So what's the probem with two finger braking?

[mneblett]

Moreover, unless the bike has an ABS capability, executing a managed threshhold braking maneuver with four fingers while undergoing the whole adrenlin surge reaction on such a setup might prove uncontrollably difficult, sending the braking force right through the desired pressure for controlled threshhold braking and into lock-up.

I respectfully disagree -- but only to the extent that the "panic" reaction/grip would be a justification for avoiding four-finger braking. If you have not practiced braking - regularly - to know where the threshold is (and done so in different conditions), then whether two-fingered or four-fingered, you stand the chance of locking up the front from over-application of the brake lever.

Put another way, I wouldn't think anyone would justify relying on two-finger braking because they thought it would reduce their ability to brake enough that they could avoid the possibly over-braking!

Great technical discussion. Thanks!

Agreed!

 

[BCKRider]

Yes, the best discussion I've yet read on a subject which is controversial for many reasons. While I have fifteen riding seasons under my belt, describing me as an "intermediate" rider might be charitable. Any criticism of much more experienced riders who are also MSF coaches (thank you!) should be taken as an honest attempt to get the best information that I can apply to my riding; not criticism of anything except possibly the clarity of your communication on this forum.

Andy VH wrote (post #3) "As a rider develops the skill sets of braking and throttle, then a blended use of two-finger and four-finger braking is good. But the point is, the rider MUST develop and practice the skills to know what works best when needed." Either that is bad advice, or good advice for a person with much more dexterous fingers than mine who can instantly change from two to four fingers when the slow down turns into a fast stop.

Mark Veblett wrote (post #6) words to the effect that even people who can apply full braking with two fingers on a practice range often fail to do that in real traffic. That sounds strange to me. I think I would be motivated to squeeze even harder when confronted with a stationery car/deer, etc.

Greenwald also mentions (post #15) the possibility of "throttle interference" with two finger braking. No question, that is a real possibility. But I think the answer is just to pull in the clutch whenever you need to stop as opposed to slow down.

Here is MY summary of the advice so far - and definitely open to revision:

1. Four-finger braking is the MSF standard instruction - partly because for new riders it separates throttle and front brake. It is a VERY GOOD IDEA for even more experienced riders to repeat this drill of "threshold braking" at gradually increasing speeds with four fingers in a parking lot or backroad with no following traffic.

2. Repeat the "threshold braking" exercise with two fingers. If two fingers can bring you to the point of a skid or activate the ABS, then two finger braking is probably for you. If not, you should use four fingers on the brake lever always.

3. Controlling the throttle (as opposed to simply letting it close) is more difficult with four finger braking than two finger braking. I suggest the controlling factor is the number of fingers you need for a maximum effort stop. If you need four fingers for a maximum stop effort, figure out how you can control the throttle and always use four fingers on the brake lever.

4. The tendency for two finger brakers to unintentially open the throttle is real and needs to be addressed. The first answer, of course, is regular practice so you don't. The second answer is that a stop means pulling in the clutch so that your real brakes (not engine braking) do the job.

Hope this is advancing the conversation.

 

[35634]

and if a deer jumps out and whacks you in the side it doesn't matter if you got ten fingers and 5 toes on the brakes

 

[BCKRider]

35634 is right that there is absolutely nothing you can do about a deer leaping onto your bike. And I'm sure it has happened many times.

Curious how this fits the discussion of best braking practices.

 

[dwestly]

Great discussion points... Thanks for continuing the topic!