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Thread: Standing while riding

  1. #46
    Registered User stooie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brownie0486 View Post
    All the professional off road course trainers, many world class title holders at one time, must all be wrong as well. Just amazes me how all the pros can be so wrong
    They are right that it works; that's why they all do it. Those who think that standing up lowers the center of gravity are still wrong.

    - When one stands up one raises one's center of gravity.
    - When one climbs a ladder one raises one's center of gravity.
    - When one ascends in an elevator one raises one's center of gravity.

    Apparently when his high school physics class was in session the guy in the video skipped out to go riding. Those who paid attention in the high school physics class, went on to engineering school, then spent forty-year careers in aerospace engineering just might have a little bit better handle on the why of it. Alas, we also probably ended up with lesser riding skills than he did.

    Ride long and prosper.
    Last edited by stooie; 09-06-2019 at 12:43 AM.
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  2. #47
    SURVIVOR akbeemer's Avatar
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    I will bet.... Marc Marquez cannot explain the physics of turning a bike, but he seems to be able do it fairly well. Perhaps the fellow in the video should stick to riding and like Marquez leave explaining the physics to others.
    Kevin Huddy
    The Outpost, Silver City, Montana

  3. #48
    '99 '03 '06 National Co-Rally Chair Friedle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akbeemer View Post
    I will bet.... Marc Marquez cannot explain the physics of turning a bike, but he seems to be able do it fairly well. Perhaps the fellow in the video should stick to riding and like Marquez leave explaining the physics to others.
    I know lots of highly educated people who can not find their way out of a closet with the door open and the light on.

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  4. #49
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    Pretty sure they are trying to say that standing moves the weight from the seat to the foot pegs. Sure the actual mass is higher, but what the motorcycle "feels" is much lower. You can "steer" the motorcycle by putting more weight on one foot or the other. Anyone that has spent any time riding in the dirt understands how this works very well.
    From the only real Fargo, ND!

  5. #50
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoorUB View Post
    Pretty sure they are trying to say that standing moves the weight from the seat to the foot pegs. Sure the actual mass is higher, but what the motorcycle "feels" is much lower. You can "steer" the motorcycle by putting more weight on one foot or the other. Anyone that has spent any time riding in the dirt understands how this works very well.
    Steer or lean?
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  6. #51
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stooie View Post
    They are right that it works; that's why they all do it. Those who think that standing up lowers the center of gravity are still wrong.

    - When one stands up one raises one's center of gravity.
    - When one climbs a ladder one raises one's center of gravity.
    - When one ascends in an elevator one raises one's center of gravity.

    Apparently when his high school physics class was in session the guy in the video skipped out to go riding. Those who paid attention in the high school physics class, went on to engineering school, then spent forty-year careers in aerospace engineering just might have a little bit better handle on the why of it. Alas, we also probably ended up with lesser riding skills than he did.

    Ride long and prosper.
    But, you don't have a YouTube video.

    BTW - an aerospace engineer, a marine engineer and a YouTube spokesman offer comments on CG. The peanut gallery responds with comments about educated people not knowing how to do things. Isn't the web a wonderful place😁
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  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    Steer or lean?
    Well, if you lean the motorcycle one direction, it should turn in that direction, so, both!
    From the only real Fargo, ND!

  8. #53
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoorUB View Post
    Well, if you lean the motorcycle one direction, it should turn in that direction, so, both!
    Only if the lateral axis of the tire contact patches intersect. If they remain parallel, the bike just leans. For example, when you're leaning into a prevailing crosswind.
    Last edited by 36654; 09-06-2019 at 11:17 AM.
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  9. #54
    Rocky Bow BMW Riders #197 bogthebasher's Avatar
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  10. #55
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    Loving this discussion btw. If my bike weighs 650 lbs and I weigh 230 kitted up and we are tied together as a unit then the speed at which the entire 880 lbs moves around is limited by physics in that the entire mass needs to be accelerated to acheive a specific outcome. The exageration of this is both bike and rider hit a bump that fully compresses suspension. Bike has to go up or bend. It runs into rider and rider has to go up or bend and in extreme cases rider gets acclerated vertically and decouples from bike and supermans to wherever. Road racers decouple by transferring force to the inside peg and making their mass as low as possible and centered between both tire contact patches. Their mass is also loading upmthe lowest part of the bike the inside low foot peg. It looks like they are sitting but they are standing on one leg and pulling the bike down with the bars as its trying to stand up. This also allows them the act as a shock absorber so they can go to the very edge of adhesion with some wiggle room for surface imperfections.

    The cg of the system of rider and bike goes up when standing but it becomes a totally different system when 880 lbs becomes 650 lbs not limited by the rider in how it reacts to riding surface inputs and control inputs with 230 lbs acting as a damper above it. The same bump that launches the rider off the seat into space now is controlled with the tires more evenly loaded on the riding surface which is safer than totally unloaded with 880 lbs of mass accelerated and vectored wherever.

    A good skier will have the majority of their mass very still with their hips and legs moving side to side underneath their center of mass. Direction of the system can change quickly because the upper body is not committed by angulation and is not a pendulum. On very tight roads the same is achieved on the bike by angling the bike and not the rider. I seem to be rambling. Good night fellow lovers of motos!
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  11. #56
    skibum69 skibum69's Avatar
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  12. #57
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisinsc View Post
    On very tight roads the same is achieved on the bike by angling the bike and not the rider.
    That's called being ...... "crossed-up". Your bike will have more ground clearance if you minimize bike lean by moving the rider CG to the inside of the turn.
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  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by skibum69 View Post
    Forums are the best place to watch fun topics get totally beaten to death
    It kind of got derailed onto a completely different topic. LOL
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  14. #59
    SURVIVOR akbeemer's Avatar
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    This recent image taken at a well known off-road riding training center illustrates an emerging technique designed to lower the center of gravity of a bike/rider combination. You can expect to see it in common use in your neighborhood soon

    moto-skate-4.jpg
    Kevin Huddy
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  15. #60
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akbeemer View Post
    This recent image taken at a well known off-road riding training center illustrates an emerging technique designed to lower the center of gravity of a bike/rider combination. You can expect to see it in common use in your neighborhood soon

    moto-skate-4.jpg
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