Page 7 of 7 FirstFirst ... 5 6 7
Results 91 to 95 of 95

Thread: New law on Lane Sharing / Splitting .. how do you read this?

  1. #91
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    160
    These discussion of lane sharing usually go about the same way. Those of us who have done it for long periods of time are big fans, while some who live in states where it's illegal, who have no experience with it, oppose it. Some in the second group see that it might have advantages, but many vehemently oppose it. sometimes for odd reasons. Here, Greenwald doesn't like that some riders don't abide by the CHP's "tips and guidelines," which he consistently mischaractizes as laws or at least, rules. On another forum, one member opposed it because where he lives "there's no need for it." Coincidentally, I was in his area on a recent trip, and found myself in very slow traffic for about half an hour, where lane splitting would have been quite useful.

    Some see no reason for it, they tell us that they don't have the traffic issues that are common in the densely populated areas of CA. But somehow, they overlook the potential for traffic to back up, just about anywhere, anytime, from an accident that blocks several lanes of traffic construction or other road‒closing reason. When that happens, they're forced to sit in traffic, as I was on a recent trip, out of state. As I mentioned, the driver behind me was busy on his phone and I put me at risk for being rear‒ended due to his distraction. Had lane splitting been legal, such a risk would not have been present. On that same trip I was left hanging out in high speed traffic by a backed up off‒ramp. Rather than stay exposed, I broke the law and lane split. My life was worth the low potential for getting a citation. But I'd have done it even if a police car had been right there.

    One thing that's seems to consistently be overlooked by those who oppose lane splitting is that when it's legalized, it's NOT mandatory. If you're afraid of it, if you don't like it, if you think it's more dangerous than sitting in traffic, just DON'T DO IT! But the studies support the fact that when done under certain "tips and guidelines" it's SAFER than sitting in traffic.

    The level and number of distracted drivers has never been higher. What with more and more mostly‒young drivers taking to the highways while texting, Facebooking, Tweeting, viewing videos, and doing email ‒ it's getting more hazardous for motorcyclists who are easy prey for their inattention while they sit behind the wheel of their two ton, slightly‒guided missiles. Sitting in traffic, waiting to be crushed by one of them, is not for me. A friend of mine lost his leg in such an accident. Perhaps (probably) that's given me more of a push to support lane splitting than most. Apologies if I sometimes come across as a zealot.

  2. #92
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Fly Over Land
    Posts
    11,742
    Quote Originally Posted by greenwald View Post
    Mika - You raise some interesting scenarios.

    Personally, I don't think this 'push to autonomous transportation' is going very well. Seems like it's being rushed to market, albeit still in the testing phase, and not doing well.

    Seems the same has been true for many computer operating systems, constantly in need of patches, updates and fixes. And 'speech recognition' software. Woefully lacking in efficiency, yet we're forced to argue with it every day.

    I remember enjoying Arthur C. Clarke's Profiles of the Future, where he prophesized so many innovations, medical advances, exploration, colonization and progress in our social structures - and yet, here we are in 2018, and much of what was in that book has failed to come to pass. Not his fault, per se - he was just a bit too optimistic a visionary.

    I think calling "lane splitting a worldwide phenomenon" is giving it a bit too much credit. In hopelessly crowded urban areas around the world, where scooters and low-to-moderate cc motorcycles are numerous due to cost, gas efficiency, high fuel costs and vehicle-ownership being too expensive for the masses, lane splitting evolved for those reasons.

    I think we are generations away from autonomous transportation being the norm, if for no other reason than we barely keep our aging infrastructure manageable as is - a redesign is financially a long way off. I hope so - where is the fun in that?!

    Enjoy the present - especially on two wheels!

    Warning: The views in this piece of windmill tilting are sinscer but presented purely for the love of discussion and the practice of procrastination. I should be writing a report. The deadline is days away and I donít like what I need to write; therefore, a bit of fun procrastination is in order.




    In baseball if homerun hitters are all you watch you are in for seeing a lot of strikeouts. By doing that you are ignoring the walks, bunts, and base hits that make up the game and final score. Moving across the six stages of autonomous vehicles or developing (or developing computer systems) is an iterative process. This can be frustrating but that is the case when there is a lot of learning going on.

    The prophetic dismissal trope always amuses me. Major or minor prophets of the Tanakh, Dickensí Ghost of Christmas future and futurist writers offer predictions with outcomes based on following a certain path. Explicit or implicit in those predictions is the ability to end up someplace different if you change the path in some way. The changes could be large; however, large long run changes to future outcomes often are the result of small incremental changes altering the path only slightly in the short term but changing the course being tracked with increasing impact the farther you go out.

    I see lane splitting as a worldwide phenomenon, non based on some idea of how it evolved; rather, because it is being discussed worldwide as an option to adopt or reject in transportation discussions. In either case I believe developers, transportation planners and governments need the input of riders to come to viable solutions in either case. The input needs to be from proponents of lane splitting, opponents like Kevin, and groups like the MOA and the Foundation.

    I donít know when or if autonomous transportation will be the norm. I am not certain what that means. We are on the front end of the current wave of development. The law of unintended consequences will come into play at various times. Those instances create new issues to deal with.

    The law of unanticipated obstacles is playing out now. Legal and financial questions of liability and ownership are being sorted out by insurance companies and companies wanting to be players in the future transportation field.

    Infrastructure redesign is constantly going on. Ask any map maker (digital or paper) and they will confirm it. New roads and rebuild old roads can be expensive. Yet much of the infrastructure redesign comes at the cost of paint and signage. Lanes get changed with paint. Two way streets become one way with the change of signs. Lanes are repurposed for bus use or commuter use with the addition of signs and paint. In the process motorcycles might be added to the wording.

    New or rebuilt infrastructure is happening. These are being designed now with multiple options considered and available for use over their 15-30 life spans.

    Yes enjoy the present - especially on two wheels - and keep your head up to see where you want to go.
    Pass the mustard and UP THE REVOLUTION!

  3. #93
    Registered User greenwald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sheboygan, WI
    Posts
    5,115

    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by mika View Post
    Warning: The views in this piece of windmill tilting are sinscer but presented purely for the love of discussion and the practice of procrastination. I should be writing a report. The deadline is days away and I don’t like what I need to write; therefore, a bit of fun procrastination is in order.




    In baseball if homerun hitters are all you watch you are in for seeing a lot of strikeouts. By doing that you are ignoring the walks, bunts, and base hits that make up the game and final score. Moving across the six stages of autonomous vehicles or developing (or developing computer systems) is an iterative process. This can be frustrating but that is the case when there is a lot of learning going on.

    The prophetic dismissal trope always amuses me. Major or minor prophets of the Tanakh, Dickens’ Ghost of Christmas future and futurist writers offer predictions with outcomes based on following a certain path. Explicit or implicit in those predictions is the ability to end up someplace different if you change the path in some way. The changes could be large; however, large long run changes to future outcomes often are the result of small incremental changes altering the path only slightly in the short term but changing the course being tracked with increasing impact the farther you go out.

    I see lane splitting as a worldwide phenomenon, non based on some idea of how it evolved; rather, because it is being discussed worldwide as an option to adopt or reject in transportation discussions. In either case I believe developers, transportation planners and governments need the input of riders to come to viable solutions in either case. The input needs to be from proponents of lane splitting, opponents like Kevin, and groups like the MOA and the Foundation.

    I don’t know when or if autonomous transportation will be the norm. I am not certain what that means. We are on the front end of the current wave of development. The law of unintended consequences will come into play at various times. Those instances create new issues to deal with.

    The law of unanticipated obstacles is playing out now. Legal and financial questions of liability and ownership are being sorted out by insurance companies and companies wanting to be players in the future transportation field.

    Infrastructure redesign is constantly going on. Ask any map maker (digital or paper) and they will confirm it. New roads and rebuild old roads can be expensive. Yet much of the infrastructure redesign comes at the cost of paint and signage. Lanes get changed with paint. Two way streets become one way with the change of signs. Lanes are repurposed for bus use or commuter use with the addition of signs and paint. In the process motorcycles might be added to the wording.

    New or rebuilt infrastructure is happening. These are being designed now with multiple options considered and available for use over their 15-30 life spans.

    Yes enjoy the present - especially on two wheels - and keep your head up to see where you want to go.
    Excellent prose for someone who's procrastinating another deadline. LOL

    I will consider your words carefully, as they are academically crafted. Perhaps I should be less harsh on an autonomous future, though the pragmatism of 32+ years in 'the trenches' of active transportation problem solving makes that a bit of a challenge.


    I hope that motorcycles do not get shoe-horned into a purpose-built lane in the future, but such decisions will most likely be made by individuals who do not ride, as we represent only about 3% of the 'licensed-to-drive' demographic.


    If your weather across the border from me is as nice as today, here along the western shores of Lake Michigan (an anomaly of 80+ degrees and a bit of sunshine!), get out and ride on two wheels - it's more fun than writing a report.
    Kevin Greenwald - MSF Lead RiderCoach # 121656 (BRC,SBRC,IS,IME,SMARTrainer)
    Nationally Certified Law Enforcement Motor Officer (Ret.) / IBA Member #34281
    Motorcycle/High Performance/Teen/Winter/ATV Driving Instructor - ROAD AMERICA Track

  4. #94
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Fly Over Land
    Posts
    11,742
    Weather - ugh!!!

    Rain, flood warnings, more rain forecasted today and tomorrow turning to snain then snow for Thursday.
    Pass the mustard and UP THE REVOLUTION!

  5. #95
    Mehrten
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Arizona, USA
    Posts
    96
    Back in the day (the 60s) I rode in Bangkok, Thailand. We lane split/shared whenever or wherever we wanted. I have a collection of old scars to prove it!

    Splitting lanes in California is totally different, and by my long past standards is so much more civilized and safer.

    I live in Arizona where lane splitting is illegal so it's not something I do on a regular basis. For me the sheer number of vehicles of every size and shape on CA freeways never ceases to amaze me, and during rush hour traffic it can be a bit intimidating.

    On our recent ride to California to meet Mario Andretti at his winery, we lane split on I-680 going north to the I-80 junction. Traffic was moving though very heavy. Then it came to near standstill due to a serious accident. As traffic slowed and came to a 5 or 10 mph crawl, we began moving between the lanes. I'd say we lane split somewhere around 7 miles or more.

    It was easy to see who the Californians were and who the out-of-staters were. The Californians would see us coming and give us room. The out-of-staters rarely saw us coming and made no effort to allow us through. Didn't matter. We'd wait a few seconds, traffic would begin moving, and we'd dodge around the out-of-staters.

    Riding two up with my wife, I assure you I rarely take any unnecessary chances. Motorcycles splitting lanes in California has become the norm. From my recent (though limited experience) the majority of the drivers are aware and give motorcycles room.

    Note: I have lane split in California many times. I graduated from HS in California. I lived in North Hollywood when I got out of the Army back in 70, and got into racing Porches on the Interstates on my Ducati 750. Its like any activityÖthe more you do it the easier and more comfortable you become with it.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •