I`m considering an 05 st , I`M RIDING AN 05 r and need more wind and rain protection w/o going to an RT as I like the Boxer engine and don`t want a dashboard in front of me. I ride all year in Ct. mostly to work and pleasure and wonder if it would be sufficant to do the job of keeping me warmer and cutting out the wind, my R has a touring windshield but it`s not enough.
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05 st owners opinions
- Thread starter skydog
- Start date
darrylri
Cannonball Rider #52
You should get more leg and lower body protection with the ST, but don't count on anything more from the waist up. The little screen does not do much, and changing the position, for me, makes no difference.
However, you'll be leaning forward more than on the R, so you might not feel the wind as much.
Hope this is of some help.
However, you'll be leaning forward more than on the R, so you might not feel the wind as much.
Hope this is of some help.
grasslander
riding the bike(s)
Protection
I ride a 05 ST with the stock shield. I'm 5'10" and tour with the bars in the high position and the stock seat front high and back low covered with an Alaskan skin. I always wear my Arai Profile helmet. I raise the screen for freeway riding and bad weather. Surprisingly good coverage up to my shoulder tops and down to my feet. Pretty much the same as my '77 R100RS with a bit less hand protection. When the temps get super high I lower the screen for more wind flow.
The wind off that stock screen is very clean. The ST is very underrated on the Freeway. I recently did a 920 day from Green River, UT to Overbrook, KS and felt great!
When I sport ride, I lower the bars and windscreen fully, raise the seat completely to high, and wear my knee pucks. ;-)
I ride a 05 ST with the stock shield. I'm 5'10" and tour with the bars in the high position and the stock seat front high and back low covered with an Alaskan skin. I always wear my Arai Profile helmet. I raise the screen for freeway riding and bad weather. Surprisingly good coverage up to my shoulder tops and down to my feet. Pretty much the same as my '77 R100RS with a bit less hand protection. When the temps get super high I lower the screen for more wind flow.
The wind off that stock screen is very clean. The ST is very underrated on the Freeway. I recently did a 920 day from Green River, UT to Overbrook, KS and felt great!
When I sport ride, I lower the bars and windscreen fully, raise the seat completely to high, and wear my knee pucks. ;-)
dockeithdc
innate need to improve
The 05 ST is a great bike to ride all year long. Here in PA, there was no problem riding all winter with good gloves with heated grips and a BMW plug-in vest. The only issue I had with the ST is the wrist fatigue and stiffness due to the ride position. I changed to the RT and haven't looked back!!
108625
New member
I just sold my '05 ST this year, and don't miss it.
(If it helps, I'm 6' & 200 lbs.)
On a positive note, I will say it handled better than I thought it would, I was able to get to the edges of the tire with it. (And we sure ate tires; four sets in 17,000 miles.) However, it always felt a little wallowy in the back and vague in general. The '05 servo brakes sucked. I learned to work with them, but never learned to feel them. (Or maybe it was my hands being put to sleep by the vibes.)
The rev limiter was very frustrating, it cuts power drastically and without warning.
The bar position never bothered me, I like sportier bikes. The problem was everything else about it.
The fairing is worse than no fairing at all. I don't know who designed it or if they ever put anyone on it in a wind tunnel. If they did, it must have been a jockey. The wind splits around the sides of the rider from about the top of the screen down, where you need the least protection. The windscreen should be renamed an agitator; no matter what position it was in, it seemed to make things worse. I was getting buffeted about the head, neck and shoulders in the low position, and from the neck up in the high position. The solid line of bugspots across and up my gear was becoming disgusting. My old airhead with it's little S fairing felt better moving through the wind.
The bodywork around the "tank" seemed to serve no purpose other than to make the bike fatter than an R model, and force the rider to spread their legs wider. These bikes have the potential to be narrower than many others, yet they're not, and for no justifiable reason.
The footpegs are placed awkwardly as well, when I was leaned over, I was always forced to pull my feet back and tuck my toes in, and then when stopped, they were perfectly placed to interfere with putting my feet down where they seemed to naturally want to go.
The seat, Good Lord, what vile deed had I done to deserve that cruel torture?
I've rode sport bikes and dirt bikes with better seats, and certainly no bike I ever spent time on violated my sensibilities like that thing. I heard the stock low seat was better, so I bought one of those used and tried it. Better, yes; in that getting burned by sitting on an iron is probably better than getting burned by sitting on a blacksmith's forge.
Lastly, I'd mention the vibes, but as you're already a hexhead R bike owner, you've either accepted them or they've already numbed your nerves to the point you can't feel them.
In short, I thought the ST was a good idea; poorly executed, or at best, unfinished.
It really should have given BMW a nice sport-tour with the emphasis on sport, like the Honda VFR, Aprilia Futura, Triumph Sprint & so-on. But with hate-it-or-learn-to-live-with-it-looks, more tour-than-sport soft suspension, and no more power than the naked R model it was priced so much higher than, it's no wonder it withered in the line and died.
I eventually accepted it wasn't going to get any better without me spending the extra dough for aftermarket suspension, rearsets, a windscreen, a custom seat, and so-on, and still have to live with the brakes, vibes, and girth. I just didn't like it enough to justify all that.
(If it helps, I'm 6' & 200 lbs.)
On a positive note, I will say it handled better than I thought it would, I was able to get to the edges of the tire with it. (And we sure ate tires; four sets in 17,000 miles.) However, it always felt a little wallowy in the back and vague in general. The '05 servo brakes sucked. I learned to work with them, but never learned to feel them. (Or maybe it was my hands being put to sleep by the vibes.)
The rev limiter was very frustrating, it cuts power drastically and without warning.
The bar position never bothered me, I like sportier bikes. The problem was everything else about it.
The fairing is worse than no fairing at all. I don't know who designed it or if they ever put anyone on it in a wind tunnel. If they did, it must have been a jockey. The wind splits around the sides of the rider from about the top of the screen down, where you need the least protection. The windscreen should be renamed an agitator; no matter what position it was in, it seemed to make things worse. I was getting buffeted about the head, neck and shoulders in the low position, and from the neck up in the high position. The solid line of bugspots across and up my gear was becoming disgusting. My old airhead with it's little S fairing felt better moving through the wind.
The bodywork around the "tank" seemed to serve no purpose other than to make the bike fatter than an R model, and force the rider to spread their legs wider. These bikes have the potential to be narrower than many others, yet they're not, and for no justifiable reason.
The footpegs are placed awkwardly as well, when I was leaned over, I was always forced to pull my feet back and tuck my toes in, and then when stopped, they were perfectly placed to interfere with putting my feet down where they seemed to naturally want to go.
The seat, Good Lord, what vile deed had I done to deserve that cruel torture?
I've rode sport bikes and dirt bikes with better seats, and certainly no bike I ever spent time on violated my sensibilities like that thing. I heard the stock low seat was better, so I bought one of those used and tried it. Better, yes; in that getting burned by sitting on an iron is probably better than getting burned by sitting on a blacksmith's forge.
Lastly, I'd mention the vibes, but as you're already a hexhead R bike owner, you've either accepted them or they've already numbed your nerves to the point you can't feel them.
In short, I thought the ST was a good idea; poorly executed, or at best, unfinished.
It really should have given BMW a nice sport-tour with the emphasis on sport, like the Honda VFR, Aprilia Futura, Triumph Sprint & so-on. But with hate-it-or-learn-to-live-with-it-looks, more tour-than-sport soft suspension, and no more power than the naked R model it was priced so much higher than, it's no wonder it withered in the line and died.
I eventually accepted it wasn't going to get any better without me spending the extra dough for aftermarket suspension, rearsets, a windscreen, a custom seat, and so-on, and still have to live with the brakes, vibes, and girth. I just didn't like it enough to justify all that.
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grasslander
riding the bike(s)
Did you and I ride the same bike? I can agree with the servo issue. I bought a non ABS to get real brakes.
LENRT1200ST
New member
Wow! Sour grapes!
I have a 2006, ST and I love it! Mine has ESA and can be dialed into proper suspension settings for just about any situation; sole, two up, super slab or back road blast, etc. I'd really miss this feature if it was not offered on my next bike. Wallowing in the corners, never had a problem w/ this bike. If it does give a hint, I know I've not set her up properly for the riding conditions, that's all. Try riding a Triumph Bonneville at speed around an 80 mph sweeper, if you was a see real wallowing! Woo Hoo!
BTW- I'm 5' 11 3/4" tall, nearly 62 years old, and weigh 215 pounds.
I replaced the stock windshield w/ Cee Bailey's Euro screen and spend a bit on bar risers (Verholen) which bring the bars up about 1" and back about 3/4" toward me. It's not prefect, but much improved over stock. I do wish the handlebars were a little bit higher and further back for my aging body. Were talking a few inches here, not ape hangers!
Brakes - It's a learning experience. Maybe the 2006 system is a little more sorted, but I've become accustomed to the initial bite and the bike functions flawlessly and w/out intruding on my ride. Anti-lock feature... priceless!
Bodywork - The plastic around the tank makes it very easy and natural for me to grip the tank during spirited runs. I like the way the fairing protects my upper body during rain showers and while riding in cold weather. The only part of my that gets wet while in motion are my feet. Gore-Tex to the rescue!
Engine - What can I say? Wow, 110 hp and gobs of mid-range torque. This thing will flat out fly through the corners. Always willing to accelerate, w/ little need to drop a gear for a quick corner exit. Sweet! On the super slab... she feels stable the faster you go. Sorta hunkers down and hauls the mail.
It eats tires, cause my riding style eats tires. And I believe it eats tire because I ride on many roads that are rough, stone chip construction, and not smooth.
BTW - I rode the tire off my VFR 750F and I find the two bikes if not very similar in layout, very comparable in execution.
In all, maybe its the difference a model year makes between the 2006 and 2005 ST, but I love the thing.
Len
PS - I've been looking to replace my current bike, so these features and riding opinions are fresh in my mind. So far, I can't find a suitable replacement that does all the things I demand of a motorcycle as well as the R1200ST.
grasslander
riding the bike(s)
"The '05 servo brakes sucked"
I had servo brakes on my old 2004 KGT. The key was one(1) finger. That's all you needed for max braking. But I'm not a fan either.
"Wallowy in the corners"
Sounds like not enough rebound damping. I have seen this on the ST and non Ohlins "S" rear shock. You get no rebound till you set it to 1 turn from full slow. My stock was set to 3/4 turn from full. As the shock wears this gets worse. The best thing I did for my ST was switch to Ohlins. But even with a good stock shock it didn't "wallowy". If you saw my ST at Heartland park last week you know it was solid everywhere and my knee was pretty solid on the ground while cornering.
"The rev limiter was very frustrating, it cuts power drastically and without warning."
The warning was your tach in the red and moving to max red line. I found the bike works better with a bit of a short shift to stay in the meat of the torque. Practice my friend. All rev limiters are abrupt.
I have ridden all the bikes you mentioned. They are great machines. The only one my wife would consider riding was the Aprillia. Nice machine good luck on parts. The VFR and Sprint have worse seats than the ST. I too have looked for what I could replace my ST with. I have found nothing that improves on it's package. No the RT is 110 lbs heavier.
Pray tell. What did you replace your ST with. I'm curious... An FJR? (of course that's a K bike alternative)
I had servo brakes on my old 2004 KGT. The key was one(1) finger. That's all you needed for max braking. But I'm not a fan either.
"Wallowy in the corners"
Sounds like not enough rebound damping. I have seen this on the ST and non Ohlins "S" rear shock. You get no rebound till you set it to 1 turn from full slow. My stock was set to 3/4 turn from full. As the shock wears this gets worse. The best thing I did for my ST was switch to Ohlins. But even with a good stock shock it didn't "wallowy". If you saw my ST at Heartland park last week you know it was solid everywhere and my knee was pretty solid on the ground while cornering.
"The rev limiter was very frustrating, it cuts power drastically and without warning."
The warning was your tach in the red and moving to max red line. I found the bike works better with a bit of a short shift to stay in the meat of the torque. Practice my friend. All rev limiters are abrupt.
I have ridden all the bikes you mentioned. They are great machines. The only one my wife would consider riding was the Aprillia. Nice machine good luck on parts. The VFR and Sprint have worse seats than the ST. I too have looked for what I could replace my ST with. I have found nothing that improves on it's package. No the RT is 110 lbs heavier.
Pray tell. What did you replace your ST with. I'm curious... An FJR? (of course that's a K bike alternative)
108625
New member
Thanks for all the tutelage grasslander.
It never dawned on me not to hamhandedly grab the brakes with all my might, or to adjust my shock damping. I suppose I should have rode with my eyes on the tach needle at all times as well, instead of the road.
Two years and seventeen thousand miles, often consisting of 300-500 mile days, on twisty mountain roads and wide open prairie and desert highways must not count as practice, either. I guess those four sets of tires burned themselves off.
Maybe I should buy the bike back and give it another go, following your sage inputs.
Nah, I think I'll stick with the VFR800 I replaced it with (to answer your question).
My wife rides her own bike, so all she cares about is whether or not I'm happy with it.
It never dawned on me not to hamhandedly grab the brakes with all my might, or to adjust my shock damping. I suppose I should have rode with my eyes on the tach needle at all times as well, instead of the road.
Two years and seventeen thousand miles, often consisting of 300-500 mile days, on twisty mountain roads and wide open prairie and desert highways must not count as practice, either. I guess those four sets of tires burned themselves off.
Maybe I should buy the bike back and give it another go, following your sage inputs.
Nah, I think I'll stick with the VFR800 I replaced it with (to answer your question).
My wife rides her own bike, so all she cares about is whether or not I'm happy with it.
LENRT1200ST
New member
Dear 108625,Thanks for all the tutelage grasslander.
It never dawned on me not to hamhandedly grab the brakes with all my might, or to adjust my shock damping. I suppose I should have rode with my eyes on the tach needle at all times as well, instead of the road.
Two years and seventeen thousand miles, often consisting of 300-500 mile days, on twisty mountain roads and wide open prairie and desert highways must not count as practice, either. I guess those four sets of tires burned themselves off.
Maybe I should buy the bike back and give it another go, following your sage inputs.
Nah, I think I'll stick with the VFR800 I replaced it with (to answer your question).
My wife rides her own bike, so all she cares about is whether or not I'm happy with it.
Screw the tachometer. You should be able to "feel" the revs w/ your largest contact patch. And no, I don't think mine is interchangeable w/ my head... thank you verrrrry much!
The tach is a distraction, as is gazing at the speedo when the going gets twisted. Keep your eyes on the raod, your mind and spirit on riding to your best ability, and take the comments and opinions a little less personally, please. We are only trying to counter your neagtive view of the R1200ST w/ our own experience and positive opinions. As w/ anything, opinions and experiences differ.
Regards,
Len
108625
New member
Len,
Rather than "trying to counter my negative view of the ST", shouldn't we be trying to answer the original question? The opinions of those who have experience with the bike were solicited. You gave yours, I gave mine. If we disagree about the bike, fine. But questioning someone's riding skills, or offering such basic advice as to suggest they never tried or learned anything in two years of riding the bike is basically an attempt to criticize the critic.
I didn't like a bike you like. Get over it. I did it from as knowledgeable and experienced a standpoint as any one who praised the bike. I did it without attempting to undermine the credibility of anyone who gave a positive opinion, or question how they came to their conclusions.
Skydog can read them all and make up his own mind, without any of us trying to help him by discrediting opinions different from our own.
Bob
P.S. I bought the bike didn't I? Albeit only because it was a heavily discounted left-over. I really tried to make the best of it and like the bike, but as I said, needless girth, and other issues that could not be changed, overruled the going to the extra expense of trying to set right the few issues that would have been correctable... and should not have been there in the first place, if a manufacturer who places a premium on their products would deliver products deserving of those premiums.
Rather than "trying to counter my negative view of the ST", shouldn't we be trying to answer the original question? The opinions of those who have experience with the bike were solicited. You gave yours, I gave mine. If we disagree about the bike, fine. But questioning someone's riding skills, or offering such basic advice as to suggest they never tried or learned anything in two years of riding the bike is basically an attempt to criticize the critic.
I didn't like a bike you like. Get over it. I did it from as knowledgeable and experienced a standpoint as any one who praised the bike. I did it without attempting to undermine the credibility of anyone who gave a positive opinion, or question how they came to their conclusions.
Skydog can read them all and make up his own mind, without any of us trying to help him by discrediting opinions different from our own.
Bob
P.S. I bought the bike didn't I? Albeit only because it was a heavily discounted left-over. I really tried to make the best of it and like the bike, but as I said, needless girth, and other issues that could not be changed, overruled the going to the extra expense of trying to set right the few issues that would have been correctable... and should not have been there in the first place, if a manufacturer who places a premium on their products would deliver products deserving of those premiums.
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grasslander
riding the bike(s)
Bob-
Thanks for answering my question. The VFR is a fine bike.
Thanks for answering my question. The VFR is a fine bike.
LENRT1200ST
New member
Len,
I didn't like a bike you like. Get over it. I did it from as knowledgeable and experienced a standpoint as any one who praised the bike. I did it without attempting to undermine the credibility of anyone who gave a positive opinion, or question how they came to their conclusions.
Bob
I waited a while before answering your post, hopefully I'm more tolerant of your "get over it" statement after a day's cool down. I hope I not being hostile. I meant no disrespect to you or your riding abilities in my comments about the ST.
What do I need to "get over"? I used no derogatory statements or personal attacks in my post, so why the attitude toward me? I'm not trying to point fingers, but Grasslander pointed out the braking and set up question, if I remember correctly. But, even so, I don't think he was attacking your competency or credibility, as much as stating his experiences w/ the ST.
While you may feel compelled to defend yourself, that's your problem. If your credibility or riding ineptitude is in question, you may need to get over it! I didn't question or defame either! If you are a competent rider, knowledgeable about set up and control of you bike, are constantly improving your skills, etc. then there is no need for you to defend yourself or make smart remarks like "get over it" to me.
I could give a good healthy rat butt about what you like or dislike, frankly. Love the VFR, more power to you!
Some of us are satisfied w/ the ST and others have made modification to the basic platform in an effort to adapt it to their riding style and needs. The bike has its flaws, no doubt about it. I live w/ some of them and try to change others for the better. You are not a believer, and have voted w/ your pocketbook, purchasing a VFR. Fine, I wish you many miles of safe travel.
Without your side of the ST question how is Skydog to make an informed decision? I'm proud to counter your negative view of the ST. and I assure you I am so over your repugnance for it.
Len
BuffaloBob
Herding Cats
I have owned a 2005 ST for a couple of months, coming off an '02 RS.
I like the fairing/windscreen on the ST - it provides quieter air at the helmet level than the RS did. I haven't had the opportunity to ride in a drenching rain yet, but the light showers I've encountered haven't dampened (sorry) my enthusiasm for the level of protection. My ST does have bar risers, by the way.
I like the fairing/windscreen on the ST - it provides quieter air at the helmet level than the RS did. I haven't had the opportunity to ride in a drenching rain yet, but the light showers I've encountered haven't dampened (sorry) my enthusiasm for the level of protection. My ST does have bar risers, by the way.
St
Skydog,
I have an 05 ST and I think it's great. For a small windshield, it does a surprisingly good job. I rode up to NC, Va, and Tenn in late May and got caught in some unseasonably cool weather with temps around freezing. I only had my summer riding gear (with liner) and found it was just enough to keep going. The fairing does nothing to protect your hands from the elements but the grip heaters are much better than the previous generation. The whizzy brakes definately take some getting used to, but will haul you down quickly from any speed with little effort. I've owned 5 BMW's over the years and think the ST is by far the best one. Try to find one you can test ride. I think you will enjoy it.
MB
Skydog,
I have an 05 ST and I think it's great. For a small windshield, it does a surprisingly good job. I rode up to NC, Va, and Tenn in late May and got caught in some unseasonably cool weather with temps around freezing. I only had my summer riding gear (with liner) and found it was just enough to keep going. The fairing does nothing to protect your hands from the elements but the grip heaters are much better than the previous generation. The whizzy brakes definately take some getting used to, but will haul you down quickly from any speed with little effort. I've owned 5 BMW's over the years and think the ST is by far the best one. Try to find one you can test ride. I think you will enjoy it.
MB
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St
We own two 05 Sts, a his and hers. My husand's St is stock and that is the way he likes it. He had a 2000 1100RS and enjoys this bike much more. I have made some adjustments to mine by adding a Cee Bailey windshield, verholen bar risers and the factory low seat. I used to ride a 1999 R1100R and wanted a little more protection from the weather.
This is a great bike, it does protect me from the rain more than the 1100R and the windshield does the best job on the upper body. The factory windshield and the Cee Bailey are very interchangeable.
Hope you enjoy the bike!
We own two 05 Sts, a his and hers. My husand's St is stock and that is the way he likes it. He had a 2000 1100RS and enjoys this bike much more. I have made some adjustments to mine by adding a Cee Bailey windshield, verholen bar risers and the factory low seat. I used to ride a 1999 R1100R and wanted a little more protection from the weather.
This is a great bike, it does protect me from the rain more than the 1100R and the windshield does the best job on the upper body. The factory windshield and the Cee Bailey are very interchangeable.
Hope you enjoy the bike!
I love mine, like others have said i have been looking for a bike to replace it but haven't found anything yet that will do the job. Skydog if you're interested i could meet you at the Vanilla Bean in Pomfret some Sat or Sun and we could swap bikes for a while. I like riding different bikes and it would give you a chance to try out an ST.
Brian
bdanderson72@hotmail.com
Brian
bdanderson72@hotmail.com
