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Thread: Magazine plastic wrap

  1. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by GTRider View Post
    Absolutely. No one is arguing the need for covering, only the type of covering used.


    Absolutely, and just as easily done with a paper envelope covering



    Plastics can also be made from vegetable stock; the source material for plastic is not the issue. What IS at issue is the nasty non-biodegradable tendency of plastic, leading to it sticking around forever as microplastic particles in the water and food supplies of every species on the planet. Hence the pressures now being seen to move away from plastic for single-use products like straws, bottled water, and yes—magazine covers.

    The issue has been raised before, here in the forum and elsewhere, with no visible action or feedback from the powers-that-be as to investigating the possibilities or costs of changing to a paper envelope wrapper. Mostly all it drew was a lot of sniping from those who like their hammers and believe everything is, or should be, a nail. Stuck in the 50s/60s, I guess...



    Best,
    DeVern
    Exsqeeze me, but is there anything in my post.... posted to answer the OPs question... that asked you for a friggin' lecture?

    Not sure why I am wasting my time because I care about the environment, too... however... I also understand the concept of diminishing returns.

    fwiw, plastic is cheaper than paper, weighs less, takes less space and is moisture-proof and transparent (important factors related to mailing costs and marketing capabilities... and the energy required to manufacture and transport a material. Did you know that it takes about 4 times more energy to make paper? Paper of course can be recycled, but have you studied that industry closely lately?)

    also fwiw, Bioplastics are not a complete answer. Maybe biodegradable plastic is?

    It's really not that big of a deal. People that care so much can just subscribe digitally. Environmental activism isn't all that hard....

    And my June issue? It arrived mangled. In the plastic wrapper...
    So, clearly, one instance damns everything?


    < rant >

    You know, it seems sometimes that our Forum is going pretty much exactly the way our Facebook Group goes... a lot of finger-wagging pedantry in response to honest questions and answers. Yeah, I am known for going on about things like this, but it sure would be great to see a group norm evolve that reduced the amount of anal nannyism in our community. Or... maybe, this type of online interaction is reflective of our brand? I know that this does not happen at our rallies or other meat space interactions. If I were to judge my enjoyment of this club based upon on-line interaction, I would not join. What gives?

    < /rant >
    Last edited by Visian; 08-27-2019 at 03:26 PM.
    Go soothingly through the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon.
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  2. #17
    SURVIVOR akbeemer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visian View Post
    ......So What gives?
    Rampant aging with the concordant grumpiness, short tempers and diminishing tolerance for different opinions.
    Kevin Huddy
    The Outpost, Silver City, Montana

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by akbeemer View Post
    Rampant aging with the concordant grumpiness, short tempers and diminishing tolerance for different opinions.
    I resemble that remark.

    (except for the tolerance part)

  4. #19
    got, got, got no time... rguy's Avatar
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    I cut the label off my magazine polybag and recycle it at the local grocery store. Same with most of my plastic film packaging. The BIG problem is knowledge and education. Yes you can recycle this stuff and it is easy if you know about it and how/where to do it. Recycling is probably preferable to biodegradable whenever possible.

    https://www.plasticfilmrecycling.org...ags-and-wraps/

    https://www.how2recycle.info/
    Neal - '16 R1200GS / '81 R65
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    Be the person that your dog thinks you are.

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by rguy View Post
    I cut the label off my magazine polybag and recycle it at the local grocery store. Same with most of my plastic film packaging. The BIG problem is knowledge and education. Yes you can recycle this stuff and it is easy if you know about it and how/where to do it. Recycling is probably preferable to biodegradable whenever possible.

    https://www.plasticfilmrecycling.org...ags-and-wraps/

    https://www.how2recycle.info/
    Yes, sure, but ...

    Since China stopped buying plastic to recycle many recycle centers will no longer take it. Ditto steel cans. Right now all I can find that they will still take is cardboard and aluminum cans. YMMV at other locations.
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
    "The greatest challenge to any thinker is stating the problem in a way that will allow a solution." - Bertrand Russell
    http://web.bigbend.net/~glaves/

  6. #21
    got, got, got no time... rguy's Avatar
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    Recycle centers rarely take plastic bags - ours doesn't either. Walmart, Lowes, Target, Home Depot and many grocery stores take them - the collection box is usually just inside the front door. Ft. Stockton has a Walmart

    Supposedly most of the bags are turned into park benches and BMW motorcycle seats.
    Neal - '16 R1200GS / '81 R65
    _______________________
    Be the person that your dog thinks you are.

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by rguy View Post
    Ft. Stockton has a Walmart
    Given local stores I have no need to go to Fort Stockton to an obsolete little Walmart. And I certainly am not going to ride or drive a 250 mile round trip to drop off plastic bags. Sheesh!
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
    "The greatest challenge to any thinker is stating the problem in a way that will allow a solution." - Bertrand Russell
    http://web.bigbend.net/~glaves/

  8. #23
    got, got, got no time... rguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    And I certainly am not going to ride or drive a 250 mile round trip to drop off plastic bags.
    Nor would I Paul, nor would I. I was only trying to point out to the uninformed that, contrary to beliefs, their little MOA magazine polybag is indeed recyclable - for 97% of the recipients if so desired.
    Neal - '16 R1200GS / '81 R65
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    Be the person that your dog thinks you are.

  9. #24
    Registered User GTRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visian View Post
    Exsqeeze me, but is there anything in my post.... posted to answer the OPs question... that asked you for a friggin' lecture?

    Not sure why I am wasting my time because I care about the environment, too... however... I also understand the concept of diminishing returns.

    fwiw, plastic is cheaper than paper, weighs less, takes less space and is moisture-proof and transparent (important factors related to mailing costs and marketing capabilities... and the energy required to manufacture and transport a material. Did you know that it takes about 4 times more energy to make paper? Paper of course can be recycled, but have you studied that industry closely lately?)

    also fwiw, Bioplastics are not a complete answer. Maybe biodegradable plastic is?

    It's really not that big of a deal. People that care so much can just subscribe digitally. Environmental activism isn't all that hard....



    So, clearly, one instance damns everything?


    < rant >

    You know, it seems sometimes that our Forum is going pretty much exactly the way our Facebook Group goes... a lot of finger-wagging pedantry in response to honest questions and answers. Yeah, I am known for going on about things like this, but it sure would be great to see a group norm evolve that reduced the amount of anal nannyism in our community. Or... maybe, this type of online interaction is reflective of our brand? I know that this does not happen at our rallies or other meat space interactions. If I were to judge my enjoyment of this club based upon on-line interaction, I would not join. What gives?

    < /rant >
    Easy there, big guy--I think you've misinterpreted the focus of my comments, which apparently stirred the grease mud and roiled the skid demons.

    My comments were not directed at *you*; they were directed at the standard bullet list of responses that questioners get every time the plastic cover issue comes up. And this is the Campfire section, where monosyllabic answers don't add much to the discussions. I had hoped that given your tenure and stature in the forums that you might be able to respond with deeper information. Something along the lines of "director so-and-so researched this with our mailing company back in whenever, and reported back that A) they can't do this change, or B) we can do it but the change would be greater/lesser by a factor of $X, or C) we can do this, and for a small additional fee can furnish printed mailer envelopes where you can sell the ad space on the envelopes to help offset the cost, or D) something else.

    Every time I've seen this issue come up in the forums it's the same list of immediate responses as to why it *can't* be done, usually accompanied with a dismissive suggestion to the questioner to just do a digital subscription. But here's the rub--the present digital format is a nice addition to the website and probably reads ok on a regular PC, but reading it on a tablet is truly a miserable experience, more so for those of us with aging eyesight. We have discussions in the forums bemoaning the lack of young people entering motorcycling, specifically BMW motorcycling, yet I think it would be a safe bet that most of the GenX/Y/Millenials we'd like to bring into the fold are more environmentally aware and proactive than we old boomers, and likely more well-versed and quality-sensitive when it comes to digital materials. And they spend their digital lives on tablets and cell phones. For them, telling them without data that the slipcover can't change or they should just accept a substandard digital delivery is just an answer of "because". And I maintain that's never a good answer from parents, politicians, or...publishers.

    Hopefully smoothing out the grease mud and straightening the bars,

    DeVern
    DGerber
    1983 R80ST — 1984 R80 G/S-PD — 2004 K1200GT w/Hannigan S/C — 2010 K1300GT — 2018 R1200GS
    BMWMOA#52184, AMA#271542, IBA#138

  10. #25
    ZWEI KOLBEN
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    Sometimes, mostly everyday, I feel badly for the folks that run the MOA. You guys come up with the most obscure problems to solve. The only think that is more absurd is the bored BMW engineer that solves problems that do not exist while ignoring the ones that do.



    The little lights aren't twinkling Clark...…...

  11. #26
    Registered User GTRider's Avatar
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    Some problems are obscure only because we choose not to look at them. Problems are so much easier to solve while still small, before they blossom into big problems.

    Best,
    DG
    DGerber
    1983 R80ST — 1984 R80 G/S-PD — 2004 K1200GT w/Hannigan S/C — 2010 K1300GT — 2018 R1200GS
    BMWMOA#52184, AMA#271542, IBA#138

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by GTRider View Post
    My comments were not directed at *you*
    DeVern - well, you quoted me.

    Here is why (my guess, I have no inside knowledge to our big secrets) I think we don't do paper envelopes: at our Board meeting we learned that the MOA barely broke even, financially.... even though we raised our dues.... so every penny counts.

    As noted above, recycling wrappers and digital only memberships are the best way to express concerns, imo.

  13. #28
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    Yes, sure, but ...

    Since China stopped buying plastic to recycle many recycle centers will no longer take it. Ditto steel cans. Right now all I can find that they will still take is cardboard and aluminum cans. YMMV at other locations.
    Oh, when the Chinese stopped taking our recyclables ........... the landfill tipping charges jumped to handle the extra volume.
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  14. #29
    Registered User
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    My little problems, are not the same as my dad's little problems.

  15. #30
    Registered User lkchris's Avatar
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    I may have been the first to complain and suggest plastic wrapping ... just as all the major car clubs do, i.e. BMW, Mercedes, Porsche. I was complaining more than 10 years ago for sure.

    There was one month when all I received was the cover. About every month there was some degree of shredding.

    There were a few years I paid extra for 1st class shipping so I could get the plastic wrap ... I'm happy now that it's available to everyone.

    To assuage any self-righteousness regarding plastic, note that they are recyclable at your grocery store.

    Just wait for the industry to provide a better solution. No need to criticize the club in the meantime. If you must, you could instead perhaps take comfort in how incredibly long it took them to see the light.
    Kent Christensen
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