LOOKING AT 2004 R1150 RT - What To Look Out For???

dieselyoda said:

Need to see the spreadsheet.

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Happy New Year DY! I see your sense of humour is intact; that's good.

So I think by now Roger is probably a bit tired of answering the same questions about fueling and batteries but at personal risk I will attempt to fill in a blank here that is being missed.


The spec sheet for the Odyssey states that the battery must be charged to 14.7 volts to have a full charge. It also states that anything other than a full charge will lead to sulfation and lower performance. Most standard battery chargers don't charge to 14.7 and actually very few do that AND have the higher charge rate they specify. This is why they have a list of approved chargers.

I should also note that some riders here like GSAddict for example have modified their alternators with a 14.7 volt regulator in order to run Odyssey batteries worry free and to get the max life and performance out of the expensive but very well made and long lasting Odyssey PC680. I use them also in my 1100RT and my R80G/S. For the R80 I bought a digital adjustable regulator because they are cheap and easy to install and dial up the voltage. For the RT I just use my charger for an hour when I get home which tops it up to 14.7 and this seems to work well as the battery is 8 years old now with zero issues.

I guess the short answer is not all AGM batteries are the same despite the similar chemistry. Having worked with the US Military and their rechargeable battery needs I am quite sure they are using Odyssey for very good reasons.

roger 04 rt said:

...2. New stick coils...

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So Roger, what's your opinion of the stick coil system on the twin sparkers?

I’m a fan of two plugs per cylinder. The original stick coils had issues but BMW stuck with them. Putting the high voltage, high energy coils inside the cylinder head, away from the sensitive electronics makes a lot of sense.

roger 04 rt said:

I’m a fan of two plugs per cylinder. The original stick coils had issues but BMW stuck with them. Putting the high voltage, high energy coils inside the cylinder head, away from the sensitive electronics makes a lot of sense.

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That is excellent theory. The problem is that they are fragile and fail much more frequently than conventional coils. In Voni's 1,100,000 miles on Airheads, K bikes, and Oilheads she has NEVER had a coil failure. And in my almost 900,000 miles on the same series of bikes I have also never had a coil failure. But very frequently I read on this Forum or on other forums or mailing lists complaints that eventually trace to defective stick coils or broken wiring or connections to stick coils.

We had an R80/7 that was double-plugged with twin tower conventional coils. They are among those cited above that never failed. It is not necessary to use stick coils to obtain two plugs per cylinder. I would be happy with stick coils of they were robust and reliable, which they do not seem to be.

PGlaves said:

That is excellent theory. The problem is that they are fragile and fail much more frequently than conventional coils. In Voni's 1,100,000 miles on Airheads, K bikes, and Oilheads she has NEVER had a coil failure. And in my almost 900,000 miles on the same series of bikes I have also never had a coil failure. But very frequently I read on this Forum or on other forums or mailing lists complaints that eventually trace to defective stick coils or broken wiring or connections to stick coils.

We had an R80/7 that was double-plugged with twin tower conventional coils. They are among those cited above that never failed. It is not necessary to use stick coils to obtain two plugs per cylinder. I would be happy with stick coils of they were robust and reliable, which they do not seem to be.

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Their reliability and the difficulty of debugging the problems faulty coils cause is why I said, “The original stick coils had issues but BMW stuck with them.” Your earlier motorcycles didn’t have CAN bus and a dozen microprocessors to control its many systems. Practically speaking, designers are much better off not having to route multiple high energy wires. Physically, they’re better off not having to place two large coils, each of which is the size of an entire microprocessor system. Space is at such a premium that it’s hard to find space for add-ons.

Where BMW has let us down is not finding a way to make the stick coils as reliable as larger remote coils. Perhaps we’re part of the problem too, letting our bikes sit and idle until the plastic softens. What do those temperatures do to the coils?

roger 04 rt said:

Their reliability and the difficulty of debugging the problems faulty coils cause is why I said, “The original stick coils had issues but BMW stuck with them.” Your earlier motorcycles didn’t have CAN bus and a dozen microprocessors to control its many systems. Practically speaking, designers are much better off not having to route multiple high energy wires. Physically, they’re better off not having to place two large coils, each of which is the size of an entire microprocessor system. Space is at such a premium that it’s hard to find space for add-ons.

Where BMW has let us down is not finding a way to make the stick coils as reliable as larger remote coils. Perhaps we’re part of the problem too, letting our bikes sit and idle until the plastic softens. What do those temperatures do to the coils?

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More hints as to why technology failures have BMW motorcycles falling lower and lower on Consumer Reports reliability ratings.

Paul / Roger: Thanks for this discussion.

The issue for many of us is how much technology we want on our bikes. It seems that much of the general buying public seems to be accepting of higher technology, and the manufacturers can stay in business.

Been riding BMWs since 1982 and one thing I have noticed is that BMW does not have a great track record of acknowledging defects and addressing them in a forthright fashion. The first reaction seems to always be to simply state there is no problem. I find this way of doing things really off putting and not helpful to their business as a whole. It may save some money in the short term but when you lose BMW enthusiasts due to intransigence and outright lies the long term success of your company is put at risk. Is it worth it? Heck, I don't know. But if it wasn't saving them money why do they do it?

I think the most blatant one for me is the totally obvious engineering mistake made in the mating of the new six speed Getrag gearbox input shaft to the clutch hub on the engine side on the 1150 series. It is quite obvious that the two design teams did not have correct specs on the bell housing because a mechanical interface of a spline hub to a spline shaft is normally 100% or more. But the input shaft does not extend all the way through the splines on the hub on those bikes and they eat input shafts and clutch hubs on a very regular basis. I am certain that a mechanical engineer would look at this and say that is just wrong. Period. No excuses, no mealy mouthed explanations. It is just not the way these things work. Has anyone ever seen a spline interface that does not fully engage it's mate?

As clear evidence I have a good pal (GSAddict) who realized this very early on. He went to a mechanical design house he has worked with in the past and had them examine the issue. They pointed out the glaring error and redesigned the shaft to fully engage and also made some material improvement to the grade of steel used I believe. Then he had them make a prototype. That prototype has been in his 1150GS for over 200,000 kms now and was inspected not too long ago. The wear was next to zero and yes, he maintains his splines. These vastly improved shafts are on offer again here for those who love their 1150s and want to keep them on the road I think this is the way to go especially now since BMW has them back ordered forever... See here: https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?93741-FEELER-Improved-R1150-6-Speed-Transmission-Input-Shaft&p=1149995&viewfull=1#post1149995

You shouldn't be surprised that every manufacturer, from vibrating tooth brushes to 150,000 lb bulldozers have issues.

I gotta few stories!

As to stick coils: Get used to them.

I've had trouble with stick coils in my Audi, too. But they're only 70 bucks.