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Sad story about a young traveler.

I'm just hearing the oft quoted passage about Judge ye not... just sayin':dunno ...
:) That's the one verse that many atheists remember from the Bible. :) I'm not saying that's why you know it, just that it is.

The context does not leave out making an evaluation or an assessment. In Matthew 7:15-16, Jesus is clearly indicating that some assessment has to be made when He says "You will know them by their fruits." In other words, by their actions and the results of those actions.
 
I'm just hearing the oft quoted passage about Judge ye not... just sayin':dunno

Situational awareness is not a gender specific need. It is sad to read about the womans ordeal during her quest for adventure. She is not the only woman to ever travel alone, in less than Maple Avenue settings,or in foreign to us lands.

Glenn Heggstad comes to mind, what a story he tells about being kidnapped on one of his many adventures.I never questioned his sanity, admired his mindset and fortitude though.

Anyways, I don't judge others quests and adventures...some not for me at 61, though looking back, given the opportunity I would have given many of them a shot.

:thumb
 
There is a lot of the world you can experience without putting yourself in much danger. There is a big grey area between experiencing the world and sitting at home.

I live in the USA and travel as much as time allows. There are areas of the USA I avoid. You don't need to throw yourself into dangerous areas to experience the world. There are areas that it might be best to not see. Also avoid areas at different times of day. I might travel through some rough neighborhoods during the day, but I sure will not go there at night.

Beg to differ. The world holds many dangers and if you explore this world, you'll be moving through many of them. Even as you may not be fully aware of the danger/risks to traveling.

From being pick pocketed on the streets of Paris, to being abducted right here on the streets of the US of A, there's risk and dangers aplenty once you leave the comfort of your own dwelling.

Just last week, a 19 yr old girl had an attempt to abduct her by a couple while she was coming out of the library. This in a community that's known to be safer than the surrounding cities/towns. So, walk out of your house, dangers exist. They exist 1 mile from your house and exist 10K miles from your house.

Ones perception of risk/reward usually isn't part of the decision process when doing a rtw tour. However, even knowing the risks, there's this.

The sweet smell of success, of accomplishing something very few [ relatively speaking ] would dare to attempt, let alone finish. Life is full of risks. Really living life isn't for the feint of heart.
 

Thanks for the lesson...let's not travel down that path here please my brother:wave

My point was who are we to pass any judgement on others choices,dreams,passions. If you want to make a difference and donate for her fine, if not, let her live her life and choices.
 
Beg to differ. The world holds many dangers and if you explore this world, you'll be moving through many of them. Even as you may not be fully aware of the danger/risks to traveling.

So you are trying to tell me you are as likely to get assaulted in the south side of Chicago as any home town library?

I will agree there is danger every where, but the odds of something happening change drastically with the location.

You can get assaulted in your own home, but it doesn't mean your home is as dangerous as Chicago's south side at midnight Saturday.
 
So you are trying to tell me you are as likely to get assaulted in the south side of Chicago as any home town library?

I will agree there is danger every where, but the odds of something happening change drastically with the location.

You can get assaulted in your own home, but it doesn't mean your home is as dangerous as Chicago's south side at midnight Saturday.

Risk/reward. I've not alluded to more or less risk. You can't experience Delhi India without risks involved anymore than you can Chicago's south side. One can't travel the world anywhere without an element of risk, and that includes the good old US of A. In any town USA at that.

Life isn't for the feint of heart. Adventurers have always accepted inherent risks of traveling to unknowns. If you don't want to experience risk or life to the fullest, sit on the couch and watch the Simpsons.

Riding a motorcycle is a risk in and of itself. People choose to ride knowing the risks. What we don't normally see is people telling others who were involved in a crash they should have stayed off motorcycles and surrounded themselves in cages however.
 
Thanks for the lesson...let's not travel down that path here please my brother:wave

My point was who are we to pass any judgement on others choices,dreams,passions. If you want to make a difference and donate for her fine, if not, let her live her life and choices.

:thumb
 
Risk/reward. I've not alluded to more or less risk. You can't experience Delhi India without risks involved anymore than you can Chicago's south side. One can't travel the world anywhere without an element of risk, and that includes the good old US of A. In any town USA at that.

Life isn't for the feint of heart. Adventurers have always accepted inherent risks of traveling to unknowns. If you don't want to experience risk or life to the fullest, sit on the couch and watch the Simpsons.

Riding a motorcycle is a risk in and of itself. People choose to ride knowing the risks. What we don't normally see is people telling others who were involved in a crash they should have stayed off motorcycles and surrounded themselves in cages however.

"Risk/reward." One of the things you do as a project manager, is to study the risks associated with your project. There's a whole discipline called "risk management" devoted to it, because of its importance. You identify the risks and then quantify the probability of it occurring and what the costs will be. It gives you a way to prioritize, find solutions to your risks and at least mitigate those risks. It's just as applicable to construction projects, building airplanes, riding motorcycles or taking international trips. To ignore the risks and not plan for them, is to encourage failure.

I'll bet each person reading this, practices risk management in their motorcycle riding. We wear helmets, and wear riding gear to protect ourselves in the event that risk (of falling) becomes a reality. We ride at a speed on the roads that is dictated in our minds by an evaluation of the risk involved in riding faster, whether it is because of the risk of a ticket or the risk of an accident. Chances are that when we see someone weaving in and out of traffic on a sport bike with flip-flops, and just a t-shirt and shorts for clothing, we make a judgment in our minds. You could easily make an argument that that "zoom-splat" is living life to the fullest, ...and you riding as you normally do, are not. You might even think in the back of your mind that if they keep riding like that, they won't pass on their DNA and might become an organ donor.

And if you don't think that, and you refuse to admit that you make that judgment...then follow their example the next time you ride. ;) I'll bet you won't. :) You practice risk management, even if you never thought of it that way before. You can still enjoy the adventure each of us finds in riding down the road, and not be stuck on a couch the rest of your life.


Here's an example from my personal life that I think might help. For seven years, I went in the local county jail to share the Bible with men. I loved it and enjoyed the interaction with the men. Most of the men I saw were in for minor drug charges, DUI or domestic violence. Towards the end, they moved me to a different cell block. These men were openly planning their next big drug deals for when they got out. It was a group of hardened and violent men. I realized that if we weren't in the jail with the safeguards I had in there, the situation would be dramatically different. If I was in their neighborhoods on the outside — I would be prey and they would be the predators. There's no way I'd walk alone in their neighborhoods without doing something to mitigate the risk. I'd end up dead or close to it in a very short time.

Whether seeing these men in the jail, or walking down their streets, I would be living life far more than watching the Simpsons (which I don't). But one would be totally foolhardy.

Chris
 
"Risk/reward." One of the things you do as a project manager, is to study the risks associated with your project. There's a whole discipline called "risk management" devoted to it, because of its importance. You identify the risks and then quantify the probability of it occurring and what the costs will be. It gives you a way to prioritize, find solutions to your risks and at least mitigate those risks. It's just as applicable to construction projects, building airplanes, riding motorcycles or taking international trips. To ignore the risks and not plan for them, is to encourage failure.

I'll bet each person reading this, practices risk management in their motorcycle riding. We wear helmets, and wear riding gear to protect ourselves in the event that risk (of falling) becomes a reality. We ride at a speed on the roads that is dictated in our minds by an evaluation of the risk involved in riding faster, whether it is because of the risk of a ticket or the risk of an accident. Chances are that when we see someone weaving in and out of traffic on a sport bike with flip-flops, and just a t-shirt and shorts for clothing, we make a judgment in our minds. You could easily make an argument that that "zoom-splat" is living life to the fullest, ...and you riding as you normally do, are not. You might even think in the back of your mind that if they keep riding like that, they won't pass on their DNA and might become an organ donor.

And if you don't think that, and you refuse to admit that you make that judgment...then follow their example the next time you ride. ;) I'll bet you won't. :) You practice risk management, even if you never thought of it that way before. You can still enjoy the adventure each of us finds in riding down the road, and not be stuck on a couch the rest of your life.


Here's an example from my personal life that I think might help. For seven years, I went in the local county jail to share the Bible with men. I loved it and enjoyed the interaction with the men. Most of the men I saw were in for minor drug charges, DUI or domestic violence. Towards the end, they moved me to a different cell block. These men were openly planning their next big drug deals for when they got out. It was a group of hardened and violent men. I realized that if we weren't in the jail with the safeguards I had in there, the situation would be dramatically different. If I was in their neighborhoods on the outside — I would be prey and they would be the predators. There's no way I'd walk alone in their neighborhoods without doing something to mitigate the risk. I'd end up dead or close to it in a very short time.

Whether seeing these men in the jail, or walking down their streets, I would be living life far more than watching the Simpsons (which I don't). But one would be totally foolhardy.

Chris

As I mentioned, I used to hunt humans for a living. The jungle is where I hunted them, the concrete jungles of inner city projects In Boston and Prov, RI, streets in the inner city sanctums of minority communities where the majority of housing was section 8 [ for just shy of 30 years ]. Been in areas of sections of Boston in the 90's that white leo's wouldn't go into to, nor were assigned to those areas due to the "risks" involved based on skin color alone. Me being a white male in THEIR hood only meant more inherent risks were present than if I stayed in a town like Milton just outside the city. However, solving major crimes was the goal, hunting the criminals committing those crimes the risk.

I also was employed to hunt BG's OCONUS involved in drug running, production, and kidnapping of Americans in central and S America. Plenty of risks involved, even on a small team. But the rewards were commensurate with the risks. Thus the risk/reward analysis every person must make when they adventure out into this very dangerous world.

Most people walk around in the white [ research Coopers color codes for further clarification ]. Oblivious to potential dangers and just go about their day unaware of what hazards life may bring, let alone prepared to deal with or solve. No matter what area one may be moving through, there's associated risks and many are unforeseen. Luck of the draw in a manner of speaking.

5K people could move through that same area on bikes and never be involved as a victim of some crime, but the one who is unlucky and is the victim of a crime in that same area shouldn't be singled out for their decisions to adventure forth as being foolhardy either. You go on a cruise, there's risk of becoming sick from the food on ship or while onshore, there's risk the ship will sink, that you fall overboard, yet people take cruises and aren't admonished for becoming a victim on shore visiting some stop the ship makes.

The wife used to fly international for twa. Dumped in cities like Cairo, Athens, Paris, etc for days at a time on lay overs. She'd take a Nile cruise at midnight along the pyramids, walk the streets of Cairo visiting the bazaars and shops, all by herself. Major risks for a young woman to be doing on her own, but she's someone who likes adventures, and made those stops just that, instead of safely sitting in her hotel room. She almost got blown up in Paris just walking back from dinner one night with 2 other flight attendants when a bomb went off at a shop they had just walked past and were just 3-4 store fronts away from when it went off injuring people on the sidewalk.

Risks everywhere in life, whether they are realized and acknowledged or not. People drive cars every day, there are 1.3 million people who die in road crashes each year, on average 3,287 deaths a day. An additional 20-50 million are injured or disabled. Driving is more dangerous and has more risk than that girl riding her bike through s, central america held.

Perception and what risks one is willing to take face anyone who is an adventurer. Even venturing out to the stop and rob for milk in ones car. :thumb
 
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This is the group that Booman and McGregor used for their “Long Way Round” trip.

https://www.objectivetravelsafety.com/leisure-adventure-travel

Highly advisable training for anyone traveling in someone else’s “jungle”.

OM

Good link to have bookmarked, thanks. I'm certain most members could benefit from some of their training, which is basically just forethought or risk management. Got too many years into the streets to worry about where I want to go, and becoming a vic myself. When moving through a jungle one needs to know what predators one may run into and have enough experience to mitigate the risks as much as possible :thumb
 
Risk/reward. I've not alluded to more or less risk. You can't experience Delhi India without risks involved anymore than you can Chicago's south side. One can't travel the world anywhere without an element of risk, and that includes the good old US of A. In any town USA at that.

Life isn't for the feint of heart. Adventurers have always accepted inherent risks of traveling to unknowns. If you don't want to experience risk or life to the fullest, sit on the couch and watch the Simpsons.

Riding a motorcycle is a risk in and of itself. People choose to ride knowing the risks. What we don't normally see is people telling others who were involved in a crash they should have stayed off motorcycles and surrounded themselves in cages however.

No argument from me, but don't come running and crying foul when you take a risk and walk into a lion's den and get bit. If you want to take the chance, you need to be able to accept the consequences of failure.
 
No argument from me, but don't come running and crying foul when you take a risk and walk into a lion's den and get bit. If you want to take the chance, you need to be able to accept the consequences of failure.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

Teddy Roosevelt
 
“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

Teddy Roosevelt

If the strong man stumbles he doesn't cry for help. He is prepared for any out come. He is prepared to deal with the results of his actions. I don't believe Teddy Roosevelt would have cried for help if or when he failed. I don't thing he would start up a Go Fund me page if he failed.
 
If the strong man stumbles he doesn't cry for help.


Really? Is that why there are hundreds of search and rescue operations all over the world who get calls for rescue? Or how about those who make treks into the Canadian and Ak. wilderness who take "in-reach" devices to call for help? Are those people simply not wiling to self rescue and walk out instead of crying for help? Please, your argument/opinion holds NO weight in the real world, people cry for help all the time.

He is prepared for any out come.

Unrealistic at best, NO man or woman is prepared for ANY outcome. To even state someone could be prepared for ANY outcome simply demonstrates you don't have a grasp on reality.

He is prepared to deal with the results of his actions.


Some are and some are not. And MOST do not know if they are prepared to deal with some incident/scenario until they've actually been placed into that scenario. Untested, no man or woman knows for sure.

I don't believe Teddy Roosevelt would have cried for help if or when he failed.

Simply a WAG on your part, but it's one option on opinions. Teddy never did any of his adventures on his own, he had numerous support people with him in his daring do's.

I don't thing he would start up a Go Fund me page if he failed.

No, but he may have started one or several for those in similar circumstances like this woman. He was a champion of doer's and risk takers, not timidity.
 
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