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Thread: The new M class

  1. #61
    Left Coast Rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by EUGENE View Post
    Never truer words!
    Ya think?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwCI...ature=youtu.be

  2. #62
    Registered User mlytle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC1100S View Post
    Computers can't change the laws of physics. Last night a guy in my town driving a McLaren cut his life short because he believed they can.
    correct, but computers enable clueless drivers to violate those laws at a MUCH higher velocity than they could without. as a high performance driving instructor, i get to ride with those drivers on tracks. i can feel the computers constantly saving the blissfully ignorant drivers turn after turn. obviously that results in some education with the students after the session...if i don't cut it short. new car capabilities are amazing, but they mask lack of basic skills.
    Marshall
    92 K75s, 94 K75s, 09 K1300s

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlytle View Post
    correct, but computers enable clueless drivers to violate those laws at a MUCH higher velocity than they could without. as a high performance driving instructor, i get to ride with those drivers on tracks. i can feel the computers constantly saving the blissfully ignorant drivers turn after turn. obviously that results in some education with the students after the session...if i don't cut it short. new car capabilities are amazing, but they mask lack of basic skills.
    I'm not sure newer cars mask "basic" skills. But they could certainly "assist" when the going gets brisk. As someone who grew up with a basic H-pattern 4-speed and then progressed to a 5 and then 6 speed and then paddles, I can certainly appreciate the potential of the newer vehicles. I would not turn off the TC in my 460hp sports car for all the tea in China.

    Is part of your program turning off all driver aids and then letting 'em loose on the track? Might be a way for someone to quickly learn their limits!

  4. #64
    Registered User mlytle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC1100S View Post
    I'm not sure newer cars mask "basic" skills. But they could certainly "assist" when the going gets brisk. As someone who grew up with a basic H-pattern 4-speed and then progressed to a 5 and then 6 speed and then paddles, I can certainly appreciate the potential of the newer vehicles. I would not turn off the TC in my 460hp sports car for all the tea in China.

    Is part of your program turning off all driver aids and then letting 'em loose on the track? Might be a way for someone to quickly learn their limits!

    you learned the right way. current crop of drivers learned......on a video game. no consequences for errors. cars today are like video games to them. computers correct most all mistakes. ham fisted steering inputs, binary throttle usage, mid corner shifting, jamming brakes, etc...all fixed by the computers. driver needs zero basic skills. so much easier to teach high performance driving in a bmw 2002. errors show early, often and at a much slower pace.

    lol..liability issues with turning off the aids. and i don't want to be in a 500hp car with a newbie driver and no controls. would be nice if drivers were required to show basic skills in an old Miata before being allowed to buy modern sports cars!
    Marshall
    92 K75s, 94 K75s, 09 K1300s

  5. #65
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlytle View Post
    you learned the right way. current crop of drivers learned......on a video game. no consequences for errors. cars today are like video games to them. computers correct most all mistakes. ham fisted steering inputs, binary throttle usage, mid corner shifting, jamming brakes, etc...all fixed by the computers. driver needs zero basic skills. so much easier to teach high performance driving in a bmw 2002. errors show early, often and at a much slower pace.

    lol..liability issues with turning off the aids. and i don't want to be in a 500hp car with a newbie driver and no controls. would be nice if drivers were required to show basic skills in an old Miata before being allowed to buy modern sports cars!
    European kart racing?
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    1) My expectations are never low enough & 2) Incompetence is infinite ........David Brooks

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlytle View Post
    lol..liability issues with turning off the aids. and i don't want to be in a 500hp car with a newbie driver and no controls. would be nice if drivers were required to show basic skills in an old Miata before being allowed to buy modern sports cars!
    I would never suggest you accompany a student in a no-driver's-aids ride around the track - unless you had a big insurance policy with my name on it!

  7. #67
    I am a geezer. So for me it is a sad, sad day when we anticipate, nee expect, technology to do for us that which we fail at doing for ourselves. Technology can be wonderful or it can be dreadful. Antenna anti-theft rings anybody? How is that HES working out for you? How well do you like that limp home mode? The car braking instead of the driver breaking- rear end collisions anyone? Does that self driving semi know what a motorcycle is? I could go on but would just be boring the technocrats and confounding the true Luddites. As always, YMMV.
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
    "The greatest challenge to any thinker is stating the problem in a way that will allow a solution." - Bertrand Russell
    http://web.bigbend.net/~glaves/

  8. #68
    not so retired henzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    The best part of my town doesn't have a McLaren
    While sitting outside having lunch TWO drove by yesterday, orange and obnoxious green that had to rev engine. Not my town and a pretty view of the Pacific.

    Iím not anti gizmo, just think everyone shouldnít be given the privilege to drive.
    Steve Henson-Mod Team and SABMWRA Prez

    Be decisive, right or wrong.The road of life is paved with
    flat squirrels who couldn't make a decision~unknown

  9. #69
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by henzilla View Post
    While sitting outside having lunch TWO drove by yesterday, orange and obnoxious green that had to rev engine. Not my town and a pretty view of the Pacific.

    Iím not anti gizmo, just think everyone shouldnít be given the privilege to drive.
    Gizmo stuff is great, but I do enjoy many of the elemental pleasures of driving. Of course, a 6-speed transmission in the 300-hp car is a bit of a toy....you can easily do 60 in 3rd.

    But, over the weekend, I took a ride up towards the PA/NY border which is basically twisty country roads thru rolling hills. On one the nice up hill runs I found myself behind an old cloth top CJ5 driven by an older fellow. Now, with the little four banger engine, the older fellow didn't miss a shift and kept the thing right at the speed limit. He was working it. Every turn required at least one down shift to maintain speed.

    Yes, I was frustrated and wanted to go faster, but it was no passing for the length of the run, which I may have completed by shifting from 3rd to 4th once or twice.

    I'm pretty sure the older fellow enjoyed his run than I would have enjoyed mine..........
    Cave contents: 16 R12RS, 13 Toyota Tacoma, 03 Simplicity Legacy, 97 Stihl FS75, Dewalt DW625 & SawStop PCS175
    1) My expectations are never low enough & 2) Incompetence is infinite ........David Brooks

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