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Thread: Fatality Statistics

  1. #31
    Registered User 36654's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by miairhead View Post
    One thing I applauded ABATE is the group is starting to try and make sure the driver does not get off lightly. In this county we treat driving too lightly, in Europe drunk driving is a crime, not is the USA.
    OK, but what if no malice is intended? If the other driver just makes a mistake and the motorcyclist has no safety equipment, why should we prosecute the other driver as a criminal for an accident that would have been a fender bender, if both vehicles were cars? If the motorcycle rider rejects the option to wear safety equipment, he/she must accept a portion of the responsibility for the injuries/damages incurred to themselves.
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  2. #32
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
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    This is a link to the sited study
    http://www.ghsa.org/html/publication...ycles_2012.pdf

    WebBikeWorld.co keeps running UU sales stats by brand.
    http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcyc...statistics.htm
    Pass the mustard and UP THE REVOLUTION!

  3. #33
    Alps Adventurer GlobalRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    OK, but what if no malice is intended?
    So what, they have to assume responsibility for their actions.

    The old "I didn't see you" excuse is wearing thin. If they didn't see them, then they should be off the road.


    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    If the other driver just makes a mistake and the motorcyclist has no safety equipment, why should we prosecute the other driver as a criminal for an accident that would have been a fender bender, if both vehicles were cars?
    OK, so if I drive a 5-ton truck or tractor trailer and hit you in your car, I can tell you you should have been in a truck.


    Quote Originally Posted by 36654 View Post
    If the motorcycle rider rejects the option to wear safety equipment, he/she must accept a portion of the responsibility for the injuries/damages incurred to themselves.
    A helmet does very little for you when you t-bone a car that is turning left in front of you.

  4. #34
    Small road corner junkie pffog's Avatar
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    I am with GR. Too easy and too little responsibility put on drivers AND riders. There are thousands of deaths a year from left turn encroachment

    There is also a total disregard for MC and even bicycles from many DOT guidelines, and total ignorance from the highway workers. I have seen huge un-aggregated tar patches and smooth steel plates covering construction pits, both have traction equivalent to packed snow, when wet, and very hard to see!
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  5. #35
    Alps Adventurer GlobalRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pffog View Post
    Too easy and too little responsibility put on drivers AND riders.
    If the government is short of money, there is soooo much money to be made handing out tickets/fines to drivers not following rules in manuals.

    I also have a beef with tinted windows amongst all the other worthless small pecker syndrome bling (tinted tail lights, etc) on cars. They are so dark that even on a sunny day I cannot see the face/eyes of the driver in the car. Lets not even talk about the driver's ability to see out of the car at night. I don't give a rat's a$$ if he has a stop. I do want eye to eye contact confirmation as a hint that they at least maybe know that I am there.

  6. #36
    Back in the saddle again mikegalbicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlobalRider View Post
    I do want eye to eye contact confirmation as a hint that they at least maybe know that I am there.
    That never helped me. In both of my wrecks caused by others pulling out in front of me I had eye to eye contact with the driver and they still pulled out then said they didn't see me. I am watching the wheels now as other have suggested to see if that helps.

  7. #37
    Alps Adventurer GlobalRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikegalbicka View Post
    In both of my wrecks caused by others pulling out in front of me I had eye to eye contact with the driver and they still pulled out then said they didn't see me.
    Nahhh, they saw you; they just didn't like you.

    Having eye to eye contact is hundreds of times more useful than not having any.

  8. #38
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    "Life becomes simpler when the kids move out and the dog dies"

    I've heard that said.
    Some people in that stage of life take up activities that they didn't have time, money or lack of responsibilities to do earlier in life.
    They have the money to buy a decent bike and want a nice riding one.
    They think Harley fits the bill.
    Reflexes have slowed and they don't have the experience from riding for many years to read situations.
    Riding school give the basics, but it still takes time and millage.
    I see many more older riders than I did 20 years ago (Has dependable electric start anything to do with this?).
    Grey hair/beards and helmets too.
    Maybe, if, Harley has a higher accident rate it's because of older first time riders buying the brand.
    As to expand on the first post.
    My first ride was on a 65 BSA C15 (250cc) then I bought a 73 Honda CB450. After that it was a 72 Norton 750 Commando, about 5 years ago I bought a 85 BMW R80RT. So I have moved up in size as the years passed. Less weight to control and power to play with worked well with my inexperience.
    The Norton and BMW share garage space.
    The Norton is lighter and more maneuverable, the BMW more comfortable for two up riding and long distances.
    My point in bringing this up is, take your friend to motorcycle shows (not choppers), Bike nights and swap meets. Let them see what different types of bikes have to offer and think about how they want to ride( afternoon cruse, all day bimbles on back roads, over night stays needing luggage, long distance rides, camping, etc, etc). You shouldn't let them think they need a big motor. I rode to Dallas, TX to visit and ride with my brother. 2,600 mi in 6 days. No problems keeping up with traffic and I took my wife for a ride the next day ( wouldn't happen on the Norton).
    I hope the suggestions help.
    Frank

  9. #39
    Registered User AKsuited's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pffog View Post
    There is also a total disregard for MC and even bicycles from many DOT guidelines, and total ignorance from the highway workers. I have seen huge un-aggregated tar patches and smooth steel plates covering construction pits, both have traction equivalent to packed snow, when wet, and very hard to see!
    FWIW, I worked for DOT in New York. Every chance I got, I pointed out the dangers of spreading crack-seal all over roads. I also pointed out the dangers of not matching up lanes when paving, and leaving edge traps when one lane is paved and the adjacent lane not matched up. I got in big trouble pointing out the folly of chip-sealing off-ramps on an Interstate highway. It wouldn't have so bad if they had broomed the off-ramps properly. I got quite the label of "trouble-maker," which might explain why I didn't get a promotion for 28 years.

    I am now a happily retired highway engineer.

    Harry
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  10. #40
    Alps Adventurer GlobalRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKsuited View Post
    FWIW, I worked for DOT in New York. Every chance I got, I pointed out the dangers of spreading crack-seal all over roads. I also pointed out the dangers of not matching up lanes when paving, and leaving edge traps when one lane is paved and the adjacent lane not matched up. I got in big trouble pointing out the folly of chip-sealing off-ramps on an Interstate highway. It wouldn't have so bad if they had broomed the off-ramps properly.
    I've noticed quite a big difference in the use of warning signs between Europe and North America.

    There was actually a law suit filed by a German motorcyclist who had a bad accident due to road tar strips.


    Quote Originally Posted by AKsuited View Post
    I got quite the label of "trouble-maker," which might explain why I didn't get a promotion for 28 years.

    I am now a happily retired highway engineer.
    I know the feeling! I was with defence as a civi for 21.5 years and had to fight for two promotions while idiots had them handed to them on silver platters. I competed for a position that I ended up not winning. I later found out the winning candidate was given the answers to the exam questions weeks in advance. Of course he was ex-military (well eff him!) It was "fixed" as so many thing were there. A third-world country would be less corrupt.

    I took early retirement with an early departure penalty...could not be happier.

  11. #41
    Registered User AKsuited's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlobalRider View Post
    There was actually a law suit filed by a German motorcyclist who had a bad accident due to road tar strips.
    New York State DOT did cut back on the use of crack-seal (tar strips) on roadways, primarily due to many letters from motorcyclists, and from lawsuits. I helped in a small way by helping point out the dangers, when I was asked my opinion on the subject. I was one of only a very few DOT motorcyclists. One time, when I brought up the subject, a local bureaucrat reacted by saying, "Who cares about motorcyclists?" There is still plenty of animosity towards bikers. Also, many contractors could care less and that is a problem.

    If anyone sees too much tar on roads or any other dangerous situations, write to the highway commissioner or governor or whoever. Protest dangerous conditions.

    Harry
    My fleet: 2015 R1200GS, 2017 Toyota Prius Prime (plug-in hybrid)

  12. #42
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    Just because there is a lawsuit does not mean there is justice or anything will change. A co-worker's husband was on his bike on a curve on a highway exit ramp, yes, in NY state, and the pothole in the concrete was so bad, the rebar was sticking out. He crashed and suffered mild brain damage to the point where he has a very flat personality and he can't work at the level he did before the crash. It was even established in court that the pothole was open like that for a couple of months without being repaired. After several years of court proceedings, the state was found at fault, and the victim only received a low 5 figure settlement. His life, and as a result, those of his family are forever changed. A real travesty.

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