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pappy35
New member
If your dealer is reputable (i.e. you trust them not to screw you) I'd run, not walk, there and show them those pictures. I too would be concerned but if there's no scoring then I'm not sure I'd panic about it (not saying you are panicking, just a figure of speech). Can you feel any scoring or a ledge at either side of the "polished" center section if you run a fingernail across each cam?
lee
Debbie's Servant
I looked at pictures on a couple of my valve checks and I have the same dark line on the edge that makes it look like a ledge. Like yours mine do not have a ledge.
Mine do not have the scratched look so I would still contact the dealer to be safe.
akbeemer
SURVIVOR
Oil was good. Serviced in accordance with BMW’s schedule using Castrol 5W-40 4T. Normal amount of oil in the valve covers and a good film of oil on the lobes.
stooie
Member
Kevin:
Gee, those look pretty bad to me. Just to make sure I'm seeing what I think I'm seeing: Are what appears to me to be circumferential scratches on the lobes truly in the metal? It's not just the oil film giving a funny look, is it?
If the cams really have those line/scratches in the metal I'd be asking for a very thorough explanation from the dealer. The problem with any sort of distress on the surface of cams or gears is that any mark at all causes a stress riser which leads to more distress and wear in the area. Once it gets to a certain level things degrade pretty quickly.
Good luck with it! Please let us know what the dealer has to say.
PS: This seems to be a good argument to be sending oil to a lab for analysis on a regular basis to keep on eye on wear trends.
Gee, those look pretty bad to me. Just to make sure I'm seeing what I think I'm seeing: Are what appears to me to be circumferential scratches on the lobes truly in the metal? It's not just the oil film giving a funny look, is it?
If the cams really have those line/scratches in the metal I'd be asking for a very thorough explanation from the dealer. The problem with any sort of distress on the surface of cams or gears is that any mark at all causes a stress riser which leads to more distress and wear in the area. Once it gets to a certain level things degrade pretty quickly.
Good luck with it! Please let us know what the dealer has to say.
PS: This seems to be a good argument to be sending oil to a lab for analysis on a regular basis to keep on eye on wear trends.
akbeemer
SURVIVOR
I have pictures sent to two senior techs at two different dealerships, one I know and the other is a friend of a friend. I already have the opinion of a well respected member of this forum who said they look okay to him. He can identify himself if he wishes. We shall see what the others say.
I appreciate the input of you all and welcome more.
I appreciate the input of you all and welcome more.
jandhumphreyme
Member
I've seen quite a few cam shafts over the years, some discolored, some not, with no discernable pitting or ridges I don't see anything I'd to be too concerned with at this point, certainly worth keeping an eye on. Do you have a dial indicator with .0001 scale? You could spin the cams and see if there are any low spots.
Thanks for posting the photos, very interesting and informative. Please post the tech's opinion when received.
Thanks for posting the photos, very interesting and informative. Please post the tech's opinion when received.
pappy35
New member
Given the cost of the parts, I'd take it in to the dealer and ask them to look at and document it.
If, and that's a big IF, they fail sometime in the future, that might help your dealer pitch BMW for good-will coverage. Since the covers are dangling in the the breeze (yay boxer!) it wouldn't cost much, if any, labor and might just come in handy someday in the future. Not knowing if those cams are treated in any way makes it difficult to judge but surface patterns like that look like chrome plating (or other surface hardening coating) that's wearing through. It's good than you can't feel anything but I'd still what an official evaluation.
PS - folks might take issue with me mentioning a specific coating. Yes, I have no idea how they treat those cams for wear resistance, but, then again, unless they work in the factory where they are made, chances are neither do they. So, caveat: This is all conjecture by a well-meaning but semi-informed lot trying to be helpful.
If, and that's a big IF, they fail sometime in the future, that might help your dealer pitch BMW for good-will coverage. Since the covers are dangling in the the breeze (yay boxer!) it wouldn't cost much, if any, labor and might just come in handy someday in the future. Not knowing if those cams are treated in any way makes it difficult to judge but surface patterns like that look like chrome plating (or other surface hardening coating) that's wearing through. It's good than you can't feel anything but I'd still what an official evaluation.
PS - folks might take issue with me mentioning a specific coating. Yes, I have no idea how they treat those cams for wear resistance, but, then again, unless they work in the factory where they are made, chances are neither do they. So, caveat: This is all conjecture by a well-meaning but semi-informed lot trying to be helpful.
akbeemer
SURVIVOR
I have not heard back yet from my dealer, I did get a response from a senior tech at another dealership who is a friend of a friend. His take as relayed to me is:
"He would rather see a cleaner, less scared cam, but when you take in that you have not had to adjust the valves in 35,000 miles, they are still in spec, your plugs are perfect, bike runs good and no unusual noises, he goes with the theory that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. We talked about the soft cam issues of the past, but your bike was produced well after those issues. He did say that you now have a base line to reference in these pics. Save them and to pull the valve covers in your next maintenance and compare what you see then to what you have in these pics. If there is significant degradation of the surface, you might want to sit with your service manager and see what good will he might be able to give you. Cam surfaces are not a wear item. But he doubts that you will have to do that...………...
"He would rather see a cleaner, less scared cam, but when you take in that you have not had to adjust the valves in 35,000 miles, they are still in spec, your plugs are perfect, bike runs good and no unusual noises, he goes with the theory that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. We talked about the soft cam issues of the past, but your bike was produced well after those issues. He did say that you now have a base line to reference in these pics. Save them and to pull the valve covers in your next maintenance and compare what you see then to what you have in these pics. If there is significant degradation of the surface, you might want to sit with your service manager and see what good will he might be able to give you. Cam surfaces are not a wear item. But he doubts that you will have to do that...………...
riderr1150gsadv
Well-known member
Those look like the hardening is about to give up. Those lobes are surface hardened and not case hardened.
I'd insist BMW replaces them before your warranty expires as to avoid the 'goodwill' BS afterward.... YMMV
I'd insist BMW replaces them before your warranty expires as to avoid the 'goodwill' BS afterward.... YMMV
lee
Debbie's Servant
It was still a problem in 2018.
https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthrea...-prematurely-worn-cam-lobe(s)-in-your-wethead
blacque jacque shellacque
Member
I am wondering if those pictures do justice to what you see in person? Did you wipe the oil off the cam lobe before you took the pictures? The angle of the camera, lighting and glare may alter our perspective of what we are looking at.
If you see no pitting. Feel and see no lines along the lobes, it may just be normal polishing of the surface. That being said, I would expect every wethead cam to look the same. My RS only has 21kkm and I haven't had the covers off with which to compare. Perhaps this weekend if it warms up. If memory serves me right, the cams on my high mileage R80 had a polished look as well. Hopefully its nothing to be worried about.
If you see no pitting. Feel and see no lines along the lobes, it may just be normal polishing of the surface. That being said, I would expect every wethead cam to look the same. My RS only has 21kkm and I haven't had the covers off with which to compare. Perhaps this weekend if it warms up. If memory serves me right, the cams on my high mileage R80 had a polished look as well. Hopefully its nothing to be worried about.
akbeemer
SURVIVOR
Well, two senior techs at two different dealerships have looked at the pictures and feel like I have no problem. I will keep an eye on the cams by checking them at every service and we will see what happens. I have the response from my dealer in an email so I have a record of my concerns. I have a lot of faith in the tech at my dealership. He has gone to bat for me with BMW on a warranty issue when BMW wanted to deny a claim, calls us at home when he needs info and fixed a bike in 20 minutes with a computer update when another dealership wanted us to wait a week to get a part that was not needed. So for now I’ll ride it like normal.
