2018 K1600B - Software Recall?

jonnybow said:

Excellent, you do possess some knowledge of a brake circuit.
Now, that you have that down...you made a statement that started this discussion "Has to do with the top case taillight that flashes when heavy braking activates the anti-locks brakes."
to which I started some feedback. The flashing brake lights have no electrical tie in to the anti-lock brakes. I stand by that statement.
The recall has zero to do with the anti lock brakes and everything to do with a flashing brake light under heavy braking. Tail light flashers can activate several ways and none has to do with the activation of anti lock brakes.
I'm sorry that you got defensive about this but that's they way the system works.

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Sarcasm does not become you, especially when you don't seem to understand a simple concept. I really can't believe how obtuse you are. And I didn't get defensive, I just explained what BMW says is the reason for the recall. And since I work for a BMW M/C dealer I think I have a far better understanding of this situation than you ever will.
I said that the top case brake light flashes when heavy braking activates the anti lock brakes. Which it does. Heavy braking which does NOT activate the antilock circuit does not cause the brake light to flash. So the recall has EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE BRAKE LIGHT FLASHING when the anti-lock brakes are activated. Is that simple enough for you to understand?

Ok great, you continue life thinking that the brake lights are tied in to the anti lock brakes and since you work for a dealer, you know that it's true.
Have a great day sir, you are an excellent representative for your fine dealership.

jonnybow said:

Ok great, you continue life thinking that the brake lights are tied in to the anti lock brakes and since you work for a dealer, you know that it's true.
Have a great day sir, you are an excellent representative for your fine dealership.

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Okay, jonnybow, since you know it all why don't you tell us why the top case brake light flashes when the anti-lock brake are activated? That's what BMW says is the reason for the software update. Perhaps you have other information that they are not aware of.

Why don’t we call it a day on this
OM

What? Good clean fun entertainment!


I have to ask, if the flashing brake light is "tied" to the activation of the ABS, the brake light does not flash under normal, light braking? It only flashes when the ABS is activated?

Not helpful.
OM

Omega Man said:

Not helpful.
OM

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I know, I can't help it. It's my nature!

PoorUB said:

What? Good clean fun entertainment!


I have to ask, if the flashing brake light is "tied" to the activation of the ABS, the brake light does not flash under normal, light braking? It only flashes when the ABS is activated?

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That's what the software update says.

PoorUB said:

I have to ask, if the flashing brake light is "tied" to the activation of the ABS, the brake light does not flash under normal, light braking? It only flashes when the ABS is activated?

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Easy peasy to do too. The ABS microprocessor simply needs to send a signal to the microprocessor that controls the brake light function. Unless I missed something this is on a bike with a single wire for the tail and brake light function whereby one voltage powers the tail light and increased voltage makes it brighter to be a brake light. So adding in a simple little program to flash the trunk brake light if ABS is activated would be a good test question for a second year coding student.

I don’t get the whole recall anyways
How many of you have actually had ABS engage on a regular basis as well? Do they flash with any braking or
just under ABS engagement?

I suppose everyone of us with flashing brake lights are outlaws and need to be removed from the road. ( I know BC1100S isn’t a fan) Never been stopped in three countries and almost all US states for over 13 years of use on multiple models...

See, can ask a question and share opinion without friction

k1200travelor said:

That's what the software update says.

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I don't care what the update says, I want to know what actually happens. If the bike is sitting still, with the ignition on and someone applies the brakes, does the brake light flash, or on steady.

PoorUB said:

I don't care what the update says, I want to know what actually happens. If the bike is sitting still, with the ignition on and someone applies the brakes, does the brake light flash, or on steady.

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I watched a couple BMW videos from 2015 or 2016 showing dynamic brake light on a GS and I'm not sure.
They say the light flashes during emergency braking. Emergency braking probably means ABS has kicked in but they really do not say.
Below a certain speed the 4 way flashes come on. Not sure if the K1600 does that.

If we ever get dynamic brake lights in the US I hope it works with hard braking before ABS activates.

We have goofy head and taillight laws in the US. It took forever before we got decent car and motorcycle headlights.

Anyone could add a set of Skene Design P3 lights to most any BMW. Not a lot of money, and in 80K miles of riding I've never had an LEO stop me to "discuss" my flashing lights in the rear: https://www.skenelights.com/online-store/Rear-Visibility-Systems-c22720602

PoorUB said:

I don't care what the update says, I want to know what actually happens. If the bike is sitting still, with the ignition on and someone applies the brakes, does the brake light flash, or on steady.

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Would somebody who owns a K1600B with a topcase with a brake light please go apply the brakes and see if the light flashes or not. There must be an owner in this sub forum and applying the brake to see if the topcase light flashes ought to be viewed as a scientific adventure.

Paul, good idea. We have nothing else to do.

Now just sit and wait....

PGlaves said:

Would somebody who owns a K1600B with a topcase with a brake light please go apply the brakes and see if the light flashes or not. There must be an owner in this sub forum and applying the brake to see if the topcase light flashes ought to be viewed as a scientific adventure.

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Paul - per the official BMW Software Update information, the top case light only flashes when the anti-lock is activated. Just to answer your question, I just went to the garage and turned on the ignition and stepped on the brake. The brake lights do not flash. Then I started the bike and stepped on the brake - the brakes lights do not flash. Then I drove down the street and had my wife observe - the brake lights do not flash!

As I have maintained all through this tread, PER the BMW Software Update the top case brake light will flash when the anti-lock brake function is activated as a result of brake use.
I didn't want to get involved with whether or not aftermarket brake modulators or auxiliary lights ("Skeen or others") are legal or piss people off because that is a different issue and has NOTHING to do with the US DOT not allowing a motorcycle manufacturer to provide flashing brake lights activated by the anti-lock brake function.

k1200travelor said:

Paul - per the official BMW Software Update information, the top case light only flashes when the anti-lock is activated. Just to answer your question, I just went to the garage and turned on the ignition and stepped on the brake. The brake lights do not flash. Then I started the bike and stepped on the brake - the brakes lights do not flash. Then I drove down the street and had my wife observe - the brake lights do not flash!

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Thanks. I understood that to be the case but at least one person was adamant that it wasn't.

OK guys, can we have a conversation without anyone getting really emotional?
I addressed the post based on what I read, it said that the brake lights flash under heavy braking. I didn't see anywhere that the recall said when anti-lock brakes were activated (although it could and I missed it).
I also made a statement that the brake lights aren't connected to the anti-lock system in any way (which is correct, brake activation is what activates the brake lights through a separate circuit). This statement wound someone up really tight.
Flashing brake lights can be controlled by a number of ways, they could activate from a pendulum style "G meter type" device which is calibrated to feel deceleration forces and when it gets to whatever force the BMW engineers calibrated it to, it provides a ground to a relay which activates a circuit that pulses the brakes.
It could be a stand alone circuit that monitors the anti lock voltage and once it senses the anti lock brakes pulsing, it modulates the voltage going to the brake lights.

So, if the recall is based on the anti lock brakes activating, the circuit isn't directly tapped off the anti lock brakes, it's a monitor circuit that is stand alone otherwise any problem with the brake light would cause problems with the anti lock brakes which would be no good.
So, if my post regarding the brake light circuit was confusing for you, I understand. The bike is very complicated electrically and unless you are trained about it, do it for a living or are simply a geek, it's very difficult to understand.

Now, does anyone know for certain if this recall is worded specifically to say anything about anti lock brake activation?

The NHTSA Recall notice does not specifically mention anti-lock braking. Here is the information from the NHTSA Recall Notice #20V-146:

"March 12, 2020 NHTSA CAMPAIGN NUMBER: 20V146000
Brake Lights Flash During Braking/FMVSS 108
A flashing brake light can cause confusion to other drivers on the road, increasing the risk of a crash.

NHTSA Campaign Number: 20V146000

Manufacturer BMW of North America, LLC

Components EXTERIOR LIGHTING

Potential Number of Units Affected 4,026

Summary

BMW of North America, LLC (BMW) is recalling certain 2020 F900R, F900XR, S1000RR, F750GS, F850GS, F850GS Adventure, R1250GS, R1250GS Adventure, R1250RS, R1250R, RnineT, RnineT Pure and RnineT Scrambler and 2019-2020 S1000R motorcycles. The brake light may flash instead of remain steady during emergency braking. As such, these vehicles fail to comply with the requirements of Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) number 108, "Lamps, Reflective Devices, and Associated Equipment."

Remedy

BMW will notify owner, and dealers will reprogram the emergency stop signal function, free of charge. The recall is expected to begin May 4, 2020. Owners may contact BMW customer service at 1-800-525-7417."

You'll note that the K1600 has been removed from the recall notice.