rich
#37829
It is. As adults, I think it's ok to discuss something besides a motorbike once in a while.
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My last BMW vehicle
- Thread starter stevenrankin
- Start date
It is. As adults, I think it's ok to discuss something besides a motorbike once in a while.
stevenrankin
Active member
It is
Yes, it is a motorcycle forum however, I am as I have said many times before been fed up first with BMW motorcycle and now BMW cars. I am very happily blasting them for what are now both for cars and bikes to be high priced unreliable junk.
The recent episode with my car has cemented my commitment to NEVER buy another post 95 BMW motorcycle (oh K bikes included) and for sure to never buy a car again.
I have written in the past that I don't want this forum to be a cheerleading site for BMW, I prefer honest plus or minus information and I appreciate people do vent their frustrations here about the short comings of BMW.
I wish I had joined a BMW car forum and learned about my car before buying it. Or, maybe I would have had a heads up that at less than 100,000 miles I would have to spend a big chunk of change for repairs I never. worried about/had in cheaper domestic/Japanese cars and trucks. St.
Yes, it is a motorcycle forum however, I am as I have said many times before been fed up first with BMW motorcycle and now BMW cars. I am very happily blasting them for what are now both for cars and bikes to be high priced unreliable junk.
The recent episode with my car has cemented my commitment to NEVER buy another post 95 BMW motorcycle (oh K bikes included) and for sure to never buy a car again.
I have written in the past that I don't want this forum to be a cheerleading site for BMW, I prefer honest plus or minus information and I appreciate people do vent their frustrations here about the short comings of BMW.
I wish I had joined a BMW car forum and learned about my car before buying it. Or, maybe I would have had a heads up that at less than 100,000 miles I would have to spend a big chunk of change for repairs I never. worried about/had in cheaper domestic/Japanese cars and trucks. St.
riderr1150gsadv
Well-known member
The sad state of plastic engine parts is not only happening at BMW. VW Audi and Mercedes have plastic engine parts like valve covers, oil-pans and intake runners too as do many other car manufacturers. Not to mention that some cars don't have dipsticks anymore either..
However I do agree that certain parts should be made out of aluminum as they were before. Plastic cooling pipes are specially a stupid move. A friend of min has a 20 year old 3 series that required replacement of 80% of the cooling system because of the plastics breaking and leaking. Most of these parts come from China btw..
YMMV
Having said that, I still like my GSA...
However I do agree that certain parts should be made out of aluminum as they were before. Plastic cooling pipes are specially a stupid move. A friend of min has a 20 year old 3 series that required replacement of 80% of the cooling system because of the plastics breaking and leaking. Most of these parts come from China btw..
YMMVHaving said that, I still like my GSA...
88bmwjeff
SF Bay Area
I pondered for a few days deciding whether to comment in this thread. I think everybody here has their own experiences that have shaped their opinions and I doubt anyone would be able to say something that would change them. But, I’m throwing my thoughts (on a macro level) into the ring anyway.
IMO, luxury vehicles today is more about the driving/riding experience than reliability. There are everyday vehicles that are more reliable, but are less fun to drive/ride. Luxury manufactures seem to want to be the first one out with a new feature, but like all new things, reliability is often less than desired. If my memory serves me correct, the number one complaint on vehicles is their interface with phones. BMW is a luxury vehicle manufacturer; as such, it has all the pluses and minuses of a luxury vehicle manufacturer—that I would expect to be similar to most luxury manufacturers. However, this is conjecture, since I didn’t research this.
While some blame rests with the manufacturers, some blame rests with us as consumers—this is the greater societal “us/we” not just “us” here. We complain of the high cost of parts., then complain of the low quality of that same part. And at times, people purchase less expensive lower quality part instead of the more expensive higher quality part. As such, manufacturers try to balance the two. Granted there are other issues that factor into that, but we do own part of the blame.
IMO, luxury vehicles today is more about the driving/riding experience than reliability. There are everyday vehicles that are more reliable, but are less fun to drive/ride. Luxury manufactures seem to want to be the first one out with a new feature, but like all new things, reliability is often less than desired. If my memory serves me correct, the number one complaint on vehicles is their interface with phones. BMW is a luxury vehicle manufacturer; as such, it has all the pluses and minuses of a luxury vehicle manufacturer—that I would expect to be similar to most luxury manufacturers. However, this is conjecture, since I didn’t research this.
While some blame rests with the manufacturers, some blame rests with us as consumers—this is the greater societal “us/we” not just “us” here. We complain of the high cost of parts., then complain of the low quality of that same part. And at times, people purchase less expensive lower quality part instead of the more expensive higher quality part. As such, manufacturers try to balance the two. Granted there are other issues that factor into that, but we do own part of the blame.
stevenrankin
Active member
Engineering
Maybe my title is not correct for what I am going to write here.
If a company has the supposed design and engineering capabilities BMW is supposed to have, I find it hard to fathom why reliability cannot be just as important as high tech gizmo function and go fast speed and handling?
So you all don't mind spending big bucks for a status symbol or go fast car or bike that is less reliable than a much cheaper plod car?
I am lucky this car and bike are toys, I can afford to have them repaired, it is a shame BMW makes a car or bike that needs repair sooner or more frequently than cars/bikes costing thousands less.
Duh, I keep forgetting modern manufacturing practice these days; design them to be cheap to build, fast to assemble, sell for the highest price. Remember most new customers will be trading in every three years. St.
Maybe my title is not correct for what I am going to write here.
If a company has the supposed design and engineering capabilities BMW is supposed to have, I find it hard to fathom why reliability cannot be just as important as high tech gizmo function and go fast speed and handling?
So you all don't mind spending big bucks for a status symbol or go fast car or bike that is less reliable than a much cheaper plod car?
I am lucky this car and bike are toys, I can afford to have them repaired, it is a shame BMW makes a car or bike that needs repair sooner or more frequently than cars/bikes costing thousands less.
Duh, I keep forgetting modern manufacturing practice these days; design them to be cheap to build, fast to assemble, sell for the highest price. Remember most new customers will be trading in every three years. St.
globalrider
Alps Adventurer
EXACTLY why I will never part with my 1990 BMW R100 GS that I bought new back then as well as the 1986 R80 G/S Paris Dakar that I bought used and will get restored to like new if I live that long.
Buy a Toyota/Lexus or a Honda/Acura. My 1999 Honda CR-V that I bought new was trouble-free (other than general maintenance...camshaft belt, brakes, tires) in the 152,000 miles that I owned it and it now has 205,000 miles in the hands of a friend. I can't really comment on my Porsches due to low sunny day mileages but a $15 O-ring needed replacing. I do my own maintenance and repairs.
As Scotty once said: " The more they overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain".
brownie0486
Well-known member
All my mc's have been toys with the exception of the police bike I was assigned to ride for a time on a dept. If I couldn't afford the toys, I wouldn't own them. When is a motorcycle not a toy? When that's all one has for transportation. I've never been in that situation fortunately.
stevenrankin
Active member
Toys
Toys should not break on their own or from normal or light use. Granted the more complex a toy is the less reliable it is. Still if I buy a high priced toy, I expect quality.
Duh what am I saying, a toy breaks buy a new one, maybe that is why BMW can get away with such nonsense. People are willing to put up with the nonsense to have their toys, I do myself to a point?
My tolerance for junk toys is a lot lower than average.
Good thing I never had kids or they may have been disappointed. St.
Toys should not break on their own or from normal or light use. Granted the more complex a toy is the less reliable it is. Still if I buy a high priced toy, I expect quality.
Duh what am I saying, a toy breaks buy a new one, maybe that is why BMW can get away with such nonsense. People are willing to put up with the nonsense to have their toys, I do myself to a point?
My tolerance for junk toys is a lot lower than average.
Good thing I never had kids or they may have been disappointed. St.
cajunrider
Member
Watching the motorcycle market over the past few years, it appears this is a common thought (as it SHOULD be).
The recent explosion of sub $10k (and a few even sub $5k) offerings, along with how many of them you see on the road, seems to have made things a little more tolerable to new riders.
Robsandy5011
New member
Extended warranty
So….. is it worth coughing up $1200 to get 4 more years on a 2020 rs ????
So….. is it worth coughing up $1200 to get 4 more years on a 2020 rs ????
brownie0486
Well-known member
I've taken extended warranties for about that price for 2-3 not 4 years, and used both of them on two different motors within months of signing the contract.
One takes their chances and pays their dues. It's a risk/reward equation.
One takes their chances and pays their dues. It's a risk/reward equation.
Consumer Reports Rates BMW 3-Series as Top Ten Reliable Cars
Latest from Consumer Reports on most reliable cars:
OVERALL SCORE
85
Add to Compare
CR RECOMMENDED
2023 BMW 3 Series
$43,800 - $82,600
See Pricing Info
I currently drive an Acura RDX and love the car. But I think I love my R1250RT even more!
Latest from Consumer Reports on most reliable cars:
OVERALL SCORE
85
Add to Compare
CR RECOMMENDED
2023 BMW 3 Series
$43,800 - $82,600
See Pricing Info
I currently drive an Acura RDX and love the car. But I think I love my R1250RT even more!
?
The most reliable 2023 model year cars? They aren’t even a year old yet.
Most problems don’t show up until 40-50,000 miles. That’s when stuff starts getting expensive and why so many lease or trade certain brands when the warranty runs out.
A friend has an old Tundra pickup with over 250k miles and regularly drives it over 1,000 miles to visit friends and family in Montana. That’s reliable …
globalrider
Alps Adventurer
Those reviews are so laughable.
My daily driver, having had ultra reliable Toyotas and Hondas for 16 and 14 years, is a 2017 Acrua RDX, the 2nd gen V6 version.
Read some books on the culture in the automotive industry.
"On a Clear Day You Can See GM" by DeLorean.
"Comeback: The Fall And Rise Of The American Auto Industry"
pglaves
#13338
For these ratings to be at all useful you need to read the fine print. Typically the rating comes from the number of "complaints" per a certain number of owners: say complaints per 100 owners. That is at best a crude measure.
One "my blue tooth didn't connect" equals one "my engine blew up" or one "the frame cracked". Unless the specific complaints are documented the overall ratings are meaningless at best and disinformation at worst. In the old days they sold magazines and now they get lots of "likes".
One "my blue tooth didn't connect" equals one "my engine blew up" or one "the frame cracked". Unless the specific complaints are documented the overall ratings are meaningless at best and disinformation at worst. In the old days they sold magazines and now they get lots of "likes".
chadhargis
Member
Correct!
And you also have to factor in maintenance. Most people who purchase a "premium" car keep up with the maintenance. A trip to the dealer for a $200 oil change is nothing to someone who bought a $70,000 vehicle. But someone buying a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge is going to use and abuse that vehicle for all it's worth and if they do maintain it...it's going to be at a sub par quick lube joint. You also see a lot of cheaper cars used in rental fleets and then sold to the public where they have issues.
For the most part, vehicles today are reliable if you don't abuse them and you do the maintenance. There are sometimes design or manufacturing flaws, but they usually present themselves fairly quickly. I believe most every manufacturer is building cars with planned obsolesce. All these screens and tech in cars will be the limiting factor. When those screes go out, and replacements cost more than the car is worth, it won't matter how many miles the engine or transmission can go because you won't be able to turn on your climate control, radio, or other vital functions.
Visian
look out!!!
There is a reason that Dr. Deming was wholeheartedly embraced in Japan and virtually ignored in the US... the Japanese culture of consensus.
The Japanese automotive industry amplified this quality by readily adopting CAE and CAM software that emerged in the late 70s and through the 80s... they reduced their product cycle time, got products to market faster and kicked our American automotive ass.
Now that the automotive industry has become far more globalized, I have no idea whether this comparison is still valid.
But I sure do know that I like Japanese cars and motorcycles.
BMW Corporate Reports Record Auto & Motorcycle Sales for 2023
First half 2023 sales report and revised guidance for 2023:
https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/usa/...ades-fy-guidance-after-strong-first-half-year
Record number of auto and motorcycle sales. BMW stock up 12% YTD.
Harley reports declinging sales first half 2023. And, their stock has fallen 17% YTD.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rel...cond-quarter-financial-results-301887126.html
Meanwhile, Honda stock up nearly 39% YTD!
First half 2023 sales report and revised guidance for 2023:
https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/usa/...ades-fy-guidance-after-strong-first-half-year
Record number of auto and motorcycle sales. BMW stock up 12% YTD.
Harley reports declinging sales first half 2023. And, their stock has fallen 17% YTD.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rel...cond-quarter-financial-results-301887126.html
Meanwhile, Honda stock up nearly 39% YTD!
TEDZEMLICKA
Member
I worked for a U.S./Japanese joint venture automaker. Some definitely different philosophies.
