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Thread: Jump Starting with car Battery?

  1. #16
    JohnWC
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSAddict View Post
    A properly charged Odyssey in good condition will crank at over 11v.
    The motronic does function correctly at 8.2v
    Thanks GS. Good to know the volts can go that low and the abs not default. I think I will wait until it gets into the higher 30s to try the battery jump part of this test. I didn't mention it earlier, but after the bike is run for a few miles, it starts instantly. No slow cranking.

    Even before I had this current problem, I noticed that as the temperature dropped, say 60 to 50 degrees, the bike had to be kept on the charger sooner. Are BMW twins just generally difficult to start in colder weather? Two large cylinders and pretty small batteries?

  2. #17
    Pepperfool GSAddict's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jconway607 View Post
    Thanks GS. Good to know the volts can go that low and the abs not default. I think I will wait until it gets into the higher 30s to try the battery jump part of this test. I didn't mention it earlier, but after the bike is run for a few miles, it starts instantly. No slow cranking.

    Even before I had this current problem, I noticed that as the temperature dropped, say 60 to 50 degrees, the bike had to be kept on the charger sooner. Are BMW twins just generally difficult to start in colder weather? Two large cylinders and pretty small batteries?
    In the 40's and lower, Oilheads don't like starting. The 20w50 oil is too thick.
    Switching to a lighter oil like 10w40 will help with winter riding,
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  3. #18
    JohnWC
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSAddict View Post
    In the 40's and lower, Oilheads don't like starting. The 20w50 oil is too thick.
    Switching to a lighter oil like 10w40 will help with winter riding,
    Again, good to know. And also what I suspected. The 10w40 oil would probably definitely help. I guess I can't blame the bike. Thick oil is hard to move when cold. I'm going to make a note to myself: 45 degrees or so is the cut off for starting it. I usually never try to start it during cold weather anyway, but the thought of having to wait till spring to diagnose/ fix the abs problem is irritating. Well, that's life.
    I wonder if the K bikes and vertical twins don't have this weather problem? Seems like my Pacific Coast V 45 did not.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by jconway607 View Post
    Again, good to know. And also what I suspected. The 10w40 oil would probably definitely help. I guess I can't blame the bike. Thick oil is hard to move when cold. I'm going to make a note to myself: 45 degrees or so is the cut off for starting it. I usually never try to start it during cold weather anyway, but the thought of having to wait till spring to diagnose/ fix the abs problem is irritating. Well, that's life.
    I wonder if the K bikes and vertical twins don't have this weather problem? Seems like my Pacific Coast V 45 did not.
    K bikes have more cylinders and are therefore working to compress fewer cc's per revolution. i.e. 1200cc 4-cylinder = 300cc per cylinder versus 1200cc 2-cylinder = 600cc per cylinder.

    Anecdotally, I've had to start my R bike in 30F while running 20W-50 and, while it turned over more slowly, it did start right up. I'l hazard a guess that the slower turnover was a result of a chilly battery. I'd think that it would have to be dang cold for the viscosity of the oil to make a difference when starting the bike. About a hundred years ago I was in -15F weather with a British sports car that had 20W-50 oil in it. It started.

  5. #20
    Pepperfool GSAddict's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jconway607 View Post
    Again, good to know. And also what I suspected. The 10w40 oil would probably definitely help. I guess I can't blame the bike. Thick oil is hard to move when cold. I'm going to make a note to myself: 45 degrees or so is the cut off for starting it. I usually never try to start it during cold weather anyway, but the thought of having to wait till spring to diagnose/ fix the abs problem is irritating. Well, that's life.
    I wonder if the K bikes and vertical twins don't have this weather problem? Seems like my Pacific Coast V 45 did not.
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  6. #21
    JohnWC
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC1100S View Post
    About a hundred years ago I was in -15F weather with a British sports car that had 20W-50 oil in it. It started.
    You may feel free to divulge the make of that car, and I promise it will go no farther. But I am guessing a 1972 MG Midget with chrome bumpers and SU carburetors. Arguably one of the finest and most dependable cars ever to grace our shores. I used to drive mine in cold weather, too, but never that cold! It takes a brave man.....

  7. #22
    Fortis Fortuna Adiuvat Omega Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jconway607 View Post
    You may feel free to divulge the make of that car, and I promise it will go no farther. But I am guessing a 1972 MG Midget with chrome bumpers and SU carburetors. Arguably one of the finest and most dependable cars ever to grace our shores. I used to drive mine in cold weather, too, but never that cold! It takes a brave man.....
    With a comforter on your lap for heat?
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  8. #23
    Left Coast Rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by jconway607 View Post
    You may feel free to divulge the make of that car, and I promise it will go no farther. But I am guessing a 1972 MG Midget with chrome bumpers and SU carburetors. Arguably one of the finest and most dependable cars ever to grace our shores. I used to drive mine in cold weather, too, but never that cold! It takes a brave man.....
    Darn close guess, Mr. Conway! 1971 MGB. Chrome bumpers, SU carbs, high compression engine, no smog pump, twin 6 volt batteries wired in series under the rear deck, aluminum hood. Did 85,000 miles in it and only had to replace an electric fuel pump. The designers, in their wisdom, positioned it in front of the rear wheel exposed to all manner of road crap.

    Sitting on the seat after a cold winter night in Toronto was like perching on a concrete block in a freezer. I loved that car.

    Apologies for major thread derail.

  9. #24
    Rocky Bow BMW Riders #197 bogthebasher's Avatar
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    The original post mentions Odyssey PC 680 battery is at 12.8 volts which seems really low to me. Normally they are charged at 14.4 to 14.7 volts and floated at 13.5 volts. The CTEK MULTI US 7002 charger is perfect for that particular battery's needs - especially if one has a persistent drain impairment. Of course finding the causal issue is best (sometimes easier said than done).
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bogthebasher View Post
    The original post mentions Odyssey PC 680 battery is at 12.8 volts which seems really low to me. Normally they are charged at 14.4 to 14.7 volts and floated at 13.5 volts. The CTEK MULTI US 7002 charger is perfect for that particular battery's needs - especially if one has a persistent drain impairment. Of course finding the causal issue is best (sometimes easier said than done).
    From the Odyssey website:
    "Full charged ODYSSEY battery voltage is 12.85 volts. ODYSSEY Batteries with less than 12.40 volts cannot reliably start big inch engines."
    https://www.odysseybattery.com/Support/TechnicalInfo

  11. #26
    Rocky Bow BMW Riders #197 bogthebasher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RadioFlyer View Post
    From the Odyssey website:
    "Full charged ODYSSEY battery voltage is 12.85 volts. ODYSSEY Batteries with less than 12.40 volts cannot reliably start big inch engines."
    https://www.odysseybattery.com/Support/TechnicalInfo
    Screen Shot 2019-11-16 at 14.44.14.png

    Two rally racing cars in my garage, both Toyota Celica GT Fours with 3S-GTE 2.2-liter turbocharged four-cylinder engines currently using this battery successfully. So not a large engine displacement but an insanely hot and demanding use case. Those batteries generally last one or two seasons of summer weekend track and rally racing and the drive to get back and forth. Wintertime cold weather cranking is very unreliable - often needing a boost if really cold (colder than -20C).
    Last edited by bogthebasher; 11-16-2019 at 09:48 PM.
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bogthebasher View Post
    Screen Shot 2019-11-16 at 14.44.14.png

    Two rally racing cars in my garage, both Toyota Celica GT Fours with 3S-GTE 2.2-liter turbocharged four-cylinder engines currently using this battery successfully. So not a large engine displacement but an insanely hot and demanding use case. Those batteries generally last one or two seasons of summer weekend track and rally racing and the drive to get back and forth. Wintertime cold weather cranking is very unreliable - often needing a boost if really cold (colder than -20C).
    The battery (any battery) does not assume the voltage that the charger applies in float mode once disconnected from the charger. The battery reverts to the voltage that its chemistry generates. The OP's observed voltage sounds perfectly normal.

  13. #28
    Rocky Bow BMW Riders #197 bogthebasher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RadioFlyer View Post
    The battery (any battery) does not assume the voltage that the charger applies in float mode once disconnected from the charger. The battery reverts to the voltage that its chemistry generates. The OP's observed voltage sounds perfectly normal.
    Agreed the voltage referenced is the minimum level not to be rejected per one of my Odyssey manuals if we are talking open circuit voltage:

    "Unplug the charger and disconnect the battery from the charger. Let the battery rest of at least 10-12 hours and measure the OCV. If it is equal to or more than 12.80V proceed to the next step; otherwise reject the battery."
    Ken Dittrick
    2008 R1200RT (Biarritz Blau)


    Excuses are the rocks upon which our dreams are crushed - Tim Fargo

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