Worst gas ever

[JDOCKERY132445]

I have ridden over 1,000,000 miles. I have bought gas in third world countries for my motorcycles, in the sticks from gravity feed drums, on the side of the road from herders, stolen it out of school buses and begged it from farmers who kindly siphoned it our of various old machinery; but the gas I bought in Lakeland, Florida during bike week was the worst yet.

I left Daytona on Sunday morning to visit my nephew in Lakeland. It was a wonderful visit. I left Monday morning, returning to Daytona. I decided to stop and fill up with premium at a convenience store...MISTAKE.

Within 50 miles, my bike was sputtering and surging. It finally came to a complete stop. The bike was HOT. The oil temp was slightly elevated; but the pipes were so hot that they had made the paint bubble on the fairing of my R1100RT. It was also having difficulty shifting smoothly.

I sat on the side of the road and had a cigar to let the bike cool off.

It re-fired but when I tried to give it gas past 2000 RPM, it would start sputtering. I limped into the rest area, 6 miles away.

Again, it was HOT. While letting it cool down, some local riders pulled in and I told them my problem. One told me in four miles there was a Mobil convenience store. I limped there and bought the 7-11 brand fuel injector cleaner. Now the bike would go to 3000 RPM.

I limped into Daytona. I filled up with premium Sonoco at the Speedway and added 1/2 bottle of Lucas gas treatment. I carefully rode the bike to some in town events and to the Cabbage Patch. Things were better, but it was still running hotter than normal.

Luckily, I had delivered an old Land Rover to a buyer in Daytona and I had a trailer to bring the bike home on.

I spent the past two days going over the bike. It seems the heat was worse on the right cylinder; the intake valves were within tolerance; the exhaust valves were slightly out of adjustment, but not by a lot.

My fresh synthetic oil was burned. New oil and filter time.

The spark plugs looked like they had been firing a very lean mixture; so those were replaced.

I filled with fresh gas [non-ethanol] and added a bottle of Techron additive. It is running like a top again.

I talked to a riding buddy and BMW owner today and told him of my experience and he said the gas likely had sat and separated which gave me a very high alcohol content and that I likely picked up some trash from my fill up also. He said the high alcohol content caused the lean burn and contributed to the over heating.

I hope no one else has this problem. I have learned my lesson about buying premium at a low volume discounter.

Tomorrow is our Club ride; life is good again.

 

[Omega Man]

Along those lines.....it has been suggested that when fuel prices get as they are, there is a cut-back on the use of premium gas. It seems that there is a feeling that dropping down a grade won't matter that much and may save some money. The end result it that the premium gas is sitting for too long a period and degrades.
Nice that you could get things sorted out Jerry.
As this is a good reminder to all, I'll move this thread to Motorrad so more will see it. Gary

 

[roger 04 rt]

What a terrible experience. Sounds like the fuel was bad to the point of misfiring. When that happens, there is oxygen and raw fuel in the exhaust and it can burn there, which creates the heat. I burned up my Xterra exhaust when that happened.

I ran some numbers to get an idea how lean the fuel could be. Thinking in gasoline terms, each 10% of ethanol added needs 4% more from the injectors to break even. At 20% ethanol you could have been running at 16:1, very lean!

Really sorry to hear what happened. If my bike starts running bad, your experience tells me I should shut down and call for some help.

 

[t6pilot]

Cash or credit card? Cash your totally out of luck, credit card I would dispute the charges then let the retailer contact you. This issue pops up every so often especially when gas prices spike. Several years ago a chain of stations in southern California tried infusing their premium gas with lessor octane gas, lots of complaints very hefty fine from the state.

 

[Texpaul]

We had an issue like that down here in Texas. All the cars that filled at a particular convienience store didn't get a half mile down the road before they stopped running completely. The station paid for all the repairs and towing plus gave everone some cash but claimed they could not determine what the problem was.
It might be worth it to get back to the company who runs the store and find out if there were any other complaints and if so, what they did, or are willing, to do about it.

 

[23217]

Are you sure you didn't fill it with E85? I don't think that the computer on BMW's can compensate for E85.

It is also possible that the tank at the gas station has a hole in the tank, or there is too much condensation water at the bottom. Gas stations are suppose to "stick" the tanks every day and measure the amount of condensation water in the tanks. If the tanks get too much water, they are suppose to pump out the excess water. Pumping out the condensation water is a real pain. Usually they have to hand-pump 200 gallons of water to get the level down to the bottom. Some gas stations can't be bothered with this chore. They wait until a couple unhappy customer come it.

Sometimes the tanks or pipes at gas stations rust out and water leaks in, or gas leaks out, or both. Some gas station owners will push the tanks as long as possible before replacing them. Some states have very strict rules, and others don't.

 

[milo]

Sucks. Sounds like phase separation in the gasohol.
http://fuelschool.blogspot.com/2009/02/phase-separation-in-ethanol-blended.html

 

[oldnslow]

Hmmm, I was expecting a thread about indigestion!

 

[OCJIMMY]

The same thing happened to me.

I was riding my RT and stopped for Gas at a discount station.

Immediately My bike ran like crap in low RPM's. I was heading on to the freeway and so at higher RPM's It ran ok.

When I pulled off the road about 40 miles later, my low RPM's maneuvering in the parking lot caused my bike to sputter and I nearly lost the bike.

It was likely very dirty gas.

When I refilled it at a High-Volume Chevron station, the problem went away.

From now on, I only use premium from higher volume stations.

Jimmy

 

[kantuckid]

Are you sure you didn't fill it with E85? I don't think that the computer on BMW's can compensate for E85.

It is also possible that the tank at the gas station has a hole in the tank, or there is too much condensation water at the bottom. Gas stations are suppose to "stick" the tanks every day and measure the amount of condensation water in the tanks. If the tanks get too much water, they are suppose to pump out the excess water. Pumping out the condensation water is a real pain. Usually they have to hand-pump 200 gallons of water to get the level down to the bottom. Some gas stations can't be bothered with this chore. They wait until a couple unhappy customer come it.

Sometimes the tanks or pipes at gas stations rust out and water leaks in, or gas leaks out, or both. Some gas station owners will push the tanks as long as possible before replacing them. Some states have very strict rules, and others don't.

I am not doubting what you say whatsoever & have never worked in a gas station and also never seen anyone "pumping water away" either. They all seem busy pushing buttons & selling lottery tics to me? Where does this water go? Honestly is this so rare it almost never needs done? Is there a button they push,etc.? I've had bad gas but it's been rare & recent.

 

[Omega Man]

In my neck of the woods, UST's (underground storage tanks) are mostly monitored by a system such as Veeder Root . This system detects problems with a UST and, for example-some water, an automatic call to the environmental company that has the contract for the gas station. If it goes to a lot of water, there is an automatic shutdown of the station until the water is evacuated. It used to be a quick glance on a service bay wall reveled the VR system. Now with gas and go at the pump and the lack of service bays, it's harder to see if there is a monitoring system in place.

 

[jforgo]

Sounds like cost chiseler store operators sell stale gas, just like stale chips and jerky. Except with the "food" you usually have a date you can check, so the gas is more iffy. The fuel vendor sure isn't going to say anything to the store owner about stale gas, if either party were to care.
One might also wonder, at $4 a gallon, how tempting it might become for some, to throw 250 gallons of water in a storage tank, for a slick additional $1000 pure profit?
I use the name brand high volume fuel, and haven't had a problem, besides the low fuel economy and fuel system component attacks noted elsewhere, with E10. This is in Airheads which burn regular, though. My other half does use the cheapie regular stuff in her car, and has had fuel problems.

 

[t6pilot]

Seems like a lot more posts on all the blogs regarding crappy fuel, as a consumer I try to always purchase from known brands. Carry some techron mixed with water absorber in a side case just in case. Always pay for gas with credit card and am not afraid to dispute charges when when a purchase turns out bad.

 

[saddleman]

Bad Gas

I got a bad load at a Mobil station in York Maine in May of 2009. I had to clean the entire fuel system & have the injectors rebuilt before it would run like it should again. I was able to ride the 1,100 miles home but it was running so bad I only shut it off once to take a food & restroom break in Conn. just outside of New York City. That was the worst 23 hour ride I've ever had.

 

[JDOCKERY132445]

Bingo

Sucks. Sounds like phase separation in the gasohol.
http://fuelschool.blogspot.com/2009/02/phase-separation-in-ethanol-blended.html

I had lunch with the club today and one of our engineers confirmed that was likely what happened.

I always buy my gas from the same place when I am home; but being on the road is a crap shoot.

I rode for 5 hours today and the bike ran great.

 

[lkchris]

Yesterday I bought some "real gas" for my G/S at a station noted at http://www.pure-gas.org.

It smelled good, didn't notice much running difference, haven't checked mileage.

This was in a really small town at an el cheapo station and I didn't even notice whether they had premium.

 

[f14rio]

just before world war 2 in the pacific

a pan am clipper was very low on fuel in some remote seaport. they needed to get it outa there before the japs arrived. there was lower octane auto gas available.
what the crew did was to transfer the av gas to the feed tanks and then top off with the low octane stuff. they used the good stuff to get airborne and at cruise altitude they switched over to the auto gas. the engines protested and it felt like they were gonna fall off. but they settled down and the plane made it to saftey.

 

[scooterboy]

Never buy gas if the gas truck is there delivering gas or just leaving. It stirs up the sediments on the bottom of the tank and then you pump into yours clogging everything up.

 

[jeffd]

I often wonder how fresh the premium fuel is at some of the out of the way stations you run into.
Jeff

 

[bigdelta]

Bad situation but not as bad as a good friend of mine who has been riding for 40 years or so pumping diesel in his 2 year old Harley Dyna.Old farts our age are easily distracted!