same).

Fuel:

Fuel Pump: Turning the key, the whirring sound of the fuel pump pressurizing can be heard. This suggests that the pump is at least functional.
Injector Check: I've detached the fuel injectors and cranked the engine and witnessed a strong spray of atomized fuel. (Fuel starved at wide open throttle? Don't know. The fuel filter has 9k on it. Not new, but far from scheduled replacement. Plus the bike accelerated like a champ prior to dying. But it does seem high rpm related - at least that is when the symptoms showed up.)

Compression:

The bike ran strong until it quit, without any catastrophic sounds/feelings, etc. Even if compression were gone on one cylinder, it would still start/run on one (roughly of course, but it would run...).

Timing:
Beyond the HES, is there anything else that regulates timing? (other than the Motronic, of course...). While setting the HES, I took great pains to make and re-align to scribed baseplate lines from the original HES position, so I doubt it's off much. In fact, I'm told the slot latitude on the HES base plate is so narrow, that even if you adjusted it to the extreme end, the bike should still run...

So, there you have it. Any suggestions? :help

Jim in Colorado Springs
 
Last edited:
The fuel filter can be impaired with as little as a single tank of bad gas, and if partially blocked will generate the symptoms you've experienced. Having it new 9K miles ago is no guarantee that it's good now, and seeing some injector squirt while cranking the starter only requires a small proportion of the fuel delivery required at higher speeds and WOT.

I'd change the fuel filter first, and see if that improves things.
 
Last edited:
You described a classic fuel filter issue.

I'd go with the fuel filter first. There certainly is more but that's the simplest solution and the easiest.
 
Dave,
Yes, earlier when I was mentioning 9k on the filter, in the back of my mind I knew that just because the service interval wasn't up doesn't guarantee the filter is good. I'll replace it just to rule out that variable.

Thanks,
Jim
 
If your going to go inside the fuel tank......this sounds like an opportunity for you to install an out of the tank fuel filter
 
If your going to go inside the fuel tank......this sounds like an opportunity for you to install an out of the tank fuel filter

Jim,

Going in the tank is also a great opportunity to replace the in-tank rubber hoses, which age (just like everything else) - even if you leave the filter mounted inside. The bike is, after all, at least 15 or so years old.
 
Check your fuel pressure. Should be 40+ psi

if not,

It could be the rubber U tube inside the fuel tank has split open.
 
From symptoms it should be fuel related so I would say there is good chance it is ruptured line inside the tank
 
Speaking of Being Inside the Tank...

Thanks for the input guys! I'll get a fuel filter on order. The out-of-tank filter idea is also a winner (I think Paul Glaves did a pictorial on this a while back...). Dealing with bad gas in a third-world country would be a whole lot easier! While I had the tank off for the Hall Sensor, I did have the good sense to change out the external fuel lines to bio-fuel compatible FI lines (I hear ethanol eats up standard rubber) and install a brass quick-disconnect.

The pressure test is an outstanding suggestion, as is the replacement of internal hoses - I'll do both!

Now, speaking of being inside the tank: while I was reading your responses, I was reminded of a rather curious discovery made when last replacing the fuel filter; that is some rather large chucks of rubber debris floating in the tank. Swimming in fuel, the rubber had swelled to twice its size, but now appears to be consistent with a fuel plate o-ring. The question is: where is the rest of it, and how did it get there? :uhoh

DSC_7870_Rubber Debris in RS Tank_Resized.jpg
 
Last edited:
Besides what everyone else has accurately suggested, you might also want to make sure your fuel filler cap is venting properly.
 
WIX for Fuel Injection?

It's aftermarket, cheap, easily obtainable, fits a ton of Beemers, Wix 33032.

Yoda,

I got all excited when I saw your alternative filter source. But then went through my notes on this topic and found that smarter guys than me say they aren't comfortable with the WIX 60 psi burst rating. I've been getting Mann filters through Beemer Boneyard ($21.95) and Vallentine Motor Works. I hate shelling out for them and waiting for them to show up, but for the peace of mind, I'll grin & bear it...

WIX Fuel Filter 33032_Not on FI List.jpg
 
That's a really good one.

Besides what everyone else has accurately suggested, you might also want to make sure your fuel filler cap is venting properly.


Been hooped on more than one occasion forgetting the fuel cap vent. You would get good pressure on a pressure test but it would drop ever so slowly on flow after you displaced a good volume of fuel and not replace the same volume with air in the tank.
 
Going on the Checklist!

Besides what everyone else has accurately suggested, you might also want to make sure your fuel filler cap is venting properly.

LC Rider,
Yes, I just came across this handy tidbit in the Haynes manual. It's going on the checklist!

Thanks,
Jim
 
I've been using the WIX 33032 externally for several years and have had zero issues with it.
Note that this is the "universal" filter that is used in almost everything from Corollas to Caddys.
It also has barbed ends, so you can use hose clamps instead of the "F/I" clamps.

The rest of the O-ring was either properly recovered & tossed at the last change, or it's in the bottom of the tank (check both sides). Particles of that may be clogging your injectors. As to how it got there, that's a rhetorical question, right...?
 
Fuel Pump, Filter and Lines Replaced

Well, I hope this thread isn't so buried that it will never see the light of day, :gerg but I've made some progress (I think...). Based on the discoveries of a lot of folks these days, I understand there are a lot of internal fuel line failures going around. Most often, it's thought that ethanol is the prime suspect. The link below details the trials & tribulations of a fellow those symptoms mirrored my own: "Running fine with low throttle demands, stumbling wide open, until total failure refusing to start."

As he dove into his RT, he removed the tank's fuel plate and found the U-shaped hose going between the fuel filter and the outgoing supply line had cracks, splits and pin holes - as did the other two rubber hoses. Apparently these leaks weren't allowing proper pressure and fuel delivery at high demands.

Eureka! I thought... This has to be my problem! (Even if it wasn't, replacing those 14 year old fuel lines swimming in ethanol was a really good idea anyway. And with 54k on the clock, replacing the fuel pump might bring some piece of mind also).

So, I bought the kit offered by Beemerboneyard and installed it. Holding my breath, I cranked the engine. Nothing. It won't even begin to start. :sick

So, in addition to the new Hall Effect sensor, coil and leads, we can add: new fuel filter, new fuel pump, and new fuel lines, and I still have a dead RS. Sounds like I've got fuel & spark pretty well covered. Any suggestions? :banghead

http://bmwsporttouring.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=805502&page=1


BBY_Fuel Pump Kit.jpg


DSC_7892_Notes_Reduced.jpg
 
Last edited:
When you get tired of spending money you could resort to troubleshooting... :) that's where the pressure test suggestion came from. If you have pressure, all that stuff in the tank is not the problem. So, see if you have pressure. Hopefully you do since all of the in-tank stuff is new. You want 3 bar (just under 45 psi) on the lower hose going into the fuel distributor and it should stay there for a while when the pump shuts off.

Does the pump come on when you turn the key? Does it come on again if you crank the engine? Pull an injector out (leave it connected to the pipe and the wire); do you get strong and regular fuel sprays?
 
Jim:

When you took the tank off did you mark the 2 fuel lines so as to put them back the same way?
Or maybe you re-installed them backwards?
 
Jim:

Or maybe you re-installed them backwards?

That would deadhead the regulator, the fuel pressure would exceed 100psi.
I restricted the flow on a fuel pump a while ago and it is easily capable of those pressures, the pump gets very loud and I suspect a line would blow off after running for any period of time, no to mention probably blowing the FP fuse.
 
When you get tired of spending money you could resort to troubleshooting... :) that's where the pressure test suggestion came from. If you have pressure, all that stuff in the tank is not the problem. So, see if you have pressure. Hopefully you do since all of the in-tank stuff is new. You want 3 bar (just under 45 psi) on the lower hose going into the fuel distributor and it should stay there for a while when the pump shuts off.

Does the pump come on when you turn the key? Does it come on again if you crank the engine? Pull an injector out (leave it connected to the pipe and the wire); do you get strong and regular fuel sprays?

Anton,
I'm sure you've forgotten more about bikes than I'll ever know, so thanks for chiming in. Actually, I did check a few things before deciding to stimulate the economy. :nod One of the first things I did was pull each injector and found a strong atomized spray of fuel. (And of course, hooked up my in-line spark tester...) But one of the other fellows mentioned that the fuel demands at WOT would be considerably higher, and the spray I was seeing may not be adequate. Indeed, a pressure test would have been revealing, but I didn't have a tester at the time. (I've since acquired one, so stay tuned).

Yep, the (original) pump always had a confidence-inspiring whirring sound when turning the key (and judging by the spray, it's on when I'm cranking the engine...). As for throwing money at this beast, I don't feel the least bit bad. The HES is such a known issue with the 1100 series, that it was in the queue to replace even before the bike bit the dust. And with all the internal fuel line horror stories, I'm glad I replaced that stuff too. It's all good, I just wish I could get to the root of the problem. :dunno
 
Back
Top