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2010 (DOHC) R1200GS Engine Vibration

strmboui05

New member
I am writing in regards to a problem I am having with my 2010 BMW R1200GS. Have any of you experienced a high-mid frequency vibration isolated to the engine with a loss of power starting at 3700 up to 8000 RPM?

The base line is an engine that has the throttle bodies sync, valves adjusted and reprogrammed engine control unit by the dealer. This bike was very smooth through this revolution range up to the 24 K service. Now both hands and feet become numb due to the engine vibration that was not there prior to 24K. This bike did have a recall performed for the camshaft sensor reductor replacement.

The local dealers are stumped and their only answer is keep riding it and perhaps it will get better. I would appreciate any help/advice to get the bike to run as it use to prior to the 24K service.

Right now I have two options, ride it like it is or sell it!

Thanks
rac
 
Hi Rac,

This sort of screams ignition problem to me.. either a faulty plug, or a bad or not-fully seated coil. Sounds like the spark is failing at high RPMs, which is a sign of this sort of problem.

Sounds like the dealer's mechanics are simply praying that the diagnostics computer will tell them what the problem is. This is a real problem with many mechanics now - they don't have the experience, or knowledge of how things REALLY work to diagnose a problem themselves, especially if it's electrical. They rely on the computer to tell them what to "replace".. in this case, AFAIK, the BMS-KP does not report engine misfires, which would tell you what plug/coil is causing the problem.

Has the dealer tried replacing the new plugs they installed at the 24,000 mile service (the camhead spec's new plugs every 12,000 miles - there is an ongoing discussion of this in another thread I believe..) And it's not hard to not quite seat the coils fully, so that's worth checking (and very easy to check.)

"perhaps it will get better" would have me looking for a new dealership posthaste and pronto.. clueless dolts are the words that comes to mind.
 
I'd add to Don's comment the fact that its falrly simple to damage a wire to stick coil connection by ham handed pulling though a dealer mechanic ought to know better and avoid it. And I agree that higher rpm misfires most often have an ignition cause. Anything that produces a weak spark as a result could be the reason.

Another possible (but again a mechanic error) is failure to get the plug seals on right and the resulting oil leak onto the insulator causing a weak spark- though if the leak is of any significant amount, soner or later you should see it around the plug. Any decent dealer mechanic shouldn't make this error- the seals are pretty forgiving if installed correctly.

Note that the bike computers don't show codes related to weak stick coils and sparks for many of the possible failure modes. So hooking it to dealer computer or GS-911 will show exactly nothing- which is why you need a real mechanic to troubleshoot this type of problem.

Maybe a good indie shop in your area if all your dealership has is parts swappers?? Or maybe you need to make a specific request that they put their best guy on this one. If they have multiple mechanics perhaps there is one who is the electrical or ignition guru.

This one of those cases that illustrates why the best mechanics are underpaid for their knowledge and skill.
 
Thanks All for your help on this problem. I have experienced twice a cut-out or misfire when accelerating in the higher RPM range (3700-8000). Perhaps this is problem you have described that it may be the stick-coils. I am going to examine the sparkplugs and coil connectors for dirt/carbon burns and clean and replace (SPs). However, how do you test a stick-coil and to what specification? Aregular coil I can test with load using an old SUN machine, but a stick-coil, I'm clueless. Is this a BMW "Plug &Play" technique utilizing a new and known "good" stick-coil"?

I am looking forward to your recommendations.

Thanks,
RAC
 
Thanks All for your help on this problem. I have experienced twice a cut-out or misfire when accelerating in the higher RPM range (3700-8000). Perhaps this is problem you have described that it may be the stick-coils. I am going to examine the sparkplugs and coil connectors for dirt/carbon burns and clean and replace (SPs). However, how do you test a stick-coil and to what specification? Aregular coil I can test with load using an old SUN machine, but a stick-coil, I'm clueless. Is this a BMW "Plug &Play" technique utilizing a new and known "good" stick-coil"?

I am looking forward to your recommendations.

Thanks,
RAC

That's pretty much BMWs technique - replace and if it gets better - that ones bad..

As an alternative - you could try unplugging coils, one at a time. You can unplug the primary input to the coil right at the coil. It's a be very careful - the parts are delicate and easy to break.. there is a little tab you have to lift up and then use your thumbnails to wedge the connector out.

Do it one at a time. The one that doesn't make things worse is the bad one.

I'm working a bit with Stephen at HexCode - GS911 on trying to diagnose bad coils by cylinder firing quality. That's a work in progress.. so the replace, or disconnect are the current options.

Good luck and let us know if you come to any conclusions..
 
If it wasn't there before the dealer did the 24K service, and it was there right after the dealer did the 24K service, it seems obvious that the dealer did something that is causing it. (as per Dave's Rule # 1 of mechanical repair - "if something is wrong...that wasn't wrong before...look where you last worked...because you probably screwed something up...)

Why was the engine re-programmed??

What was the camshaft sensor reductor replacement??...as you know, the camshaft is a rotating part...did they screw something up doing that??

I would probably ask the dealer to put everything back the way it was, and look where they last worked.

Good luck,

Dave McDougall
2011 BMW R1200GS
 
Thanks for all of your recommendations and instruction it has helped in the trouble shooting.

Let me start with the dealer questions first. The local cetified BMW dealer service departs 3 out of 4 are "Plug and Play" maintenance only. This means that if the BMW Maintenance computer does't tell them to to replace something they start guessing and their first guess is re-flash the ECU. This has occured twice. The first time was due to incompetance of the tech and the in ability to understand basic electricity (24K service). The second time it was reflashed after an attempt to balance (Sync) the throttle bodies with a GS911 and a Twin Max and ECU would not take over the Idle actuators. Therefore the bike would not idle and would die unless held rpm up utilizing the throttle. The second time it was flashed was done by a different BMW Certified Dealer and the bike idled but the vibration was still there. Came back to the same dealer 2 weeks later with same vibration and they re-sync Throttle bodies and checked valves and were in tolerance.(by this time I am up over $300 for the 2 visits) By the way the CAM Sensor was a BMW recall for early 2010 models adn was done at 6-7000 miles by the dealer and it ran even better, no vibration. So I am afraid I have one other Certified BMW Dealer, which I am saving for last ditch before I give up and sell this bike.

I have made some progress since the beginning of this post, I have put 1000 mils on the bike and vibration is still there after using BGK44 injection cleaner. This has not changed anything the vibration is still there, a constant from 3700-8000 RPM. Cleand all stick-coil connections and sparkplugs, plugs looked good: tops-light brown no burns, Bottoms-dark brown deposit, no burns. Before removing the lower stick-coils I noticed some play in the rubber elbo groment. Is that normal? Swithed plugs around since same type#. I have not tried the disconnet test to determine which stick-coil will effct the engine.

A couple of other possibilities has occured to me. First perhaps the CAM timing needs to adjusted. That would definately throw things off. Also, there is a engine balance weight on the back of the engine thaat may have jumped the 2 small protrusions on the Balance shaft. Just thinking (BMW Guessing) !

I will keep you all updated!

Thanks Again,
RAC
 
2010 (DOHC) R1200GS Engine Vibration "Un-Fixable"

Took the bike to the local Beemer master and he was unable to figure out what is causing this vibration. It seems that everyone seems to think it is ok for your hands and to go to sleep with in 15 minutes of riding over 4000 rpms. If this had been the way it had always run I would not have bought the bike. I had a great 24 k miles on this bike and as long as I keep it under 4000 rpms the engine stays smooth. I guess BMW can't fix what they make, unfortunate.

Thanks all for sending your recommendations this helped troubleshoot and eliminate possibilities. Something has change inside this engine/ECU but unable to identify it.
 
2010 (DOHC) R1200GS Engine vibration

Taking the bike in for a final reflash of the whole engine ECU. If that does not fix the vibration the bike goes up for sale. No fun riding electric sanders that numbs your extremities. I will let everyone know the outcome. Unfortunate that my dream bike became my nightmare bike!
Thanks for all of your recommendations.
rac
 
Taking the bike in for a final reflash of the whole engine ECU. If that does not fix the vibration the bike goes up for sale. No fun riding electric sanders that numbs your extremities. I will let everyone know the outcome. Unfortunate that my dream bike became my nightmare bike!
Thanks for all of your recommendations.
rac

Any updates on this? I've seen many posts like this and it usually ends up with the bike being sold or traded in unfortunately
 
Did they replace the plugs when you took it back? I received a bad plug new in the box once. It cut out at high RPM. It happens.

If they have not changed them, ask them to.

If they wont, then buy one plug and try it on one side. If there is no change, put the plug you took out on the other side and see what happens.

Corrected. 4 plugs, not 2. But you can still swap out the plugs one at a time.
 
Last edited:
Stump the Dummy! Still has the Vib!

Wanted to report back after so long to let everyone know the latest result. Took the bike to the dealer and re-flashed the ECU, checked the valves (In mid-), Re-sync TBs, new sparkplugs, new alternator belt (new Part#) and result was: Vibration still there start at 4000-6000 RPM. Had bike checked at another dealer same problem. Took to non-dealer BMW specialists, same problem. All three said valves were set correct.

Enter the GS911 and pro-motion manometer. After re-sync of TBs still has vibration but less intense. Re-checked cable slack (.5-1.0mm). Left side off, reset to .60mm. this brought the butterfly to the complete stop position. Reset slack on right side to complete stop (.6 0mm). Re-synced TBs using GS911.

A reminder: when you get to the end of the Re-sync and it says to turn off the engine right after it says un-locking the steppers, "WAIT FOR IT"! Listen for the steppers to come back on, the engine will run smooth. Then shut the bike off or you will have to do it again.

After the re-sync with the GS911 the vibration was still there less intensive but still enough to put your hands and feet to sleep. The range was at 4000-5500 RPM in any gear (the Sweet spot!)

Next checked Coil sticks and head temperature, all still good. Steppers were good and O2 Sensors as well. Pretty well stumped! The idle is near perfect which is determined by the valves but may still break open the valves and check one more time.

I have close to 33K on this bike and the first 24K was great, but now it just isn't fun anymore. I will update if any new developments.
 
Next checked Coil sticks and head temperature, all still good. Steppers were good and O2 Sensors as well. Pretty well stumped! The idle is near perfect which is determined by the valves but may still break open the valves and check one more time.

I have close to 33K on this bike and the first 24K was great, but now it just isn't fun anymore. I will update if any new developments.

This is what stumps me.. it was good, now it's bad. I had an '04 R1150RS that had buzz in it that drove me off the bike, and like you - I went through it with a fine tooth comb. Never was able to solve it - the R1200R solved it. But that engine was buzzy from new as far as I know.

Good now bad means something changed.

How did you check the coils? (They are all "stick" coils..)
What does the O2 sensor pattern look like when it reaches the critical speed?

An off the wall thought.. Tupperware and the tank.. I assume that's been removed/replaced a number of times. ALL boxer engines have a bit of vibration at around the RPM that's bothering you, but it's well enough damped so as to not be annoying. On my RS - I got lots more vibration when the tank was near empty. I checked fuel pressure, it wasn't changing. What was changing is the tank/fuel combo was damping out some of the vibration when full. Not so much when it got near empty. Could something be loose, could a bushing be worn, could an accessory have changed that might cause the frame to resonate in sync with the normal engine vibration, making it more intense? Like I said - off the wall - but the tanks are usually rubber mounted, and the bushings have been known to wear or get lost..
 
Stump the Dummy

The Lamda Sensor voltage was dead on and the Graphical display wss inbetween the the Green uper and lower linses with minimal spikes at eithe end for the O2 sensors.

The only thing I was able to to do with the Coil Sticks was to determine if all four had a strong spark and they did. I believe the only true test for Coil sticks is substitue each CS with a known operational CS and ride the bike.

I will start through the the bike tourque list and see if something is loose and has setup a harmonic distortion/vibration. I have riden the bike with all the accessories (Crashbars, Valve cover protectors, Skid plate, Panniers, top box) off the bike to see if any of these make a difference. Hopefully it is just a loose motor mount bolt all is well.
Thanks,
rac
 
Stump the Dummy!

I am not sure if I said in this thread, Pull in theClutch and off the throttle and coast at 80 mph bike, handle bars, footpegs go dead smooth.

Last night tried this coil stick test:
Disconnect the lower coil connection from EACH side so you're only running on the main plug on each side. If the bike fires and runs ok (if one of the main coils has failed completely the bike will only fire on one side) then take if for a quick 5 minute ride, and make the engine labour by using a higher gear than normal to check if one is failing under load. If all is ok reconnect the lower coils and then do the same procedure with the main coils.
Each time the the engine ran great even lugging in 5th qand 6th for both top and Botom coils. Had a buddy repeat the same procedure and same result stong pulling, no hesitation, no chug, no coughs, no misses, no backfire.

I didn't realize that it would run so well with the top Coils unpluged.

Running out of ideas. I will check all touques on engine/frame/gas tank/etc.

Send me your ideas, I'm all out!
rac
 
The Lamda Sensor voltage was dead on and the Graphical display wss inbetween the the Green uper and lower linses with minimal spikes at eithe end for the O2 sensors.
I assume you mean they were switching (lean/rich/lean/rich)? Someplace I have an image of the output of mine on the GS-911.. but will have to dig around for it.
The only thing I was able to to do with the Coil Sticks was to determine if all four had a strong spark and they did. I believe the only true test for Coil sticks is substitue each CS with a known operational CS and ride the bike.

I will start through the the bike tourque list and see if something is loose and has setup a harmonic distortion/vibration. I have riden the bike with all the accessories (Crashbars, Valve cover protectors, Skid plate, Panniers, top box) off the bike to see if any of these make a difference. Hopefully it is just a loose motor mount bolt all is well.
Thanks,
rac

Good luck with it. I know exactly how frustrating this can be..
 
Just stumbled upon this thread. Similar issues and looking for improvements.

I am not sure if I said in this thread, Pull in theClutch and off the throttle and coast at 80 mph bike, handle bars, footpegs go dead smooth.

Last night tried this coil stick test:
Disconnect the lower coil connection from EACH side so you're only running on the main plug on each side. If the bike fires and runs ok (if one of the main coils has failed completely the bike will only fire on one side) then take if for a quick 5 minute ride, and make the engine labour by using a higher gear than normal to check if one is failing under load. If all is ok reconnect the lower coils and then do the same procedure with the main coils.
Each time the the engine ran great even lugging in 5th qand 6th for both top and Botom coils. Had a buddy repeat the same procedure and same result stong pulling, no hesitation, no chug, no coughs, no misses, no backfire.

I didn't realize that it would run so well with the top Coils unpluged.

Running out of ideas. I will check all touques on engine/frame/gas tank/etc.

Send me your ideas, I'm all out!
rac

My bike is a 09 R1200 GSA with 45k miles. A few days ago I made a quick 520 miles round trip on the super slab and was pretty annoyed by the vibrations between 4000 and 5500 rpm. The vibrations got worse with hp output or with a load increase like going uphill or head wind. going down hill it was bearable. Pull in the clutch at speed and it's smooth as glass. Therefore mine is definitely engine related.

My right mirror is vibrating more than the left (just another observation). Yesterday I started trying to figure out if I could figure out what is causing this and if I could make some improvements. After reading several post and what others have found I think I have several issues.

One thing that I found was that my bike runs the same if I disconnect the bottom stick coils. However when I disconnect the main side coils it wont go over 40 mph. Its run and idles with reduced power and completely dies under load, just like it hit the rev limiter or somebody hit the kill switch. From reading the above post I think it might be save to conclude that my bike has an electrical issue with either the bottom plugs, stick coils, or some other electrical issue. Because it happened under load it think it must be the stick coils.

Besides the bottom plug issue I was able to make a significant, therefore noticeable improvement. Checked valve clearance and all where within spec. Just did them about 3000 miles ago. Got the GS-911 out and went thru the whole thing and made no changes as none where necessary either. When I checked the throttle body syn the FIRST time it was within spec also. The 2nd time I decided to put a tee in the line and leave the hose that hooks up on the LH throttle body (US models only) as part of the test. There is was a noticeable difference. Throttle body sync near perfect as I have ever seen it with the hose disconnect, Sinc is all messed with it hooked up. This hose goes to the charcoal canister and can be disconnected. I decided to go test ride the bike with the hose off and the test port plugged. Bottom line for me, less vibration, smoother at idle, noticeable clearer right mirror. I have a winner here!!!

After these findings I decided to figure out a way to leave my synchronization tool hooked up during these short test rides. By doing that I found out two things. Right now synchronizations is best when the LH test port is plugged. Its even better when the bottom stick coils are disconnected (I already found out earlier that I must have some issues with those).

FYI must sync tool is simply a 15 ft clear hose filled for about 1/3 with transmission fluid. The specific gravity of transmission fluid is roughly 14 times less than mercury. The highest difference that I observed was 6" transmission fluid (= 0.4"Hg not bad). The best was, dead even at 4500 rpm and <1" at idle.

I think we should keep this thread going and when both bottom stick coils are replaced I will report back.
 
My understanding is that the lower coils are only used at lower RPM to improve emissions and prevent surging (which explains running out of power with the upper coils disconnected). At least, that is the explanation I've read for the lower spark plugs always having less wear and a darker color. So I doubt the lower coils are causing vibration at freeway rpm. Also throttle sync is an issue at and just above idle, above that the ZFE adjusts mixture based on the O2 sensor readings.
 
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