The engine turns over (so it's not the starter and I don't think it's the alternator) but the bike won't start. I thought that maybe it was a weak battery (over two years old) so a bought a new odyssey. Bike is in neutral and I pull in the clutch. The kill switch is off. I even made sure the kick stand was up. I store in in the garage it's been in the 30's. I keep a trickle charge on it. I rode it not even a week ago. The only things I can think of are bad gas or the spark plugs aren't sparking. If I was more of a mechanic or the plugs more accessible I'd pull then out and turn the engine to see if there is a spark. If it was carburetor I'd check the distributor but I guess on fuel injection what feeds the spark plugs is computer generated. It may be something I can't fix by myself. Any ideas on what else I can check?
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2008 R1200RT won't start
- Thread starter CJRIDE
- Start date
bikerfish1100
New member
a few thoughts, no answers:
#1) share some sounds of what the bike does when you try to start it, if you please.
#2) has it ever done this before?
#3) were any changes made to the bike prior to failure to start?
#4) your bike is a hexhead. you'll get better responses there.
#5) Moderator- cleanup on aisle 9.
#1) share some sounds of what the bike does when you try to start it, if you please.
#2) has it ever done this before?
#3) were any changes made to the bike prior to failure to start?
#4) your bike is a hexhead. you'll get better responses there.
#5) Moderator- cleanup on aisle 9.
Welcome to to the forum CJ, It's too bad you landed with a first post with a problem. I'm going to move your post to the Hexhead/Camhead area. I'm sure the guys can give you some Ideas. Good luck, Gary
sailorlite
New member
When you turn the key to the Start position, can you hear the fuel pump run briefly? If not, then I'd suspect the fuel pump controller is intermittent or just dead.
I don't think you'd suddenly have "bad gas" or four failed sparkplugs. Also, if the kill switch, sidestand switch or clutch switch has failed the engine wouldn't turn over at all when you hit the start button.
And anyway, isn't your bike still under warranty? Maybe BMW will haul your bike to the dealer for diagnosis and repair.
I don't think you'd suddenly have "bad gas" or four failed sparkplugs. Also, if the kill switch, sidestand switch or clutch switch has failed the engine wouldn't turn over at all when you hit the start button.
And anyway, isn't your bike still under warranty? Maybe BMW will haul your bike to the dealer for diagnosis and repair.
T
thundley
Guest
Hopefully you are a BOA member and receive the ON magazine. If so, see this months (December) issue, page 32, "Two RT's that could not start" section of the "Keep'emFlying" article. Could be your problem 
thundley
2007 R1200RT
thundley
2007 R1200RT
That's a good idea. Looks like he just joined, if he hasn't received the magazine yet he can look at Owners News online. Here is the Link....http://www.bmwmoa.org/ownersnews/on_onlineHopefully you are a BOA member and receive the ON magazine. If so, see this months (December) issue, page 32, "Two RT's that could not start" section of the "Keep'emFlying" article. Could be your problem
thundley
2007 R1200RT
Jay is a friend of mine and I can tell you he rode out of the BMW warranty about 6 months ago.
He bought the extended warranty, so hopefully that should cover him.
The symptoms are consistent with a dead fuel pump controller IF in addition to what you described, you do not hear the fuel pump run for a couple seconds when you turn the key.
Your problem is precisely what the GS-911 (from hexcode) is good at- providing the codes for electrical issues. It would throw one or more of several possible codes showing no power at the fuel pump, if your fpc is in fact dead. The GS-911 is great for speeding up electrical troubleshooting of many problems, though it is not an absolute necessity IF you are well versed in how modern closed loop fuel injected stuff operates.
Your 08 RT has an OEM fpc that is plain metal. They fail A LOT due to a whole lot of issues that can be summed up by saying 1) the fpc design itself is defective in several ways and 2) it sits in a well on top of the fuel tank that collects water and it is that water that reveals the various flaws and causes the fpc to fail. Based on what is publicly reported and allowing for the fact that most failures won't get reported in web available totals, I'd estimate something north of 2000 of these have failed on late model BMWs like your 08RT- the part is common across hexheads and the defective well design is essentially the same on the GS family and the RT.
The "field fix" is very easy and only takes a few minutes. If you can't hear the pump run when you turn the key, this should get your bike running again.
1) Remove the tupperware piece over the fuel pump. Take 4, T-25 screws removed and its off. No need to pull anything else.
2) Remove the fpc from the bike (Its the bare metal finned thing that has a 3 wire plug going to it. Remove the plug and the 2, T-20 screws holding it on and pull it up. Then remove the 2 wire blue plastic connector under it that connects directly to the top of the fuel pump)
3) If you see a bunch of water in the well, and even a little corrosion around the bottom of the fpc you removed it is certainly dead. The fpc passes the 7A it takes to run the fuel pump and gets warm doing that- which is why it has fins. When it cools, it sucks water in, mostly through the ineffective silicone seal at the bottom of it and corrodes the board inside- you can peel the sealer easily with a pocket knife if you want to see the board damage- it won't be huge wads but even the tinest bit is more than enough to kill the board.
4) Make a bypass cable by cutting the blue plug off the bottom of the fpc. You will connect the blue wire on it to ground (brown wires on your bike) and the yellow to a 12V source. The result will be that the pump will run continually which is fine until you can get a new fpc to install. There are 2 easy ways to make these connections and you can pick which suits you
a) Connect it back to the wires going to the 3 wire plug that went to the fpc.
Just scrape of some insulation, connect the yellow from the plug to the blue/green on the bike and the blue to brown. Then put the blue plug back on the fuel pump and you're done. If you do this one neatly, you can leave the bypass plug permanently installed on the bike for the next time your fpc dies.
b) Connect the plug to an accessory cord going to the accessory outlet of your bike. Your 08RT will supply 10A at the outlet and will run the 7A pump with no difficulty- note that this version of the bypass does not apply to models that only supply 5A to the accessory plug. Connect the yellow wire from the plug to the center connector of the plug and the blue wire to the outer connection of the plug so polarity is correct. If you make this version, you can carry it on the bike for use the next time your fpc fails.
The new fpc you will eventually get is black powder coated- that coating addresses only 1 of several possible ways it dies and the new part will also fail if it gets wet enough. To minimize that possibility, a bit of gease or silicon sealer should be used around the gasket of the fpc when a new one is installed but recognize that this is a band aid for a bad design and not a guarantee against failure.
If you just have this towed to a dealer for a fix, have them give you the plug off the dead fpc so you can make a bypass from it to carry as a spare. You can do either a or b above to have for the next time. Or you can carry a spare fpc itself but note the cost of that compared to the "free" plug off the dead fpc.
A new fpc is $150 parts cost and takes about 15 minutes to install right.
You can do the emergency bypass fix yourself and still get the replacement covered under warranty by taking the dead one to the dealer. I swapped my dead one at Bob's (they're not my local dealer but I happened to be going by there- any good dealer should be able to do the swap for you) for a new one after doing a bypass. It saves BMW a tow cost and they approved the swap quickly for me (of course, because I carry a GS-911 on the bike I had the codes, the dissected,corroded dead controller minus its plug and showing a corroded board, and the fact that the bike ran again with the bypass as proof)
If you never ride in the rain and don't stick a hose up under your bike when you wash it, the chance of fpc failure decreases. Of course, one could query why anyone would buy an RT if all they want is a dry weather garage queen. I killed my fpc riding in a couple frog chokers coming from rallies but a garden hose, pressure washer or about anything that gets water under the tupperware will do it.
Your problem is precisely what the GS-911 (from hexcode) is good at- providing the codes for electrical issues. It would throw one or more of several possible codes showing no power at the fuel pump, if your fpc is in fact dead. The GS-911 is great for speeding up electrical troubleshooting of many problems, though it is not an absolute necessity IF you are well versed in how modern closed loop fuel injected stuff operates.
Your 08 RT has an OEM fpc that is plain metal. They fail A LOT due to a whole lot of issues that can be summed up by saying 1) the fpc design itself is defective in several ways and 2) it sits in a well on top of the fuel tank that collects water and it is that water that reveals the various flaws and causes the fpc to fail. Based on what is publicly reported and allowing for the fact that most failures won't get reported in web available totals, I'd estimate something north of 2000 of these have failed on late model BMWs like your 08RT- the part is common across hexheads and the defective well design is essentially the same on the GS family and the RT.
The "field fix" is very easy and only takes a few minutes. If you can't hear the pump run when you turn the key, this should get your bike running again.
1) Remove the tupperware piece over the fuel pump. Take 4, T-25 screws removed and its off. No need to pull anything else.
2) Remove the fpc from the bike (Its the bare metal finned thing that has a 3 wire plug going to it. Remove the plug and the 2, T-20 screws holding it on and pull it up. Then remove the 2 wire blue plastic connector under it that connects directly to the top of the fuel pump)
3) If you see a bunch of water in the well, and even a little corrosion around the bottom of the fpc you removed it is certainly dead. The fpc passes the 7A it takes to run the fuel pump and gets warm doing that- which is why it has fins. When it cools, it sucks water in, mostly through the ineffective silicone seal at the bottom of it and corrodes the board inside- you can peel the sealer easily with a pocket knife if you want to see the board damage- it won't be huge wads but even the tinest bit is more than enough to kill the board.
4) Make a bypass cable by cutting the blue plug off the bottom of the fpc. You will connect the blue wire on it to ground (brown wires on your bike) and the yellow to a 12V source. The result will be that the pump will run continually which is fine until you can get a new fpc to install. There are 2 easy ways to make these connections and you can pick which suits you
a) Connect it back to the wires going to the 3 wire plug that went to the fpc.
Just scrape of some insulation, connect the yellow from the plug to the blue/green on the bike and the blue to brown. Then put the blue plug back on the fuel pump and you're done. If you do this one neatly, you can leave the bypass plug permanently installed on the bike for the next time your fpc dies.
b) Connect the plug to an accessory cord going to the accessory outlet of your bike. Your 08RT will supply 10A at the outlet and will run the 7A pump with no difficulty- note that this version of the bypass does not apply to models that only supply 5A to the accessory plug. Connect the yellow wire from the plug to the center connector of the plug and the blue wire to the outer connection of the plug so polarity is correct. If you make this version, you can carry it on the bike for use the next time your fpc fails.
The new fpc you will eventually get is black powder coated- that coating addresses only 1 of several possible ways it dies and the new part will also fail if it gets wet enough. To minimize that possibility, a bit of gease or silicon sealer should be used around the gasket of the fpc when a new one is installed but recognize that this is a band aid for a bad design and not a guarantee against failure.
If you just have this towed to a dealer for a fix, have them give you the plug off the dead fpc so you can make a bypass from it to carry as a spare. You can do either a or b above to have for the next time. Or you can carry a spare fpc itself but note the cost of that compared to the "free" plug off the dead fpc.
A new fpc is $150 parts cost and takes about 15 minutes to install right.
You can do the emergency bypass fix yourself and still get the replacement covered under warranty by taking the dead one to the dealer. I swapped my dead one at Bob's (they're not my local dealer but I happened to be going by there- any good dealer should be able to do the swap for you) for a new one after doing a bypass. It saves BMW a tow cost and they approved the swap quickly for me (of course, because I carry a GS-911 on the bike I had the codes, the dissected,corroded dead controller minus its plug and showing a corroded board, and the fact that the bike ran again with the bypass as proof)
If you never ride in the rain and don't stick a hose up under your bike when you wash it, the chance of fpc failure decreases. Of course, one could query why anyone would buy an RT if all they want is a dry weather garage queen. I killed my fpc riding in a couple frog chokers coming from rallies but a garden hose, pressure washer or about anything that gets water under the tupperware will do it.
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One of the old saying that used to be drilled into beginning mechanics working on "no start issues (assuming there is fuel in the tank and yes, empty tanks do get overlooked sometimes) - and ought to be remembered by anyone intending to trubleshoot at home.
"When you've checked all the electrical and ignition stuff and are convinced its a fuel problem- check again because you probably missed it the first time"
It is very improbable that your issue is bad fuel or 4 simultaneously dead coils/plugs.
"When you've checked all the electrical and ignition stuff and are convinced its a fuel problem- check again because you probably missed it the first time"
It is very improbable that your issue is bad fuel or 4 simultaneously dead coils/plugs.
ignition problem
I've been thinking about why my bike won't start but don't have enough experience in one area to determine if it could cause the problem. From what I understand the key has an RF chip in it to prevent theft. I was wonder if the chip went bad would the engine still turn over but not start? Or is the receiver what could be causing the problem? That's other than electrical problems.
I've been thinking about why my bike won't start but don't have enough experience in one area to determine if it could cause the problem. From what I understand the key has an RF chip in it to prevent theft. I was wonder if the chip went bad would the engine still turn over but not start? Or is the receiver what could be causing the problem? That's other than electrical problems.
deilenberger
A bozo on the bus
Since your bike is an '08 - it's certainly possible (there was a problem and service campaign on the antenna,) but there is one big clue. In the RID - if the EWS (anti-theft) system isn't working, "EWS" is displayed.
Any sign of that? If so - contact your friendly local dealer - they should install the new antenna for no charge.
thanks everyone for their responses
I bought the bike in September of 2008 ti ride and have put 43,000 mile on it through both rain and snow (I rode to Dayton Ohio from outside of DC in February, I my way home I had to plug in my gerbing socks). I hear the fuel start and I smell gas when I turn it over so I would think (I've been told not to think) the the fuel pump is okay. No E WS warning. I've been told the what ever replaced the distributors on older engines for fuel injection engines may have gone bad (heard this was common). I'll definitely look up the article in the BMW ON magazine about non starting bikes. I'm leaving Tuesday for a week in Jamaica and I don't think there's a way to get my bike to Bob's before hand. I would have loved to have had it fixed while I was away.
I bought the bike in September of 2008 ti ride and have put 43,000 mile on it through both rain and snow (I rode to Dayton Ohio from outside of DC in February, I my way home I had to plug in my gerbing socks). I hear the fuel start and I smell gas when I turn it over so I would think (I've been told not to think) the the fuel pump is okay. No E WS warning. I've been told the what ever replaced the distributors on older engines for fuel injection engines may have gone bad (heard this was common). I'll definitely look up the article in the BMW ON magazine about non starting bikes. I'm leaving Tuesday for a week in Jamaica and I don't think there's a way to get my bike to Bob's before hand. I would have loved to have had it fixed while I was away.
sailorlite
New member
How about holding the throttle half open when the motor is turning over? Maybe one of the sensors relating to idle speed is inop. It would still need to be repaired of course even if it did start that way.
(I guess by now you've checked to see that there's gas in the tank - I was faked out once by a faulty gauge).
(I guess by now you've checked to see that there's gas in the tank - I was faked out once by a faulty gauge).
wanderer
Just passin through
Fuel pump controller
As was said by racer7, I'll bet a dollar to a donut it's a fuel pump controller. Sadly a common problem on the 12 RT. I had it happen to me and THEN discovered how common it is. Runs fine last time you rode it and then you try to start it and it just cranks and cranks and cranks.
The controller sits in a well on the top left side or the tank. Water/moisture gets in the well and they short out. BMW and your dealer are aware of the issue.
As was said by racer7, I'll bet a dollar to a donut it's a fuel pump controller. Sadly a common problem on the 12 RT. I had it happen to me and THEN discovered how common it is. Runs fine last time you rode it and then you try to start it and it just cranks and cranks and cranks.
The controller sits in a well on the top left side or the tank. Water/moisture gets in the well and they short out. BMW and your dealer are aware of the issue.
Considering when this machine was purchased, it should have the new EWS ring installed by the dealer prior to pickup based on the dates of the service campaign. Note to owner- you should have any dealer verify for you (from the bikes VIN) that it has a current EWS just as a matter of reliability. What is was made with had a high failure rate but BMW corrected that and changed them out on bikes in service and bikes prior to delivery just before you got yours. Anyway, assuming it has BOTH a working display (lights up) AND no EWS warning, its NOT the EWS ring.
The rfid keys do not go bad- they don't have any batteries, for example. The bike comes stock with 1 metal key and you basically get a second free for asking. Some dealers just supply both keys with the bike because Americans are used to having 2 keys per vehicle (mine did). Each of the rfid keys has to be programed into the bike computer and only those with access to BMW shop computers can add keys to the bikes computer system. The EWS ring is just a coiled antenna for the rfid system and, if bad, there is no workaround except to replace. Failure of the new part is rare but some folks still carry a spare when they travel "just in case". Its a $37 part but as noted above, is not likely the problem with your bike.
The rfid keys do not go bad- they don't have any batteries, for example. The bike comes stock with 1 metal key and you basically get a second free for asking. Some dealers just supply both keys with the bike because Americans are used to having 2 keys per vehicle (mine did). Each of the rfid keys has to be programed into the bike computer and only those with access to BMW shop computers can add keys to the bikes computer system. The EWS ring is just a coiled antenna for the rfid system and, if bad, there is no workaround except to replace. Failure of the new part is rare but some folks still carry a spare when they travel "just in case". Its a $37 part but as noted above, is not likely the problem with your bike.
Ponch1
Ponch
MDCRUISER
Ride Safe!
Hi Jay, it's Michael.
I have read the MOA article, and am convinced you have exactly the same problem described there. If you need a copy of the article just let me know.
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