VIN Vehicle Identification Number : 1975 R90S

[RonKMiller]

I sent the seller another email communication but this time asking how he might propose to make this situation a better one. After all, I purchased an item that really isn't what it was made out to be, and shame on me for not asking him to supply VIN verification prior to purchasing the motorcycle. The funny thing is that in all of the bikes that I have sold publicly no one ever asked me to supply that kind of verification either.

Alas

I wouldn't kick yourself too hard. You were dealing in good faith.

You have every right to expect you were being sold a motor vehicle with an appropriate and unadulterated VIN. Altering a VIN - no matter what the excuse - is pretty serious stuff. I don't for one second believe that it was shipped from Germany without one.

I think this "reputable" seller has got some serious splainin' to do.

 

[EMSimon]

My guess is, somebody had an R90S motor and built a R90S by sticking it into a non-R90S frame. Considering the prices the S models currently command, it is a tempting thing to do for crooks and their likes.
I know a guy who "built" one of these rare R100S "Motorsports" and passes it off as original.

 

[oalvarez]

the seller responded and stated that he had no problem taking the bike back and compensating me.

thank you to the board for all of the help and assistance up to now.

regards,

 

[Fourcats]

I'm curious, did you get a "blue sticker" for the frame?

 

[johntena]

the seller responded and stated that he had no problem taking the bike back and compensating me.

thank you to the board for all of the help and assistance up to now.

regards,

BTW, you should join the international R90S group that is separate from the MOA. Lots of information about this bike. Link
From that list, I recall that one can buy a new frame from the BMW factory. The new frame does not have any serial number. Once you join up, you might be able to do a search of the archives.
Where in CA are you?

 

[535IS]

I know a guy who "built" one of these rare R100S "Motorsports" and passes it off as original.

Sadly, that's all too easy to do for this 'edition'. You just need an RS VIN that falls within the 1978 production range because the Motorsports weren't produced all at once or sequentially. Further, we really don't even know what that range is. It could be the entire 1978 model year.

OTOH, the rare piece for one of these is not the paint job or any particular equipment, but the blue seat. These suckers, and any new covers, are impossible to find; at least at any reasonable price. If you don't have one, even in crappy condition, the originality of your bike has to be in question.

 

[toooldtocare]

Sadly, that's all too easy to do for this 'edition'. You just need an RS VIN that falls within the 1978 production range because the Motorsports weren't produced all at once or sequentially. Further, we really don't even know what that range is. It could be the entire 1978 model year.

OTOH, the rare piece for one of these is not the paint job or any particular equipment, but the blue seat. These suckers, and any new covers, are impossible to find; at least at any reasonable price. If you don't have one, even in crappy condition, the originality of your bike has to be in question.

Fully agree. I have seen several bikes passed off as Motorsports, all with black seats. Some of them were not even 78 models. I am lucky in having both the 3/4 and full length seat in blue and they are in great shape. Another think is the white bags. Mine long time ago faded to yellow and were replaced with black ones. The only other think that I know that made them different and often over looked by the person making a clone is the blue brake line from the rear reservoir to the rear master cylinder.

 

[bikerfish1100]

iirc, bags were an option on all models except for the RT at the time. White or black were available, but not "part of" the bike.

 

[535IS]

Fully agree. I have seen several bikes passed off as Motorsports, all with black seats. Some of them were not even 78 models. I am lucky in having both the 3/4 and full length seat in blue and they are in great shape. Another think is the white bags. Mine long time ago faded to yellow and were replaced with black ones.

Krylon Fusion Dover White semigloss is a very close match for that. That's why mine are still white. I've even tracked down a spare set of white ones (also need paint/cleaning) since I think they look so good on here. Most of the Motorsports I've seen equipped with white bags were European ones, but bikerfish is right. They apparently weren't standard equipment.

The only other thing that I know that made them different and often over looked by the person making a clone is the blue brake line from the rear reservoir to the rear master cylinder.

That's blue?

 

[8ninety8]

Illegal?

This may be obvious, but, isn't any alteration of any VIN number of any vehicle in any state, by statute, illegal?

And certainly there are fines if not felonies now attached to such activity?

My '74 90S has the numbers in the obvious places others have noted.

The high gloss gusset plate on the orange 90S looks to have been filled and sanded smooth. I can't imagine doing this accidently. Removing the paint on this area likely will reveal orginal frame number? Unless it was welded?

 

[toooldtocare]

A blue hose has been on all the Motorsports that I have seen that are real. Of course, it could have also been changed due to leaks, etc. However, this is another thing I was told to look for when I got my bike by persons of knowledge.

 

[toooldtocare]

Another photo of a blue hose on a Motorsport, not my bike. Guess when it gets dirty it looks darker.

 

[bikerfish1100]

that blue hose does ring a visual bell for me.

my "to be resurrected" Motorsport will not be presented as an "original", although i know from the title and the 1st owner that i bought it from that it is/was a real deal Msport. not no more tho.
oh well, me thinks it will be accepted as a NFB- "Nice F***ng Beemer", regardless.

 

[535IS]

that blue hose does ring a visual bell for me.

Damn. Me, too. Now I'll have to drag out to the barn to look at it. I know it's filthy - but it might be blue, too.

 

[eastbay]

looked all over for the vin on my r80 frame, it is on the frame tube down by the rear brake lever.

 

[stevenrankin]

New Frames

So I am joining in late to this post. I had a 78RS, the serial number is stamped on the frame clearly and no, powder coat didn't cover it, it is deeply stamped. For NY, the frame number is the bike number for all papers.

So, now, the RS is totaled, badly bent frame. I am online at Max BMW and see new frames for sale. I call Max and find that yes in the past you could get a new blank/unstamped frame from BMW. When the frame was ordered by a BMW dealer, the dealer could stamp whatever VIN number was on the old frame to be replaced. This posed NO problem with at least NY title or registration as long as a salvage title HAD NOT been issued for the damaged bike.

So, blank frames could be bought, wether a dealer would sell them to an individual I don't know, but at least the dealers could buy and stamp frames.

LOL, so I am now trying to determine if NY would be so easy as to allow me to grind off a number on a used frame, let me stamp it with my existing number (no salvage title involved) but try getting through to someone with the answer on the phones of internet. It is a shame to have a good bike sit for parts.

If anything is worth counterfeiting, it will be done. I myself really get sick of seeing R90S bikes listed for sale that are not, or RS Motorsport bikes that are not. The VIN number on the frame tells the story and if there is no Vin number, run away from buying. St.