M
Manfred
Guest
Bottom of this page - pricing not on this page, however. http://bingcarburetor.com/bmw/bmwcvkits.html
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Ethanol and carb float problems . . .
- Thread starter CTellman
- Start date
Manfred -
You reference the "older" independent floats....different animal. Bing has come out with replacement floats for the old white ones. They look identical, mount the same way, but are alcohol resistant. The independent floats require a change in the float bowl (with the elimination of the overflow) and have a somewhat difficult process to set up the floats.
You reference the "older" independent floats....different animal. Bing has come out with replacement floats for the old white ones. They look identical, mount the same way, but are alcohol resistant. The independent floats require a change in the float bowl (with the elimination of the overflow) and have a somewhat difficult process to set up the floats.
AnnapolisAirhead
--Tony
This is very good news. So what are the BMW dealers carrying? I mean, why wouldn't everyone convert to alcohol resistant floats?
Around four years ago, I installed the independent, black floats & bowls on a 1978, R100S. They were not that difficult to set up but I didn't get any better gas mileage and they were not that expensive. I sold that bike and haven't looked at the Bing price list lately. I was very surprised to see how much they're presently asking for this kit. I wouldn't spend that much money to do the conversion, especially since the white floats are now alcohol resistant.
That's not my understanding...the white floats are same-old-same old AFAIK. The newer alcohol resistant floats are a carbon black or dark gray in color or something. That's what I saw at Johnson City.
You are correct. I meant to say "black" (but they look like the older white ones).
jammess
Jammess
Don't remember if I posted about my soaking the floats in KBS Coating at the same time I cleaned and coated my tank with KBS product but I did this number last early spring with what looks to be success. Floats look good after a riding season and coating didn't seem to require resetting the float levels. I don't ride in the winter months for obvious reasons and I always drain the tank and empty float bowls and give them a liberal shot of WD-40. Also changed out fuel lines to lines sold by Bing. Probably could have bought similar product from NAPA for maybe less, who knows.
3moskvichi
New member
You can minimize the problem altogether by limiting the time the floats are exposed to gas. About half a mile before I get home, maybe less, I turn off the petcocks so that when the bike is parked, the float bowls contain little or no gas. That way the floats aren't sitting there soaking in fuel. The only time they're immersed in fuel is when I'm riding.
PGlaves
#13338
My grandpa used to have to do this with his 1921 Ford. Ah, the wonders of technology.
Additive
I have heard there is an additive for the ethonal gas that inhibites the properties of the ethonal. Sta-bil introduced it because of all the problems in the marine industry. Tanks delaiminating and carbs going south seemingly overnight. Our lovely goverment and all the power and $$$ grubbing politicos are squarely to blame for this problem. FIRE THEM ALL
I have heard there is an additive for the ethonal gas that inhibites the properties of the ethonal. Sta-bil introduced it because of all the problems in the marine industry. Tanks delaiminating and carbs going south seemingly overnight. Our lovely goverment and all the power and $$$ grubbing politicos are squarely to blame for this problem. FIRE THEM ALL
typ181r90
Superkraut
I think you might mean this: http://mystarbrite.com/startron/
My local bmw dealer has it and I gave it a shot at my last tank fill. I have noticed the bike ran a slight bit smoother but as I haven't filled my next tank I haven't noticed if it improved fuel economy or had any other effects
RACEYDOG
New member
I have started doing that too. We'll see how it works on the new white floats I installed today. While I have everyone's attention, I have another question. The specs in the clymer manual say the floats should be 10 grams. The old ones were 14 and 15 grams each and were original bing floats. The new ones are 12 grams each. Should they be shaved down on top to bring them down to 10? Sounds crazy, but I am trying to minimize flooding/leaking and I really need to have these carbs running smoother.
beemerphil
Stage Crew
Geez, what a lot of haggling over nothing!
RELAX. Your bike is ok.
In the first place, float height is NOT THAT CRITICAL. Within reason is fine, no need to beat the thing down to the last .001".
The ethanol problem isn't that severe- I've seen saturated floats, of course, but not on every bike that comes through the door. Fuels vary, some are pretty snotty, most are ok.
Ethanol saturation doesn't become a problem til the float is significantly heavier than a new float, and begins to sit lower in the fuel. New floats weigh, IIRR, 10 grams. Worried? Weigh the floats. Or save your time worry and just replace them every couple years. They're cheap- are you?
Don't gas up at Discount Petrobarf. Don't add every available solvent fuel additive, that's just asking for trouble. Coating the floats with anything will make them heavier a lot faster than ethanol.....and if the stuff flakes/drools off, you have a new problem.
Ethanol-proof floats are great, but you're still gonna be into those carbs every year or so- airhead CV's need o-rings pretty regularly, and diaphragms every couple/3 years too. They're not maintenence free, and they're not gonna be. Live with it. That's why they made the bowls come off so easy.
I've installed the independent Bing floats for others, without any great problems; never used them myself, because it seemed a lot of money for.....well, nothing. I replaced my floats once in a while and never had any problems with them.
It's a smart practice to shut off the gas when you stop. The overflow stand tube in the float bowl is tiny- if you have a major float valve leak, it can still fill the cylinder just fine, while the overflow tube is draining full tilt. The tube isn't big enough to be a 100% solution. Besides, gasoline is....um.....flammable? Do you want a puddle of the stuff under your scoot, waiting for some moron with a cigarette?
I don't recommend shutting the gas off before you stop. (really? you really do that?) What if it stalls right before the semi changes lanes?
I've been draining and re-soldering cracked brass floats for....40 years? I don't see any more of them now than I remember seeing in the past, so it's hard to attribute a sudden rash of them to ethanol. I think they just crack from thermal stress over time- the brass is pretty thin. I mean, it's a float- and brass normally doesn't, so......
Who came up with ethanol? As usual, some well-intentioned, misinformed, smiling bobblehead in DC.
Politicians like it- another smiling baby to kiss, and a chip they can throw to those pesky environmentalists.
Gas retailers like it- they get to sell more gas. Ever check your mileage on gas vs ethanol?
Farmers love it- quadrupled the market price of feed corn overnight. Used to be a trash crop!
Rough on the water, though- corn farming is nitrate-intensive, and most of the nitrates applied wind up as runoff. Fish don't like it much. I hear there's a 600-square-mile dead zone at the mouth of the Mississippi........oh well. It's always something.
Want to haggle over something useful you can do for your Bings? Find a way to keep blow-by oil mist out of your idle circuit. Figure out what to use instead of a cold-start valve cover gasket.
Tune in next week for another episode of "As the Airhead Turns".........
Remember- it's not really rocket science til it gets past the clouds, no matter what they call it.
But if you're a real BMW perfectionist, I've got one last pair of titanium-plated Bing floats that Tom Cutter and I made in his basement back in the '80s, that I could let go for $300.
Each.
YMMV!
RELAX. Your bike is ok.
In the first place, float height is NOT THAT CRITICAL. Within reason is fine, no need to beat the thing down to the last .001".
The ethanol problem isn't that severe- I've seen saturated floats, of course, but not on every bike that comes through the door. Fuels vary, some are pretty snotty, most are ok.
Ethanol saturation doesn't become a problem til the float is significantly heavier than a new float, and begins to sit lower in the fuel. New floats weigh, IIRR, 10 grams. Worried? Weigh the floats. Or save your time worry and just replace them every couple years. They're cheap- are you?
Don't gas up at Discount Petrobarf. Don't add every available solvent fuel additive, that's just asking for trouble. Coating the floats with anything will make them heavier a lot faster than ethanol.....and if the stuff flakes/drools off, you have a new problem.
Ethanol-proof floats are great, but you're still gonna be into those carbs every year or so- airhead CV's need o-rings pretty regularly, and diaphragms every couple/3 years too. They're not maintenence free, and they're not gonna be. Live with it. That's why they made the bowls come off so easy.
I've installed the independent Bing floats for others, without any great problems; never used them myself, because it seemed a lot of money for.....well, nothing. I replaced my floats once in a while and never had any problems with them.
It's a smart practice to shut off the gas when you stop. The overflow stand tube in the float bowl is tiny- if you have a major float valve leak, it can still fill the cylinder just fine, while the overflow tube is draining full tilt. The tube isn't big enough to be a 100% solution. Besides, gasoline is....um.....flammable? Do you want a puddle of the stuff under your scoot, waiting for some moron with a cigarette?
I don't recommend shutting the gas off before you stop. (really? you really do that?) What if it stalls right before the semi changes lanes?
I've been draining and re-soldering cracked brass floats for....40 years? I don't see any more of them now than I remember seeing in the past, so it's hard to attribute a sudden rash of them to ethanol. I think they just crack from thermal stress over time- the brass is pretty thin. I mean, it's a float- and brass normally doesn't, so......
Who came up with ethanol? As usual, some well-intentioned, misinformed, smiling bobblehead in DC.
Politicians like it- another smiling baby to kiss, and a chip they can throw to those pesky environmentalists.
Gas retailers like it- they get to sell more gas. Ever check your mileage on gas vs ethanol?
Farmers love it- quadrupled the market price of feed corn overnight. Used to be a trash crop!
Rough on the water, though- corn farming is nitrate-intensive, and most of the nitrates applied wind up as runoff. Fish don't like it much. I hear there's a 600-square-mile dead zone at the mouth of the Mississippi........oh well. It's always something.
Want to haggle over something useful you can do for your Bings? Find a way to keep blow-by oil mist out of your idle circuit. Figure out what to use instead of a cold-start valve cover gasket.
Tune in next week for another episode of "As the Airhead Turns".........
Remember- it's not really rocket science til it gets past the clouds, no matter what they call it.
But if you're a real BMW perfectionist, I've got one last pair of titanium-plated Bing floats that Tom Cutter and I made in his basement back in the '80s, that I could let go for $300.
Each.
YMMV!
Last edited:
I've not heard of this spec...I see no reason to modify brand new floats. Snowbum did some testing on a number of new/used floats:
http://bmwmotorcycletech.info/bingcv.htm
Just clean your carb and passageways, set the carb up properly, and there should be no real problems with leaking. They really do work fine.
AnnapolisAirhead
--Tony
+1 on a lot of fuss over nothing really. Shaving your floats to make your carbs run smoother? Ain't gunna happen IMO.
Those specs are akin to a speed limit sign or the line on a shot glass--technically those are the rules, but in reality they are only estimates/guidelines. Your o-rings, jets, cleanliness of the fuel circuit and balancing will help your road tractor run smoother.
Straight slides
I had some other thoughts about this, but then I see you are running an R50/5. A lot of the info and responses here will be based on the Bing CV's, which you do not have.
So my only suggestions which might be useful for your specific carbs would be;
Clean the carbs
Replace fuel line with something less sensitive to alcohol - found that braided looking fuel line from the dealer really leaches out from the alcohol - leaving black goo in the carbs
Take the bike for a 15 minute ride before attempting carb synchronization. Garage warmup doesn't cut it.
hopefully someone running slide carbs will have some other info for you.....
I had some other thoughts about this, but then I see you are running an R50/5. A lot of the info and responses here will be based on the Bing CV's, which you do not have.
So my only suggestions which might be useful for your specific carbs would be;
Clean the carbs
Replace fuel line with something less sensitive to alcohol - found that braided looking fuel line from the dealer really leaches out from the alcohol - leaving black goo in the carbs
Take the bike for a 15 minute ride before attempting carb synchronization. Garage warmup doesn't cut it.
hopefully someone running slide carbs will have some other info for you.....
AnnapolisAirhead
--Tony
He probably has the type 53 sliders, but they still have a bowl and floats. Right? I think the bowls have a drain plug on the bottom of the bowl, but essentially the rest is the same with respect to running out the fuel from the bowls.
Good call on the warm up before sync. It made a huge difference on my bike during my learning curve trying to figure it out. A 10 mile loop did the trick.
