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no compression at all either cylinder!

Not in timing chest

AntonLargiader said:
The cord absolutely looks like it's from a broken alternator belt. It's not uncommon that a strand like that will wrap around the shaft behind the lower pulley and damage the HES, but I've never heard of it migrating through the seal into the timing chest.
Click to expand...
I just wanted to correct the post in case someone reads it in the future. The alternator belt cord was NOT in the timing chest as I stated, it was wrapped around the HES behind the alternator belt housing, the plastic one with 4 bolts holding it. Since I didn't even know at that point what a HES was, I misstated where I found it. So this had nothing to do with the timing chain tensioner breaking and the tensioner piston coming out and getting chewed up (why it jumped time). It just broke on its own after 110K miles. The design seems likely to wear out, a static plastic bar being pushed against a spinning metal chain by a metal piston (only being held captive in its sleeve by the plastic bar) under pressure from a pretty strong spring. Even in an oil bath this couldn't last forever. Something else to think about for preventative maintenance purposes.
 
It runs!

Today I installed my new HES and got it back together enough to see if it runs. It started right up! I'm still pinching myself to make sure it's not a dream. I had lunch, went back out, and it started again. I put on the seat, sat on it, and it started again. Runs real nice and quiet. My wife thought it was the neighbors air conditioning unit starting. No honey, that's the BMW running.:)
So apparently, if one installs all the parts correctly, these bikes run. Who knew! First time I've ever sat on a running BMW, seems like a real nice bike. I have a lot of plastic to put back on before I'm ready to ride.
Thanks everyone for all your advise and encouragement, I couldn't have done it without you.
 
edheiser said:
I have a lot of plastic to put back on before I'm ready to ride.
Click to expand...

I typically ride around for a couple of days without the Tupperware 1) just to be sure I don't think of something else to poke at, and 2) to make it easy to come back for "one last tweak" of whatever work I (think I've) finished.

Ugly, though...
 
edheiser said:
Thanks everyone for all your advise and encouragement, I couldn't have done it without you.
Click to expand...

No, thank YOU Ed for allowing us to share in this journey. Its been a pleasure reading your posts. :thumb

We'll need pictures in the "Post a picture of your Oilhead" thread once you've got everything put back together.
 
Excellent! Glad to hear you finally got it sorted out. I doubt I'd have that much perseverance.

Let us know how it rides.
 
edheiser said:
Today I installed my new HES and got it back together enough to see if it runs. It started right up! I'm still pinching myself to make sure it's not a dream. I had lunch, went back out, and it started again. I put on the seat, sat on it, and it started again. Runs real nice and quiet. My wife thought it was the neighbors air conditioning unit starting. No honey, that's the BMW running.:)
Click to expand...

Congratulations! Man, what a journey. But this is the reply I've been waiting for in this lengthy thread. That is fantastic.
 
Nice to hear you have it running? What did you end up doing with the lower left cam chain tensioner? Did you get it slipped over the pin, modify it, or is it just sitting on top of the pin with the inboard end a pin and a wall thickness higher than it should be?
 
Oh yeah, that............

rxcrider said:
Nice to hear you have it running? What did you end up doing with the lower left cam chain tensioner? Did you get it slipped over the pin, modify it, or is it just sitting on top of the pin with the inboard end a pin and a wall thickness higher than it should be?
Click to expand...
I am trying not to think about that!
I really don't know. I just put it back in like it came out. It's either over the pin, under the pin, or pin is missing. Outboard mounting bolt fit very easy and no jiggling required. This bike has had many hands on it. I tried to see in there, but with the piston in the way, I couldn't see much. It runs real quiet, and has tons of power. Time will tell if this is a problem. If it lasts until winter, I'll be happy. If I last until winter, come to think of it, I'll be happy. I'm getting to the age where I know more dead people than live people.
 
Oil leak after riding a day

After a good days riding, I really like this bike, but was not too surprised to find it needs one more fix. The oil seal for the front of the crankshaft leaks, maybe a half teaspoon after some 80-90 mph running. Messy! Didn't leak at all just riding around town. No big deal, I had it taken out in less than 2 hours, and a new one will be here tomorrow by noon. Napa auto parts #11608, $12. 30x42x7 mm seal. I doubt BMW makes their own seals, so no point in getting one from them for twice the price plus a 40 mile drive on Tuesday in traffic. No more $28 tubes of 3 bond for me either, thank you.
It sure was easier than the first take down. I've learned a lot in the last month. Didn't even have to take off the right side plastic. Found TDC with a long screwdriver in the spark plug hole, and locked the engine with a rod in the flywheel hole. Easy peasy.
Oh, my brother is in love with BMWs now after riding mine. He's thinking of trading his 200 mph Kawasaki for one. Probably a good idea all considered.
 
edheiser said:
After a good days riding, I really like this bike, but was not too surprised to find it needs one more fix. The oil seal for the front of the crankshaft leaks, maybe a half teaspoon after some 80-90 mph running. Messy! Didn't leak at all just riding around town. No big deal, I had it taken out in less than 2 hours, and a new one will be here tomorrow by noon. Napa auto parts #11608, $12. 30x42x7 mm seal. I doubt BMW makes their own seals, so no point in getting one from them for twice the price plus a 40 mile drive on Tuesday in traffic. No more $28 tubes of 3 bond for me either, thank you.
It sure was easier than the first take down. I've learned a lot in the last month. Didn't even have to take off the right side plastic. Found TDC with a long screwdriver in the spark plug hole, and locked the engine with a rod in the flywheel hole. Easy peasy.
Oh, my brother is in love with BMWs now after riding mine. He's thinking of trading his 200 mph Kawasaki for one. Probably a good idea all considered.
Click to expand...

Just like a pro :thumb
OM
 
If it's the seal I'm thinking of, it's a spiral teflon seal like the rear main seals and others. If what you pulled out was a conventional double lipped seal, that may explain the leakage. BMW migrated many seals over to the spiral teflon seal design starting in the late '80s. No, they are not made by BMW but they are made for BMW.

OmegaMan, a pro would use the specified seal there.

Installing the spiral seal there is slightly tricky. A film canister is actually a wonderful tool for that job.
 
AntonLargiader said:
OmegaMan, a pro would use the specified seal there.
Click to expand...

Well, considering where Ed started, what he has been through and the ease in which he was able to diagnose and tear into another section of the bike..... I still think he tackled it like a pro. If he had taken it to a shop, I would expect OEM parts but as it's his machine, I feel it's up to him. He has done real well and I'm sure he will let us know how the NAPA parts worked out.
When I did the rear wheel bearings on the F800GS, I used SKF. Bike still rolls pretty well :dunno
OM
 
Learn something every day!

Just when I think I know what I'm doing, this seal business appears.
The seal I took out was not like any seal I've seen before, there was no metal garter spring I could see. I was wondering if it fell off! After reading your comments, I see now that this is a special seal, and a bit tricky to preform and get into place. The one I bought is a transmission input seal of the same size.
I'm torn as to what to do, so Ill mull it over. Seems like a conventional seal would be easier to install correctly. I've never had one leak in my experience. I suppose any new seal would be better than a 15 year old seal with over 100K miles.
 
I just remembered you had the timing cover off. The teflon lip on that seal goes inward (as all of them do), which is not what would normally happen when you reinstall the cover with the seal in place. Additionally I think there is a step on the shaft that the seal has to get over, so unless you took great care the lip on the seal will fold over against that step.

A film canister with the bottom cut out of it can be a perfect guide for this if it is thin enough. Push it very slightly through the seal from the outside, install the cover so that the film canister goes over the first section of the crank, and let the seal lips slide inward off the canister onto the fatter part of the crank as you push the cover all the way into place.
 
Trying to understand what you said...

AntonLargiader said:
I just remembered you had the timing cover off. The teflon lip on that seal goes inward (as all of them do), which is not what would normally happen when you reinstall the cover with the seal in place. Additionally I think there is a step on the shaft that the seal has to get over, so unless you took great care the lip on the seal will fold over against that step.

A film canister with the bottom cut out of it can be a perfect guide for this if it is thin enough. Push it very slightly through the seal from the outside, install the cover so that the film canister goes over the first section of the crank, and let the seal lips slide inward off the canister onto the fatter part of the crank as you push the cover all the way into place.
Click to expand...
OK, now I see what you are saying! Thanks. At this point, the old seal is damaged from removing it, so I'll need to replace it anyway. BMW sure does things their own way, it's been quite a magical mystery trip so far!
 
note that there is no seat to stop the seal, so push it in to where it was and stop. The factory tool makes this job easy.
 
seal installed

I installed the NAPA seal and ran it for 5 minutes and no oil leak. I left off the front cover for now so I can keep an eye on it. I'm going out with my wife for Mexican food to celebrate, it's a fiesta!:dance
 
The Napa seal you bought is a "will fit". It should be OK for quite sometime but the seal Anton describes requires precise installation while the one you bought has a certain amount of forgiveness at installation.

The worst that will happen is you get a leaker in awhile but I have a feeling the adventure with this bike is going to be, well, an adventure.
 
Adventure

dieselyoda said:
The Napa seal you bought is a "will fit". It should be OK for quite sometime but the seal Anton describes requires precise installation while the one you bought has a certain amount of forgiveness at installation.

The worst that will happen is you get a leaker in awhile but I have a feeling the adventure with this bike is going to be, well, an adventure.
Click to expand...

This was a pig in a poke purchase, not running, untold potential problems, expensive parts that were Greek to me, just my kind of a brain teaser to entertain me. I've learned a lot for very little, and enjoyed the trip into BMW land, a place of rarified machines and people. I've been active on a lot of car, boat and motorcycle forums in the last 12 years or so, 5000 posts on M109riders was the most active. This is the most brainy and technical minded group yet, I mean that in a good way.:)
So far, so good. Of course, this is an old beat up ex cop bike that I got for a song. I got it because I can't resist a challenge, and it has exceeded my expectations!
I don't plan on riding it thousands of miles into the wilderness. The bike would probably be up to it, but I'm not. Besides, I have other fish to fry. Back to my "it's broke" country song. Even the faithful Cub Cadet tractor broke a pulley last week. I'm replacing all three spindle assemblies to go with the new blades a nice person sent me.
 
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