'02 1150R replacing choke cable - help!

[TonysR100]

Hi, all.
I'm in the process of replacing the throttle cables and choke cable. They have 99k kms on them and are due.
What I can't figure out is getting the old choke cable out of the plastic lever. I've slackened off the cable as much as possible and have it out of the groove. The switch cover is off, but I can't get the choke lever past the white dot at the end of its normal travel and the nipple is covered by the inner half of the lever assembly.
It's still cold in the garage and I'm very leery of breaking expensive plastic bits.
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks,
Tony

 

[TonysR100]

Got it!

Mr. Haynes pointed out that there was yet one more black screw to be removed.
Tony

 

[henzilla]

I hope it warned you of the unobtanium ball bearing and spring that holds the lever in on position!!!

The shop floor will eat it

also be ready for the snarky comment that it is NOT a choke. because it usually happens

 

[59312]

When you do lose the unobtanium ball bearing, you can get a replacement at ACE Hardware.

 

[pauls1150]

But zat vill not meet ze BMW shpek; und ve must azzign a place on ze periodic table for zis Unobtainium!

 

[bc1100s]

But zat vill not meet ze BMW shpek; und ve must azzign a place on ze periodic table for zis Unobtainium!

Nice.

 

[bc1100s]

...also be ready for the snarky comment that it is NOT a choke. because it usually happens

Because the OP already has a solution, I feel no guilt in derailing this thread.

Now, I just looked at the "choke" lever on my 1100S and whaddya know, it has a picture of a plate reducing the size of an intake tract. So, if BMW is content to put a picture like that on the lever, I'm content to call it a choke. (even though its a fast idle lever - allegedly )

For anyone who disagrees with me, this is an open invitation to discuss over beer(s) at the Billings Rally.

 

[TonysR100]

You can call it a choke cable, they do.

The official BMW label attached to the official BMW cable refers to it as, and I quote, "choke cable".
That's the trouble with BMW, after massively over-engineering everything, they collapse exhausted into inexactitude.
Now if I can just figure out how to detach the male fuel pump electrical connection from its frame tab, I can get on with the job.
Cheers,
Tony

 

[henzilla]

The female frame side of the connector stays put, the male tank side clip releases to the rear.
there are squeeze tabs on the male...may need some needlenose pliers...sometimes finger pressure is enough.

Yeah, everyone I know still says choke regardless of model. And BMW printed it on our R11R's lever so there ya go

 

[dieselyoda]

To de-rail this some more.

A traditional choke enriches the fuel mixture at crank. In a fuel injected engine, any amount of throttle position voltage does the same thing. The extra TPS voltage adds more fuel.

I'm sure a few folks here remember the mid '80's and the muscle memory to pump the gas peddle at start and with the onset of fuel injection and the inevitable no-start and then an oil change right away.

While I get a kick out of wrenching my Beamers, rather new and some pretty old, there has been one underlying thing I get, dos ingineering frum da fatherland till tinks vee be bunch of lucky rednecks and if we could learned das German, vee be most gracious cause dey tot us da way evreytink shud be.

I still look at pistons and have no idea what "vorn" or is it "zorn" (?) means but logically, you can see by the valve reliefs that putting them in wrong would be a very, very bad thing. Never bought new BMW pistons ever so I have no idea what they were trying to tell me.

In German, "choke" means what think they should tell you it is. In Canadian, "yeah, sure, whatever you hoser."

 

[gsaddict]

A traditional choke enriches the fuel mixture at crank. In a fuel injected engine, any amount of throttle position voltage does the same thing. The extra TPS voltage adds more fuel.

I'm sure a few folks here remember the mid '80's and the muscle memory to pump the gas peddle at start and with the onset of fuel injection and the inevitable no-start and then an oil change right away.

While I get a kick out of wrenching my Beamers, rather new and some pretty old, there has been one underlying thing I get, dos ingineering frum da fatherland till tinks vee be bunch of lucky rednecks and if we could learned das German, vee be most gracious cause dey tot us da way evreytink shud be.

I still look at pistons and have no idea what "vorn" or is it "zorn" (?) means but logically, you can see by the valve reliefs that putting them in wrong would be a very, very bad thing. Never bought new BMW pistons ever so I have no idea what they were trying to tell me.

In German, "choke" means what think they should tell you it is. In Canadian, "yeah, sure, whatever you hoser."

Vorn = Forward

 

[montliz]

Well, since TonysR and BC1100 were kind enough to open the subject, I'm going to jump right in and ask the question I've so far been too embarrassed to mention. Here goes: Does that thing do anything other than open the throttles just a little for a higher warm-up idle? As far as I can see with my admittedly lame close-up vision, all it does is open the throttle body plates at a very low and limited ratio (unlike the twistgrip, which opens them all the way with a quick turn).

Full disclosure: I'm an oilhead newbie, and when these bikes first came out (mine's a 2000 R1100S) I was still foolishly devoted to the flying brick K-bikes and failed to ask the "What the heck is that thing for?" question at the time. I'm so new that I haven't even looked inside there yet and for all I know the throttle bodies are CVT and don't have butterflies at all, despite BMW's helpful choke illustration on the lever.

Mr. Haynes does a nice job of illustrating the cable distributor unit (helpful and sooo delightfully BMW), but has chosen not to explain what they do or why they do it.

Sorry to be so late to the table, and thanks in advance for your help on this strange and wunderful phenomenon.

Choke Curious in Texas,

Johnny

 

[bc1100s]

Well, since TonysR and BC1100 were kind enough to open the subject, I'm going to jump right in and ask the question I've so far been too embarrassed to mention. Here goes: Does that thing do anything other than open the throttles just a little for a higher warm-up idle?

There are many more people here with much more knowledge of the FI system than I but I'll venture a guess that, in a combination of the choke and Motronic unit (ECU), there is an enrichment of the mixture on cold start ups. When the motor is warm and the choke is activated, I'll guess that all one gets is a higher idle speed with no enrichment.

 

[gsaddict]

Well, since TonysR and BC1100 were kind enough to open the subject, I'm going to jump right in and ask the question I've so far been too embarrassed to mention. Here goes: Does that thing do anything other than open the throttles just a little for a higher warm-up idle? As far as I can see with my admittedly lame close-up vision, all it does is open the throttle body plates at a very low and limited ratio (unlike the twistgrip, which opens them all the way with a quick turn).

Full disclosure: I'm an oilhead newbie, and when these bikes first came out (mine's a 2000 R1100S) I was still foolishly devoted to the flying brick K-bikes and failed to ask the "What the heck is that thing for?" question at the time. I'm so new that I haven't even looked inside there yet and for all I know the throttle bodies are CVT and don't have butterflies at all, despite BMW's helpful choke illustration on the lever.

Mr. Haynes does a nice job of illustrating the cable distributor unit (helpful and sooo delightfully BMW), but has chosen not to explain what they do or why they do it.

Sorry to be so late to the table, and thanks in advance for your help on this strange and wunderful phenomenon.

Choke Curious in Texas,

Johnny

Throttle position is a part of the picture.

Beside monitoring that (thru the TPS),

The Motronic calculates fueling by monitoring:

Atmospheric pressure
RPM
Ambient temperature
Oil temperature

As well, it consults it's internal fuel maps.

Opening the throttle plate slightly allows the correct air/fuel adjustments to be possible

 

[montliz]

Great answers, thanks.

So it appears that what we may be doing here is employing an old-school mechanical device (the slow-opening, low-geared "choke" cable) to help the somewhat less old-school Motronic and its helper, the TPS, do their job more easily. And nowadays the more highly developed EFI systems do the same thing without the mechanical assist from the rider.

Gotta love BMW - who else would have thought of this? That may explain why they call it a "choke" - kind of a nod to an earlier time, back when you had to know something to start and run a motorcycle.

Cheers,

Johnny

 

[gsaddict]

Great answers, thanks.

So it appears that what we may be doing here is employing an old-school mechanical device (the slow-opening, low-geared "choke" cable) to help the somewhat less old-school Motronic and its helper, the TPS, do their job more easily. And nowadays the more highly developed EFI systems do the same thing without the mechanical assist from the rider.

Gotta love BMW - who else would have thought of this? That may explain why they call it a "choke" - kind of a nod to an earlier time, back when you had to know something to start and run a motorcycle.

Cheers,

Johnny

Remember the design is 1993 on... for the Oilheads.
In 2006 the next generation (Hexheads) use individual idle servos and a much more advanced controller.
In 2013 the Wetheads go more advanced.

 

[ragtoplvr]

Well, since TonysR and BC1100 were kind enough to open the subject, I'm going to jump right in and ask the question I've so far been too embarrassed to mention. Here goes: Does that thing do anything other than open the throttles just a little for a higher warm-up idle? As far as I can see with my admittedly lame close-up vision, all it does is open the throttle body plates at a very low and limited ratio (unlike the twistgrip, which opens them all the way with a quick turn).

Full disclosure: I'm an oilhead newbie, and when these bikes first came out (mine's a 2000 R1100S) I was still foolishly devoted to the flying brick K-bikes and failed to ask the "What the heck is that thing for?" question at the time. I'm so new that I haven't even looked inside there yet and for all I know the throttle bodies are CVT and don't have butterflies at all, despite BMW's helpful choke illustration on the lever.

Mr. Haynes does a nice job of illustrating the cable distributor unit (helpful and sooo delightfully BMW), but has chosen not to explain what they do or why they do it.

Sorry to be so late to the table, and thanks in advance for your help on this strange and wunderful phenomenon.

Choke Curious in Texas,


Johnny

It just opens the throttle. It is also quite useful for starting on a hill, in the wind when you have to keep both feet down or assume normal resting position. Also useful for slow speed maneuvering and just getting used to the bike. The engine control electronics do not know if you used the lever or the twist grip.

 

[henzilla]

It just opens the throttle. It is also quite useful for starting on a hill, in the wind when you have to keep both feet down or assume normal resting position. Also useful for slow speed maneuvering and just getting used to the bike. The engine control electronics do not know if you used the lever or the twist grip.

Don't forget it also speeds the process of blistering/melt/ignite the RT and a few RS's lowers as well when sitting still.

 

[PGlaves]

At least since 1969, BMW has not fitted an actual "choke" to a production motorcycle unless maybe on the Delorto carbs. The bikes with slide carbs had ticklers to deliberately flood the engine. The CV carbs had a seperate enrichener circuit to add fuel - not restrict air. The classik K bikes had a fast idle as do the Oilheads. Thr F twin bikes don't have a lever at all - the computer handles it. And so ti goes.

 

[happy wanderer]

Oilhead "Choke" cable

Some time ago there was a big discussion about the "Choke" cable and there was a fella who was convinced the "choke" cable was doing all sorts of things including directly controlling the TPS. Many tried to explain that all it did was slightly advance the throttle body cables which in turn rotates the throttle body spindles which in turn spins the Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) which is how the Motronic knows the throttle bodies are opening and how much.

This explanation was not accepted so to give a better idea of what was going on I made this terrible one handed video with my phone that shows exactly what is happening in the Bowden cable box or some call it the throttle cable splitter box.

Click on the image to play the video.

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