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Thread: 2021 Harley Pan-America 1250

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by AKsuited View Post
    I see Harley stock is up quite a bit lately. I think the market sees something good in this new bike, and especially the new engine, and Harley's effort at producing modern bikes for a change.

    Harry
    Pretty sure they will be using that motor in their new sportster when that is reenvisioned


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  2. #62
    Registered User GTRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by upinsmoke View Post
    Pretty sure they will be using that motor in their new sportster when that is reenvisioned
    That engine in the XR1200 chassis would make for a very interesting bike.

    DeVern
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  3. #63
    Registered User easy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTRider View Post
    That engine in the XR1200 chassis would make for a very interesting bike.

    DeVern
    Indeed, it would at long last be a true Sportster.


    E.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    I read Kevin Cameron's article. As usual, Kevin is excellent. This is, on paper, an extremely sophisticated motorcycle. It will not appeal to very many KLR riders. It is almost shocking that HD engineers designed a motorcycle with this much technology and apparent sophistication but it is easy to hire a whole crew of bright young engineers for a project like this. Maybe they raided NASA. Which leads to a concern that this level of technological innovation will overwhelm a large number of traditional old-school technicians in the dealerships. HD certainly has its technician training tasks cut out for itself.

    I assume that there will be some early "teething" glitches with the technology and programming. BMW, too, has had its share. But I also suspect that this bike will come with shocks that work, brake calipers that don't leak, and sidestands that don't break and fall off.
    Maybe they hired Porsche design again for the engine. they've done this in the past for engine improvements.

  5. #65
    Ponch ponch1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    It is almost shocking that HD engineers designed a motorcycle with this much technology and apparent sophistication but it is easy to hire a whole crew of bright young engineers for a project like this. Maybe they raided NASA.
    I kind of disagree. I think they always had more capability, but never used it because of the culture at HD. The new CEO is changing that though. They can engineer anything that's anyone else can, just just didn't have the agency to do it.
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  6. #66
    Ponch ponch1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vtbob View Post
    Maybe they hired Porsche design again for the engine. they've done this in the past for engine improvements.
    Nope. This was HD. Of course BMW isn't above going outside. Ricardo designed the K1600 engine, no?
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponch1 View Post
    Nope. This was HD. Of course BMW isn't above going outside. Ricardo designed the K1600 engine, no?
    BMW does use a lot of outside technology and design on non - core areas. I'm not so sure on engine design, they have a lot of staff and resource on engine technology to support their many engine designs in auto / Rover side of the house in addition to motor cycles. Keeping all those products current, up to Euro/ American / Asian requirement would keep the critical mass of engineer busy.

    I just don't see Harley having the need for that critical mass of engine technology expertise. That is why they have used Porsche design in the past.

    ps the VW group/Porsche support, VW, Audi, Lamborgini, Bentley, Viron(sp?) etc and does a lot of out side contracting.

    Maybe Harley used Rotax? S&S, ....who knows.

    I have a hard time seeing Harley investing in that critical mass of skilled engineering unless they plan continued substantial future new engine design work.

  8. #68
    Left Coast Rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by r0ckrat View Post
    OMG! That's hilarious!

    Guy rides to H-D on a bike other than H-D, looks over the PA. Sits down to talk financing.
    "Wait, this thing uses English tools, not metric? You mean I gotta buy a whole set of tools just for this bike?"
    My Chevy is metric.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by r0ckrat View Post
    OMG! That's hilarious!

    Guy rides to H-D on a bike other than H-D, looks over the PA. Sits down to talk financing.
    "Wait, this thing uses English tools, not metric? You mean I gotta buy a whole set of tools just for this bike?"

    Eh, maybe I missed the punchline. In this age, if someone does any of their own service work, pretty sure they would own both SAE and metric tools.
    From the only real Fargo, ND!

  10. #70
    slave to gravity skibum69's Avatar
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    If the US had kept on track and gone metric when Canada did all any of would have is metric.
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  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by ponch1 View Post
    I kind of disagree. I think they always had more capability, but never used it because of the culture at HD. The new CEO is changing that though. They can engineer anything that's anyone else can, just just didn't have the agency to do it.
    Maybe.
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  12. #72
    Ponch ponch1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vtbob View Post
    BMW does use a lot of outside technology and design on non - core areas. I'm not so sure on engine design, they have a lot of staff and resource on engine technology to support their many engine designs in auto / Rover side of the house in addition to motor cycles. Keeping all those products current, up to Euro/ American / Asian requirement would keep the critical mass of engineer busy.

    I just don't see Harley having the need for that critical mass of engine technology expertise. That is why they have used Porsche design in the past.

    ps the VW group/Porsche support, VW, Audi, Lamborgini, Bentley, Viron(sp?) etc and does a lot of out side contracting.

    Maybe Harley used Rotax? S&S, ....who knows.

    I have a hard time seeing Harley investing in that critical mass of skilled engineering unless they plan continued substantial future new engine design work.
    Porsche was 20 years ago and yes, Ricardo did design the K1600: https://www.k1600forum.com/threads/r...article.87722/

    If they used someone else, I would think it would have come out and if they did, it will. They've had a lot of changes there in the last couple years and especially in the last year, but this has been coming for a few years. I think they have a winner here as long as it does well in tests and has no big gremlins. The fact they can make an engine that has a 9k RPM redline without valve adjustments is pretty cool. Anything that works and simplifies maintenance is a plus in my book.
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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponch1 View Post
    I kind of disagree. I think they always had more capability, but never used it because of the culture at HD. The new CEO is changing that though. They can engineer anything that's anyone else can, just just didn't have the agency to do it.
    I agree, the mid 70's nova engine is a prime example. Had they pushed ahead with that design no telling where they would be today.

    I'm glad to see this new design. I hope they go bolder and start kicking some import A$$.
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  14. #74
    Ponch ponch1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jandhumphreyme View Post
    I agree, the mid 70's nova engine is a prime example. Had they pushed ahead with that design no telling where they would be today.

    I'm glad to see this new design. I hope they go bolder and start kicking some import A$$.
    Mid 70's Nova? I think you mean the Vega. Had an aluminum straight 4. They didn't know about nikosil yet.
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  15. #75
    Registered User GTRider's Avatar
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    The Nova project...
    https://www.rideapart.com/news/42729...ct-nova-video/

    https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/201...va-look-might/

    Vega engines were very good for one thing—melting down to make cast aluminum projects in school shops across the country.

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