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BMW announced the sale of Husqvarna to KTM to dealers
- Thread starter ldcleve
- Start date
Apparently true- plenty on the web at Bloomberg, other business sites, Cycle News, etc
BMW said they want to focus on "urban mobility and e" stuff-meaning scooters and electrics, I guess, plus they usual fare of the brand rather than Husky's type of machines.
Dirt bike sales have been in the toilet for several years now and aren't recovering well and BMW itself doesn't do a good job at plying in the pricepoint range of such machines- at their core they are a car company that survives selling high priced cages which are under increasing competition primarily from a rapidly improving VW-Audi line as well as some from Mercedes. Its easy to see why a low priced bike line with modest profit potential doesn't run up a big bunch of fans at corporate headquarters.
BMW has made a very good contribution to the Husky brand by recent models and prototype work and it will be interesting to see what happens when this is mixed in with KTM's approach to the game.
A ore immediate issue for the now substantial number of BMW dealers who have taken on the Husky line is what happens to their interest and support- I suspect most will ultimately choose to drop the brand unless somehow some of the KTM stuff comes over also. One can see a reoccurence of the prior Husky parts problems and many related issues in the future unless the transition is managed very well.
BMW said they want to focus on "urban mobility and e" stuff-meaning scooters and electrics, I guess, plus they usual fare of the brand rather than Husky's type of machines.
Dirt bike sales have been in the toilet for several years now and aren't recovering well and BMW itself doesn't do a good job at plying in the pricepoint range of such machines- at their core they are a car company that survives selling high priced cages which are under increasing competition primarily from a rapidly improving VW-Audi line as well as some from Mercedes. Its easy to see why a low priced bike line with modest profit potential doesn't run up a big bunch of fans at corporate headquarters.
BMW has made a very good contribution to the Husky brand by recent models and prototype work and it will be interesting to see what happens when this is mixed in with KTM's approach to the game.
A ore immediate issue for the now substantial number of BMW dealers who have taken on the Husky line is what happens to their interest and support- I suspect most will ultimately choose to drop the brand unless somehow some of the KTM stuff comes over also. One can see a reoccurence of the prior Husky parts problems and many related issues in the future unless the transition is managed very well.
mika
Still Wondering
BMW PressClub Release: Strategic realignment at BMW Motorrad
The sale is to Pierer Industrie AG which is eponymous for principal owner is Stephan Pierer who's day job is CEO of KTM. All the speculation about KTM divesting more to Bajaj and Piere leaving may turn out to be true but European companies seem to allow for this type of thing in ways the US does not.
BMW Motorrad will take its dings form shareholders and the community for how it ran Husqvarna and its lack of performance. In many ways they deserve it. What will generally be forgotten is they most likely passed on a chance to buy it in the mid 2005 range, Husqvarna then owned by Claudio Castiglioni took a trip through Italian bankruptcy courts - Malaysian ownership - back to a Italian court supervised purchased by a group led by Castiglioni only to be sold to BMW for an undisclosed price. Regulator approval of the sale to BMW went quickly but unraveling Husqvarna from MV Agusta and labor problems took a lot longer and cost a lot more than BMW planned.
However the ownership/back of the house business works out I hope the front of the house goes better. They have some interesting products and rumors of more to be released later this year.
The sale is to Pierer Industrie AG which is eponymous for principal owner is Stephan Pierer who's day job is CEO of KTM. All the speculation about KTM divesting more to Bajaj and Piere leaving may turn out to be true but European companies seem to allow for this type of thing in ways the US does not.
BMW Motorrad will take its dings form shareholders and the community for how it ran Husqvarna and its lack of performance. In many ways they deserve it. What will generally be forgotten is they most likely passed on a chance to buy it in the mid 2005 range, Husqvarna then owned by Claudio Castiglioni took a trip through Italian bankruptcy courts - Malaysian ownership - back to a Italian court supervised purchased by a group led by Castiglioni only to be sold to BMW for an undisclosed price. Regulator approval of the sale to BMW went quickly but unraveling Husqvarna from MV Agusta and labor problems took a lot longer and cost a lot more than BMW planned.
However the ownership/back of the house business works out I hope the front of the house goes better. They have some interesting products and rumors of more to be released later this year.
osbornk
Old man in the mountains
BMW don't seem to do well when they get out of their comfort zone. They couldn't figure out the cruiser market and they abandoned it. They apparently didn't figure out the dirt bike market and are selling it. They have now entered the scooter and electric market and I hope they figure it out. High performance is apparently in their comfort zone with their car history so the motorcycle high performance seems to be working.
greenwald
New member
Final drive failures? My understanding is they are few and far between, and usually caused by the owners doing burn outs and such. Not a factory issue........
I heard that too just the other day - from Elvis!
Final drive failures? My understanding is they are few and far between, and usually caused by the owners doing burn outs and such. Not a factory issue........
I think there is quite a few out there that will disagree with you.
westhautianplen
New member
Amen!
Maybe concentrate on QC for awhile, Final drives, ABS units, Oil Seals, Fuel Strips,
Maybe concentrate on QC for awhile, Final drives, ABS units, Oil Seals, Fuel Strips,
SteveAikens
Proud Veteran
Just how much time do you think they freed up?
mika
Still Wondering
I too wish the BMW QC was mythical in its perfection but we have to get a grip guys. I read the recall feeds for three countries every day. Yes BMW Motorrad shows up but I am far more shocked and concerned that Bluebird and other school bus company show up day after day week after week year after year. I put my daughters on their products and they put their children on them now. While I can not predict if or when my FD will melt down or other problems crop up; with regular inspection and maintenance I can anticipate and prepare for problems. Nine months out of the year kids get on buses with no warning, no ATGATT and now no Twinkies. The FD/fuel strip problem seems something to prepare for but come guys - no Twinkies on a bus - we are raising a generation of Evil Knievals.
According to what I just read on the webbikeworld.com site, Husky sales were up 15% in 2012. If that's accurate it would seem to make the brand a keeper. But I never understood why BMW would want to go in that direction to begin with. If they were interested in a line of pure dirt models they could have developed them in-house. Witness the success of the pure (almost) road racer, something totally new to them.
Re the "mythical QC": BMW sales are reportedly up 2% in 2012, not bad in a not so good year for bikes in general. With sales on the increase there is less incentive to fix problems (not that they admit to problems - publically), and with the new water boxer due out shortly, they aren't going to expend much energy on short-term fixes to the existing line. We can only hope they have fixed the final drive issue on the water boxer. Anyone have any info on whether they have re-designed it or just flipped it over?
pete
"Be yourself. Everyone else is already taken." -Oscar Wilde
Re the "mythical QC": BMW sales are reportedly up 2% in 2012, not bad in a not so good year for bikes in general. With sales on the increase there is less incentive to fix problems (not that they admit to problems - publically), and with the new water boxer due out shortly, they aren't going to expend much energy on short-term fixes to the existing line. We can only hope they have fixed the final drive issue on the water boxer. Anyone have any info on whether they have re-designed it or just flipped it over?
pete
"Be yourself. Everyone else is already taken." -Oscar Wilde
mika
Still Wondering
Husqvarna sales had bottomed out. From 13,511 the first year of BMW ownership they slipped to 13052, 12066 and finally 9286 in 2011. The 2012 sales of 10751 was an increase that included BMW engined based but new to Husky models that accounted for 3200+ units of that total.
BMW sales were at new record levels also. When you take out the new scooter sales and some of the other chain driven models to get a similar product lineup it takes them back to sales figures of around a decade or so ago. Overall I still like BMW build quality, I just don't need a shaft drive to experience it anymore with models that interest me.
BMW sales were at new record levels also. When you take out the new scooter sales and some of the other chain driven models to get a similar product lineup it takes them back to sales figures of around a decade or so ago. Overall I still like BMW build quality, I just don't need a shaft drive to experience it anymore with models that interest me.
marchyman
Cam Killer
The G450 and the G650 "X" series (X-moto, X-country, and X-challenge: 2006-2009) didn't do all that great.
mika
Still Wondering
The G450 was short lived in the BMW then moved to Husqvarna. They sell and race it now. The G series has had its ups and downs never having done well in the US market. It has done well in other countries. The strength of the Spanish (or lack of) and Italian markets have had more to do with it than anything else from what I can tell.
I too wish the BMW QC was mythical in its perfection but we have to get a grip guys. I read the recall feeds for three countries every day. Yes BMW Motorrad shows up but I am far more shocked and concerned that Bluebird and other school bus company show up day after day week after week year after year. I put my daughters on their products and they put their children on them now. While I can not predict if or when my FD will melt down or other problems crop up; with regular inspection and maintenance I can anticipate and prepare for problems. Nine months out of the year kids get on buses with no warning, no ATGATT and now no Twinkies. The FD/fuel strip problem seems something to prepare for but come guys - no Twinkies on a bus - we are raising a generation of Evil Knievals.
BUT, Bluebird owns up to their QC concerns...therein lies the difference. As far as I understand from BMW, any error in compliance, functionality or application of BMW products is caused by, but not limited to one or any combination of the following: Air, Gasoline, Electricity, Chemicals and errors on the part of final consumers. Also, the country in which that person lives due to its substandard resources (those listed above). BMW tends to stand behind its unwritten mission statement, "We know nothing, see nothing and hear nothing when it comes to our producut, once delivered to final consumer." I believe they got the first part from another very well known German, Sgt. Schultz of Hogan's Heros.
mika
Still Wondering
Perhaps we are both wrong, or at least not interpreting what we are seeing completely. At the risk of POing everyone...
We all agree there are problems with BMW's final drive. Based on the individual stories reported there are probably more than one issue that make up the problem. BMW agrees, I will argue, because it has tried various things over the years to address things. Changes in bearings, seemingly small changes in various parts etc.
We all take part in a conspiracy of silence about final drive problems. Yes we rant endlessly online, at meetings with fellow riders, heck we talk about it down at the Fly Over Land coffee shop. Yet when and where the talk can be something more than a rant we all are silent. BMW tinkers with solutions to the issue but remains silent in the end to protect itself form lawsuits and their bottom line on advice of council. (How many of riders have made the same decisions in their businesses?) An investigation by the NHTSB, one of the first steps which would lead to a recall, reportedly had four - count them 4 - complaints filed. As a result the NHTSB remains silent because it does not have the data to do their job which they regularly demonstrate they are willing to do. Motorcycling associations remain silent in the end choosing not to become involved in monitoring and reporting while at the same time allowing forums for riders to discuss the problem, rant and exchange information on shade tree mechanic issues related to the problems.
All of the same conditions apply to the school bus industry. The difference there is not the number of problems, though the number does appall me in many ways, but the culture of reporting. For a variety of reasons the culture of the bus industry reinforces reporting of problems to the NHTSB and they do their job which results in regular recalls.
NHTSB is one tool in the tool box to deal with this issue. It may not be the best tool. Based on the anecdotal evidence of the LT investigation it is a tool that is not being pulled out of the box and used by very many. Riders are participating in the conspiracy of silence as a result.
There are things that groups like this could do in relation to the NHTSB, Transport Canada, VOSA, EU/ca etc that do not turn them into political activists or place them in purely adversarial relationships with the MotherShip. The thing is all of the rider organizations I can think of, for any marque, in the position to do this the membership has chosen to remain inactive. Rant - yes. Do the leg work to establish a reporting and monitoring process that breaks the conspiracy of silence - no.
Just saying...sorry...I was the rules of the conspiracy say I am suppose to be silent...
We all agree there are problems with BMW's final drive. Based on the individual stories reported there are probably more than one issue that make up the problem. BMW agrees, I will argue, because it has tried various things over the years to address things. Changes in bearings, seemingly small changes in various parts etc.
We all take part in a conspiracy of silence about final drive problems. Yes we rant endlessly online, at meetings with fellow riders, heck we talk about it down at the Fly Over Land coffee shop. Yet when and where the talk can be something more than a rant we all are silent. BMW tinkers with solutions to the issue but remains silent in the end to protect itself form lawsuits and their bottom line on advice of council. (How many of riders have made the same decisions in their businesses?) An investigation by the NHTSB, one of the first steps which would lead to a recall, reportedly had four - count them 4 - complaints filed. As a result the NHTSB remains silent because it does not have the data to do their job which they regularly demonstrate they are willing to do. Motorcycling associations remain silent in the end choosing not to become involved in monitoring and reporting while at the same time allowing forums for riders to discuss the problem, rant and exchange information on shade tree mechanic issues related to the problems.
All of the same conditions apply to the school bus industry. The difference there is not the number of problems, though the number does appall me in many ways, but the culture of reporting. For a variety of reasons the culture of the bus industry reinforces reporting of problems to the NHTSB and they do their job which results in regular recalls.
NHTSB is one tool in the tool box to deal with this issue. It may not be the best tool. Based on the anecdotal evidence of the LT investigation it is a tool that is not being pulled out of the box and used by very many. Riders are participating in the conspiracy of silence as a result.
There are things that groups like this could do in relation to the NHTSB, Transport Canada, VOSA, EU/ca etc that do not turn them into political activists or place them in purely adversarial relationships with the MotherShip. The thing is all of the rider organizations I can think of, for any marque, in the position to do this the membership has chosen to remain inactive. Rant - yes. Do the leg work to establish a reporting and monitoring process that breaks the conspiracy of silence - no.
Just saying...sorry...I was the rules of the conspiracy say I am suppose to be silent...
