pffog
Small road corner junkie
No you have SMOOTH in your toolbox, add LOOK WHERE YOU WANT TO GO, and KEEP EYES UP and AHEAD. All accentuate the smooth, and pretty soon you will be riding faster without trying.
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Both fast and safe in the twisties?
- Thread starter BCKRider
- Start date
No you have SMOOTH in your toolbox, add LOOK WHERE YOU WANT TO GO, and KEEP EYES UP and AHEAD. All accentuate the smooth, and pretty soon you will be riding faster without trying.
C
criminaldesign
Guest
Do a track day.
I whole heartily agree, probably THE best thing I did for my riding perception.
pffog
Small road corner junkie
Late apexing
I generally have no discernible chicken strips on the rear tire of my R1200 RT. I love to run the twists, though its 450 miles to deals gap from my house in Indiana I have run the dragon about 130 trips.
One of the commenters seemed proud that he ran the dragon without using his brakes. While this is an accomplishment, I strongly believe that if you don't brake lightly going into a turn, you won't know how. When a hazard appears you can slow the bike much quicker if you already are on the brakes. Light trail braking transitioning to throttle as you turn in takes a lot of practice but it is the smoothest way to ride especially with a shaft drive bike with ample driveline lash.
Several have described late apexing of turns especially blind turns. I do this all the time, again if you don't practice it you can't do it well just because you are riding the dragon.
Those who execute late apex turns on the road are much more likely to use all the tire right to the edge. You actually turn in twice when executing late apex technique. You take a wide line (right side of lane in left turn or left side of lane in left turn) This makes the turn radius bigger, you can lean less as a given speed around any turn if you take a wider radius. Once you can see you way out of the turn, and can see there is no hazard in your lane, thats when you execute the apex by turning in harder. This is when you can lean the bike to its limits and gas out of the turn sooner than the bike that just follows the road. So while you lean over farther when late apexing turns, you do it for a shorter distance than if you just follow the curve of the road.
The beauty, and increased safety of late apexing is that:
1. you never are committed to do it until you can see that the road surface is safe and their is no oncoming or slow traffic in your lane.
2. If there is a hazard you simply don't have to execute the sharper turn in to the apex. 3. You are much less likely to outrun your braking distance as you are taking the widest practical radius until you see the turn open up allowing you to feather the brakes if necessary to avoid a hazard.
4. Your line of site of the road will always be farther with the wide radius.
5.You never execute the extreme lean angle until the blind
turn is no longer blind.
6. Last you will not run over the center line on those right turn switchbacks or run of the road on the left turn switchbacks.
That's a lot of reasons to practice late apexing, but you can also:
7. brag about how narrow your chicken strips are, if you have any.
Take training, read Proficient Motorcycling, and practice/use the techniques all the time.
I generally have no discernible chicken strips on the rear tire of my R1200 RT. I love to run the twists, though its 450 miles to deals gap from my house in Indiana I have run the dragon about 130 trips.
One of the commenters seemed proud that he ran the dragon without using his brakes. While this is an accomplishment, I strongly believe that if you don't brake lightly going into a turn, you won't know how. When a hazard appears you can slow the bike much quicker if you already are on the brakes. Light trail braking transitioning to throttle as you turn in takes a lot of practice but it is the smoothest way to ride especially with a shaft drive bike with ample driveline lash.
Several have described late apexing of turns especially blind turns. I do this all the time, again if you don't practice it you can't do it well just because you are riding the dragon.
Those who execute late apex turns on the road are much more likely to use all the tire right to the edge. You actually turn in twice when executing late apex technique. You take a wide line (right side of lane in left turn or left side of lane in left turn) This makes the turn radius bigger, you can lean less as a given speed around any turn if you take a wider radius. Once you can see you way out of the turn, and can see there is no hazard in your lane, thats when you execute the apex by turning in harder. This is when you can lean the bike to its limits and gas out of the turn sooner than the bike that just follows the road. So while you lean over farther when late apexing turns, you do it for a shorter distance than if you just follow the curve of the road.
The beauty, and increased safety of late apexing is that:
1. you never are committed to do it until you can see that the road surface is safe and their is no oncoming or slow traffic in your lane.
2. If there is a hazard you simply don't have to execute the sharper turn in to the apex. 3. You are much less likely to outrun your braking distance as you are taking the widest practical radius until you see the turn open up allowing you to feather the brakes if necessary to avoid a hazard.
4. Your line of site of the road will always be farther with the wide radius.
5.You never execute the extreme lean angle until the blind
turn is no longer blind.
6. Last you will not run over the center line on those right turn switchbacks or run of the road on the left turn switchbacks.
That's a lot of reasons to practice late apexing, but you can also:
7. brag about how narrow your chicken strips are, if you have any.
Take training, read Proficient Motorcycling, and practice/use the techniques all the time.
ANDYVH
New member
SMOOTH to me is the key. Smooth and consistent tire loading and chassis attitude. Meaning, no excessive pitching/diving by clamping on the brakes to the point you feel the steering geometry alter because of fork dive. Smooth to the point that using a slightly higher gear through the twisties (let that engine sing) gives better responsiveness and also more effective engine braking. It allows you to blend down the speed by rolling the throttle down.
Late apexing gives you the better view of the turn and more of the turn to work with. Reading the terrain and trees/vegetation/grades before you get to the turn helps set you up for the late apexing.
These are skills I developed over time and practice, and by following others that I already knew where consistent, smooth and quick through the twisties. Now when I read articles by David Hough, Lee Parks, and others who advocate smooth, higher gear, late apexing it all comes together to a riding style that is easier overall and more engaging than simply following the road.
Late apexing gives you the better view of the turn and more of the turn to work with. Reading the terrain and trees/vegetation/grades before you get to the turn helps set you up for the late apexing.
These are skills I developed over time and practice, and by following others that I already knew where consistent, smooth and quick through the twisties. Now when I read articles by David Hough, Lee Parks, and others who advocate smooth, higher gear, late apexing it all comes together to a riding style that is easier overall and more engaging than simply following the road.
Walking Eagle
New member
+1 Track Days & SMOOTH
If any of you have ridden on the seat behind Reg Pridmore (or other Aces) -- You now know what smooth is. The first time I did this a few years ago, Reg was then riding a K1100RS (not a slick-shifting Honda VFR), and you could NOT feel a single shift, up or down. (Jason is the same, a clone of his dad.) BTW, these guys are also much faster than you can believe, too! Think there's a connection between "smooth" and "fast?" Right. You got it.
Walking Eagle
If any of you have ridden on the seat behind Reg Pridmore (or other Aces) -- You now know what smooth is. The first time I did this a few years ago, Reg was then riding a K1100RS (not a slick-shifting Honda VFR), and you could NOT feel a single shift, up or down. (Jason is the same, a clone of his dad.) BTW, these guys are also much faster than you can believe, too! Think there's a connection between "smooth" and "fast?" Right. You got it.
Walking Eagle
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