What makes your BMW better than HSYHTD

ponch1 · May 12, 2019

greenwald said:
That's OK. Not sure sacrificing 350 lbs. of durability and storage was an upgrade either. The most fragile bike I ever owned was the R1200RT.

Too light, too many gizmo's, too over-engineered.

Weight doesn't scare me. I rode PD Harleys with so much gear/add-ons, that they outweighed the Wing - not an issue if you have the training and skills. Could make those Road Kings dance when I needed to. A bike could weigh 1200 lbs. - could still make it nimble and fast. It's more about who's in the saddle.

Besides - the Wing seems to shed 300 lbs. above a walking pace - I sifted my way thru The Dragon's curves on a Wing better than I ever did with the Beemer.

But, back to our originally scheduled program: "Why we all like BMW better than all those other brands?"

Interesting commentary.

I went from a nomad to the RT and I like the lighter weight. The extra weight with cruisers does nothing positive and then there is suspension. I can handle the weight though. Right now I’m on the fence about riding. I’ve had two spine surgeries since Halloween and I don’t know if I should get back on the bike from a safety perspective.

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tanker4me · May 12, 2019

Pre '83; Briggs & Stratton, Tecumseh, Ossa, Bultaco, Yamaha, Suzuki, Honda, Triumph.

24 year break.

Post 2007; BMW R100GSPD, F650, R60/5, R90/6, 2 more Bultacos, a Yamaha and a K1100RS.

The support of this club, the AirHeads, BMW parts availability thru my dealer of choice Irv Seaver, & Motorrad are what smoke the others.

If just riding local, there might have been a Ducati, Guzzi, or even Norton a or 2 in the mix.
Bill
To paraphrase Southside Johnny, it ain't the bike it's the ...

PoorUB · May 12, 2019

ponch1 said:
They're building an adventure bike with a modern engine. We should see it next year.

Great for you dirt road riders, but I rarely leave the pavement. I don't know why getting a couple more inches of suspension travel, preferably monoshock is so difficult. HD's technology advances like a glacier! I was surprised to see HD was going that way again. The killed Buell a few years back, they could have continued with it with a better power train.

PoorUB · May 12, 2019

greenwald said:
Weight doesn't scare me. I rode PD Harleys with so much gear/add-ons, that they outweighed the Wing - not an issue if you have the training and skills. Could make those Road Kings dance when I needed to. A bike could weigh 1200 lbs. - could still make it nimble and fast. It's more about who's in the saddle.

Besides - the Wing seems to shed 300 lbs. above a walking pace - I sifted my way thru The Dragon's curves on a Wing better than I ever did with the Beemer.

I looked real hard at the 2018 "GW, but I refuse to buy the first year of a new motorcycle. After riding Harleys the weight of the GW is not an issue. It might be my next ride.

ponch1 · May 12, 2019

PoorUB said:
Great for you dirt road riders, but I rarely leave the pavement. I don't know why getting a couple more inches of suspension travel, preferably monoshock is so difficult. HD's technology advances like a glacier! I was surprised to see HD was going that way again. The killed Buell a few years back, they could have continued with it with a better power train.

I don't ride dirt, but a 1250 adventure bike doesn't have to be a dirt bike and probably better off. That said, companies, like people, get stuck because of their own limiting beliefs. I wish them well.

jrmull · May 13, 2019

On BMW R1200GSA, is there some functional benefit for front nose or just style? It already has front fender for water spray, so it's not for trail riding in creeks. What does it do vs a rounded nose?

greenwald · May 13, 2019

ponch1 said:
I went from a nomad to the RT and I like the lighter weight. The extra weight with cruisers does nothing positive and then there is suspension. I can handle the weight though. Right now I’m on the fence about riding. I’ve had two spine surgeries since Halloween and I don’t know if I should get back on the bike from a safety perspective.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

That sucks. My wife is recovering from two crushed vertebrae due to a car running over her. Just had the nerves of 3 spinal facets ablated (burned in half) in an attempt to relive pain.

Back injuries a long haul. Hope you can return to riding.

Have spent some serious time on my son's 2014 Vulcan Voyager - nice ride for a V-twin, but not as smooth as the Honda.

Wings are supremely comfortable and easy on the spine - just saying?!

Good Luck!

greenwald · May 13, 2019

PoorUB said:
I looked real hard at the 2018 "GW, but I refuse to buy the first year of a new motorcycle. After riding Harleys the weight of the GW is not an issue. It might be my next ride.

JMHO, but supremely disappointed with the 2018 Wing. Honda cramped up the riding positions, sacrificed durability for weight-saving, reduced aerodynamic protection and dumped 40 liters of storage space - again, to "save weight."

It's now nothing more than an 'ST1800,' rather than a top-notch touring machine.

2012 - 2017 the best years for the Wings. Sad to see Honda drink the Kool-Aid and shift away from dedicated touring dudes like myself, to court a younger crowd that can't afford them anyways. Remember the Rune?!

Mechanics are furious - nightmare to get at valves for maintenance, and dealer's are begging the mother-ship in Japan to offer an optional touring trunk assembly, to restore storage capacity.

Honda thinks they hit a homerun, but all they did was pop up a foul ball. :banghead

jamo · May 13, 2019

My opinion on weight is that heavier bikes absorb bumps better and ride smoother over highways with less expensive suspension. Lighter helps at stops and moving around and acceleration if you have less displacement. Once you’re touring on the highway weight disappears or is a positive.
Harley’s only real touring problem is air cooling and excess heat. The suspension is fine.

PoorUB · May 13, 2019

jamo said:
Harley’s only real touring problem is air cooling and excess heat. The suspension is fine.

Funny, but my thoughts are the opposite, my riding buddy feels the same way. Plus a lot of complaints on Harley groups.I don't have any issue with the air cooling. As for the heat I can do some mods and a tune and cure that. The rear suspension on the baggers is terrible. Worst motorcycle suspension I have ridden. You can't do much with 3" of travel. The suspension on the 2018+ baggers is a tiny bit better. There are bumps on roads we travel often that on my Harley in bottoms out hard, wife complains every time. On the RT she just says "Wow! I barely felt that!" More air in the shocks just stiffens up the ride. I have thought about aftermarket shocks, but talk to guys and get mixed comments. One guy will say it is worth it, the next will say it was a waste of money.

On the other hand I like the seating position and controls layout on the Harley better than the RT.

RPGR90s · May 13, 2019

Longevity and Engineering

jrmull said:
What makes your BMW bike better than a Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Harley, Triumph, Ducati, etc?

Telelever and Paralever keeps the BMW bike more controllable that the Honda ST1100's anti-dive forks? I took a recent skills class with a dozen other bikes (Improve awareness and cornering skills). Nine of the bikes were Harley's and their braking distance was kind of long. Some of the other bikes were diving a lot on the corner turns when braking.

Just curious what you found are BMW's engineering accomplishments. For me, the ABS, Telelever anti-dive, controllable power band on their K1200

Coming from a '71 Sportster that wasn't akin to the touring I had in mind in 1980, I found a pristine used '74 R90s. Knowing nothing about BMW's in particular (except from the strange looking engine), I came to appreciate:

shaft drive
an air cooled engine that stayed cool
engineered ergonomics, 500 mile days not out of the question
simple and robust design
Still have the bike, now with 140k

in 2002, test rode a R1150RT and was most impressed with:
the Telelever and Paralever suspension. Grab the brakes and the front end barely moves
Integral ABS power assisted brakes. Still incredible stopping power today
electric windshield
heated grips

Many are motorcycle firsts, which others have tried to copy.

I remember riding on the Blue Ridge Parkway about the time the Yamaha FJR1300 came out. A guy on a new one pulled into the overlook and we got to talking. Beautiful bike but couldn't help but notice all the copying Yamaha did. Saddlbag design and latches, electric windshield, etc.

BC1100S · May 13, 2019

greenwald said:
Too light....Weight doesn't scare me.

With respect, there is no such thing as "too light". A lighter motorcycle will outperform a heavier bike in every respect. Your preference may be for a heavier bike but that's your preference.

lstayner · May 13, 2019

Bikes

I switched from Victory motorcycles to an R1200 RTW about a year ago. Had Victory not decided to exit the business, I would most likely still be riding one. I put 110K trouble free miles on a Vision before trading it for a Cross Country Tour. THE CCT is not even close to a Vision as far as handling goes. The Vision was the best bike I have owned to date. As big as it looked, it handles just as good as the BMW. I didn't have to buy an aftermarket seat to be comfortable.

Al that said, I love the R1200 RTW now that I have it fitted to my body. I am not very fond of the fact that the dealer has to reset the mileage meter for oil changes. That is a little to much "Big brother" for me. Might be a deal breaker the next time I am shopping for a new bike.

jamo · May 13, 2019

BC1100S said:
With respect, there is no such thing as "too light". A lighter motorcycle will outperform and heavier bike in every respect. Your preference may be for a heavier bike but that's your preference.

Heavier cars tend to run smoother over bumps. So do heavier motorcycles. That said, newer Harleys are quite improved.

pappy35 · May 13, 2019

jamo said:
Heavier cars tend to run smoother over bumps. So do heavier motorcycles. That said, newer Harleys are quite improved.

I think you are confusing a physical property with a design choice. Ever ride in one of those big UHaul box trucks? You know, the kind that people like to drive under low railroad overpasses and gas station shelter? It weighs tons yet rides like it has no suspension. A Cadillac/RR/Bentley ride soft not because they weigh a lot but because they have suspension components chosen to achieve that end.

Same with HD/Gold Wing/Indian motorcycles. The market demands a smooth ride and the vendor produced a product to match. Having said that, I was amazed years ago when I test drove a Wing at how nimble yet cushy it was. I never rode a HD that handled any better than a Uhaul up on two-wheels (I'm extrapolating from two HDs and one Honda VTX1800 I rode, all three were POS as far as I'm concerned).

lupinblue · May 13, 2019

What makes it better? Easy: the boxer engine and shaft drive, plus the all round performance of my R1200RS.

BC1100S · May 13, 2019

jamo said:
Heavier cars tend to run smoother over bumps. So do heavier motorcycles. That said, newer Harleys are quite improved.

You've been watching too many car ads from the '60s.

tmass · May 13, 2019

BC1100S said:
With respect, there is no such thing as "too light". A lighter motorcycle will outperform a heavier bike in every respect. Your preference may be for a heavier bike but that's your preference.

while I agree that lighter is better I think the exception comes with highway wind, were the weight of my 630+ pound RT seems to make a difference for the better.

PoorUB · May 13, 2019

pappy35 said:
I never rode a HD that handled any better than a Uhaul up on two-wheels (I'm extrapolating from two HDs and one Honda VTX1800 I rode, all three were POS as far as I'm concerned).

The 2014 and up Harley touring frames handle pretty good considering their weight. Harley made a lot of major frame changes in 2009 and more in 2014 that improved handling immensely. Suspension still sucks!

bigjohnsd · May 13, 2019

I put 65,000 miles on my '13 FJR and 25,000 miles on my '09 KLR 685.

I had the opportunity to ride a friends '15 R1200GS and decided to sell both and buy an R1200 GS Adv.

Is the GS "Better"? Not certain yet, only 6,000 miles since I got it in December. I'll know more after my trip to Alaska in June/July

I like the way it handles, plenty good enough for me, not sure it is as "Fast" as the FJR but "Fast Enough" for this aging set of bones. I like the riding position better, not as cramped. Maintenance cost is a little higher on the GSA than the FJR. At just under 18,000 miles on the GSA, I don't expect any trouble, but I did buy an extended warranty which has already fixed a leaking rear drive seal behind the Brake Disc.

The GSA goes anywhere I was brave enough to take the KLR and it is much more fun and much quicker getting there.

The GSA is harder to pick up than the KLR and isn't any easier to pick up than the FJR.

At this point, the Jury is still out, ask me in August. YMMV

What makes your BMW better than HSYHTD

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