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Thread: Technical Questions

  1. #1
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    Technical Questions

    I am updating my 1963 R60/2, mostly cosmetic items. It currently runs good. As a precaution can the oil slinger ring be cleaned by filling the crank case with solvent then flushing thoroughly and maybe multiple oil changes?

    It shifts a little stiff. any suggestions?
    Jon

  2. #2
    Liaison 20774's Avatar
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    Ah, the age-old questions on the slingers. The stuff in the slingers is compacted very, very hard. It takes quite a bit to pick them clean. So, it is very unlikely that using a solvent would work. And you could never be sure you had all the remnants removed even if it did. I'm afraid the only thing that works is disassembly and manual cleaning and/or replacement.

    Stiff shifting? Where is the stiffness? In the cable, in the foot lever, as you let the clutch out? One thing that should be done as part of a mechanical restoration is the cleaning and lubing of the transmission input splines. The clutch disk slides back and forth on these splines during clutch actuation and it's possible that some jerkiness or stiffness could be a result of dirty splines. A new BMW cable would eliminate the cable as a problem.
    Kurt -- Forum Liaison ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  3. #3

    History - Mileage

    OK -

    Ah, the age-old questions on the slingers. The stuff in the slingers is compacted very, very hard


    Where did the STUFF come from??? How long have you had bike and has it been running good - no carb problems. How many miles???


    The Stuff is usually a combination of gas that did not burn well in a bike that is not running correctly - Carb problem. Dirt in the crankcase - Did you put dirt in there??

    With new oils and a good running bike - burns fuel efficeintly. I questions where this Stuff is coming from??

    I believe if you know the mileage/history oil drained inspection.

    Now if bike has been sitting fo the last 30 years in unknown condition then a tear down would be a safe option.

    You are most likely to break something on a teardown that otherwise would not break.

    Your idea of a solvent and multiple oil changes is a good idea and keep an ear open for any strange noises. I have used Diesel fuel in the crankcase of other bikes (Oil Pump/Pressurized) as a cleaner. DO NOT RIDE (put load on engine) or REV it up just idle.


    I know I may get blasted on this post but the oil slinger system is simple used on many Lawnmowner engines for years just stick with a petrolm based oil and you should be fine. DO NOT use synthetic oil!!!



    Enjoy the ride!!!


    Also the solvent will not get the hard stuff out of the slingers that is already in there but if it is working don't fix it!!!
    Last edited by 85K100LT; 12-02-2011 at 04:34 PM.
    1974 R75/6 W Sidecar
    1989 R100GS


  4. #4

    Recomended intervals

    The slinger questions can easily be answered with a quick visit to the Bench Mark Works web site. The interval is about 40,000 t0 45,000 miles and it is necessary to disassemble the engine to do it properly. I have spoken with "gurus" specialists and people out to make a quick buck and the story is the same. The gunk that gets packed in the slinger and clogs them up is a combination of dirt, worn engine internals and the remnants of things that manage to get into carbs and oil filler caps. You will RUIN your engine if you fill it with solvent and slosh it around with out disassembling it to get all the crud out. There are no shortcuts and neglecting them will be a death sentence for your /2. Removing the motor is a fairly easy job for someone with marginal mechanical skills and some decent hand tools, I did it the first time with my /2 tool kit and no book. You would have to contact individual repair shops to get quotes on the slinger service but you can count on around $800-$1,500. Its a lot cheaper than a new /replacement motor. Dan at Cycle Works (no affiliation) just rebuilt a crank shaft for me for a very reasonable price and he may be able to help you prepare for what needs to be done and an approximate cost.

  5. #5
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  6. #6

    I stand corrected

    Ok after looking at the link for Slingers I would suggest not using a solvent to try and clean the system could cause more damage if it worked and loosened some of the Slinger crud!!

    Mileage / History of Bike is important and if an unknown and you plan to keep Bike then do it for piece of mind and document for future owners!!!

    I stand correted by the experts
    1974 R75/6 W Sidecar
    1989 R100GS


  7. #7
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    Thanks for the info..solvent idea is out. How do you tell if the slinger service is needed other than a known history?

    The bike has 62,200 indicated miles. I have owned the bike a year. I bought if from a high school friend/dealer. It was one of his personal bikes. He claims it has had little use during the 15 years he owned it. His shop did the general maintenance. I do not have any detailed prior rehab history.

    I have under taken a general rehab. I have done the wheels, spokes (four needed), brakes 70%, bushings (2 updated-cracks), changed tires, tubes etc. Old tires were 13 years old some cracks 70% tread. No surprises.

    Just before I started the rehab a new issue showed up. The Gen light would not go off when I removed the key. I disconnected the battery. I can not find a likely cause.

    I am looking to replace the rear fender ($600 price looks high). The hinge support is cracking and it has a dent near the license plate area.
    Jon

  8. #8
    Liaison 20774's Avatar
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    There is no way to tell if slinger service is needed...it has been asked if a borescope could be used to look inside. It's impossible because there is very little space to see (probably less than 1-2mm) and the end of the borescope would need to articulate and turn back 180 degrees. All of that is impossible.

    Prior operation and maintenance also doesn't tell the story. I think in the old days with single weight non-detergent oil, you could probably go a long time. I've heard some of the old /2 gurus (Duane Ausherman, for one) say they've gone 100K miles without slinger overhaul. But with those kinds of oils, the crud was not held in suspension and it would settle out in the oil pan. Removing the oil pan and cleaning at regular intervals went a long way to keep the oil cleaner. But with oils we have today, the detergent oil keeps the stuff in suspension, allowing the slingers to capture it all.

    An prior riding history is no real clue either. I've heard people who picked up a barn find with 15-20K miles on it only to find the slingers full. Inactivity may be a bad thing, allowing particulates to work free during the infrequent runnings. My R69S had 27K on the clock when I got it...slingers needed to be done.

    You best bet is to run a good oil, change it every 1000 miles, and line the bottom of your oil pan with magnets. If the pan is steel, just drop the magnets in so they don't conflict with the sump pickup. Vech sells rare earth magnets...once down, they're not going anywhere. An aluminum pan will need the magnets glued down. You can also use a drain plug with a magnet insert.

    At 62K miles, my strong recommendation would be to do the slingers. You have no clue as to what the state of them are...once they're done, you'll have probably 30-40K miles, at least, of worry free miles. If you let the hole in the crank pins get occluded, you'll toast your crankshaft and then it's a really big cost!

    There is a book written by Doug Rinckes that helps with troubleshooting the /2 electrics. Vech has a nice updated copy...highly recommend that. There is V1.0 out on the web, but it only helps so much, but it's a place to start.

    http://www.snafu.org/restore/uandm_bmw_v1.pdf

    As for the fender, you might consider ebay or the marketplace at IBMWR.
    Kurt -- Forum Liaison ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

  9. #9

    Fenders are made of gold

    Yup you might be better off getting yours fixed by a decenter body guy, the hardest part is getting somebody to duplicate the hand pin striping.

    If you wanted take the bike on short low to mid speed rides I don't see that as being to bad for it but I would do a couple things first.

    Drain the oil and check thoroughly for any metal or an extreme amount of crud, this would require dropping the oil pan and taking a real good look at things including the pick up screen and the bottom side of the block. If you don't find metal or chunks of unidentifible's then it should be OK for a few shake down rides. Before you put the oil pan back on you should take and flatten out the dimples that happen around the bolt holes in the oil pan. A little metal block as a backing dolly and hammer them flat.

    With some fresh oil in it and a valve adjustment (inspect for abnormal stuff while your at it) start it up and little run with a fan blowing from the front to the back of the bike to keep things cool. Listen for any not normal clunking or rhythmic knocking and do that across sevral speeds from idle to about half throttle. If its pretty quiet (solid lifters do click and make some noise) get on it and ride it around and check the other stuff.

    The generator light could be a loose or broken wire either in the head light bucket or generator cover . Or as I found with my very first /2 way back when a cracked circuit board but mine wouldn't shut off either.

    Your money would be better spent on the slingers before the rear fender.

  10. #10
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    Great information and article. Continuing the process...
    Jon

  11. #11
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    My 1963 R60/2 reconditioning continues...
    Latest issue is wheel spoke size.
    I need 5 spokes replaced, 3 front, 3 rear
    One is striped, 5 slightly bent.
    The replacements I ordered are 3.5mm diameter my bike is all 3.1mm.
    Gauged with a digital micrometer.
    How can I find the smaller spokes to match the existing?
    Is anyone parting out old wheels?

  12. #12
    Liaison 20774's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jchellgren View Post
    How can I find the smaller spokes to match the existing?
    Check near the bottom of this thread:

    http://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?t=47142

    Buchanan's and Woody's Wheelworks would be where I would check.
    Kurt -- Forum Liaison ---> Resources and Links Thread <---
    '78 R100/7 & '69 R69S & '52 R25/2
    mine-ineye-deatheah-pielayah-jooa-kalayus. oolah-minane-hay-meeriah-kal-oyus-algay-a-thaykin', buddy!

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