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Thread: A BMW F800RT Why not

  1. #1
    wanderer
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    A BMW F800RT Why not

    BMW needs a light weight, more easily handled RT. While the R1200RT is a wonderfull bike and the leader in it's class...it is ...just to big.

    The old R80RT or R100RT were of a more average person scale. Easy to get on, everyone could flat foot them to roll them back, of stand up easily on both feet to stretch at a stop light.

    The F800 is the right size. While some will say the F800ST fills this bill, I disagree.
    Its ergonomics is that of a sport bike, too much weight on the wrists for long days, feet on pegs too high, knees bent so they aik after an hour, etc etc.

    The F650GS has perfect ergonomics in my opinion. The lowered version is better for me, 5"10 28 inseam.

    My recommendation:
    -F650 chassie and bar lay out of great ergonomics
    -Keep 19inch front wheel for great rough road and dirt road handling
    -Long flat seat like the currest std seat....so you can slide back and forth to change positions on long days
    -Low exhaust pipe and muffler so they allow low center of gravity bags
    -Good BMW hard bags...like BMW knows how to do
    -The belt drive from the F800ST
    -A better rear shock/spring , adjustable to handle heavier riders, load, high speed damping.
    -A great center stand
    - And MOST IMPORTANT OD ALL a BWM aerodynamically designed full fairing. Great wind protection, great rain protection including legs
    -Electric adjust windshield is nice but manual adjustment is ok if cost is an issue
    -A 5 gallon tank
    -A 500 watt alternator
    - LED head lamps with option LED fog/visabiliy lights
    - The 85hp engine
    - F650GS gear ratios and gas milage

    It is important to keep the wet weight well under 500lbs

    That is my dream. What do you think?

    Come on BMW do it

  2. #2
    fracture
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    I would be interested in such a bike. However, I have heard that the two cylinder engine is rather buzzy at higher rpm. I have never ridden one of the 800 twins so I cannot verify that. Those that have ridden one or have one, is this true?

    If that is true then I would look elsewhere. I am vibration sensitive and need something pretty smooth at freeway speeds.

  3. #3
    Old man in the mountains osbornk's Avatar
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    I have two bikes because the current RT is to big and also to tall. My R80RT is the right size and is easy to handle. My R1200CLC is far to big but it is low enough that I can handle it without a lot of problems. I think there is a good sized market for a 700-800CC touring motorcycle in the 500 pound range with a low seat. I had enough trouble handling tall and heavy bikes when I was younger but I have now started gettng shorter and weaker. I need something different that what is currently offered. Sometimes less is more.
    'You can say what you want about the South, but I almost never hear of anyone wanting to retire to the North.

  4. #4
    Registered User boxwrench's Avatar
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    Is the engine a short stroke twin?
    If it is it will prolly be buzzy at high rpms. My C50 is 805cc and is one.
    At super slab speeds it was very buzzy. I tamed it w/ a rear drive mod from a larger bike.
    It this is true,won't a simple sprocket change change that?
    Why not take the ST and modify the ergs to be more RT'ish?

    I really like the pic that was posted of a RT'd F800ST.




    Change the ergs to a little more up right and I think it would be a winner
    2000 R1100RT opal blue "Millenium Falcon"
    2006 Suzuki C50 Boulevard blue/silver w/ DJ drive mod.
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  5. #5
    Registered User ANDYVH's Avatar
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    I have ridden the F800ST and F800GS, and I'll soon ride the F800R, as the demo rider for the local BMW shop. I like the F800 bikes and while I have not spent a 300 mile day on one, the rides I have done to me didn't exhibit any vibration/buzz issue. I too have heard that BMW is planning to build a F800RT. Perhaps BMW will play a bit with the final drive ratio to lower the engine revs a bit.

    I do recall that the F800 at 65mph turns about 3750 rpm. Kind of right in line with most RT and GS models. But lower gearing in for an engine speed in the 3000 to 3200 range at 65mph might be better.

  6. #6
    Registered User boxwrench's Avatar
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    If I could ( but can't) I trade in my C50 for a 800RT tho I'd miss the shaft drive.
    A belt drive be ok, not so hot on chain.
    The bike would have double the HP of my C50 and 90% more watts
    2000 R1100RT opal blue "Millenium Falcon"
    2006 Suzuki C50 Boulevard blue/silver w/ DJ drive mod.
    "Gator"

  7. #7
    wanderer
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    I think the F800 engines are pretty smooth running. BMW/Rotax have that internal balencer and it seems to work. I've ridden a few 600 mile days mostly ant 60-75. The vibrations are similiar to my old R1100RT.
    The smoothest bike engine I've ever ridder is the Honda V4. My guess is the new 6 BMW is pretty smooth too.

    The F650GS versions gearing is almost identical to my old R-RT so the revs and the vibration is simular.

  8. #8
    wanderer
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    The ST 800 is a fine bike but it is designed as a sport bike/crotch rocket.
    Those physical and ergonomic attribute are not what I would want in an RT long distance touring bike.

    When I went looking for my light weigh touring , I tested an ST for about 70 miles. It performs and handles wonderfully but my wrists and knees hurt for being curled so tightly in a racing bike type crouch. There is no way I could do a 5 or 600 mile day with out significant discomfort.

    The F650/800GS ergos are much better, the F800GS is far to tall, the F650GS is much better and in my mind the loweres supension version is the best of all. Attached is a picture of my F650GS which I have farkled out toward an F800RT.
    BMW would provide a much better fairing and a lower muffler would allow lower(better center of gravity) bags.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by bobzeliff View Post
    It is important to keep the wet weight well under 500lbs

    That is my dream. What do you think?

    Come on BMW do it
    B. Jan Hoffman, Airhead #1, wrote an article in the most recent edition of Airmail saying exactly the same thing. He used the Honda NX700(?) as an example, but he wanted an opposed twin with the features you mention.

    ian
    Go soothingly through the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon.
    __________________________________________________ ________________________________
    '67 Trail 90 || '86 R80 G/SPD+ || '97 F650ST || '00 1150 GS || '06 HP2e || '07 Xchallenge || '14 Grom

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by bobzeliff View Post
    The ST 800 is a fine bike but it is designed as a sport bike/crotch rocket.
    Those physical and ergonomic attribute are not what I would want in an RT long distance touring bike.

    When I went looking for my light weigh touring , I tested an ST for about 70 miles. It performs and handles wonderfully but my wrists and knees hurt for being curled so tightly in a racing bike type crouch. There is no way I could do a 5 or 600 mile day with out significant discomfort.

    The F650/800GS ergos are much better, the F800GS is far to tall, the F650GS is much better and in my mind the loweres supension version is the best of all. Attached is a picture of my F650GS which I have farkled out toward an F800RT.
    BMW would provide a much better fairing and a lower muffler would allow lower(better center of gravity) bags.
    In the past year Voni has ridden her F800S a bit over 30,000 miles - mostly touring. There is no way her back would take the spinal compression of stark upright seating found on a GS or typical RT configuration. I on the other hand can't take more than about 300 mile days on her S or K75S or R1100RS. My back and arms take it fine but I get stingers in the back of my neck from holding my head up to level the horizon. Different body positions for different folks. It is usually a matter of conditioning. Different seating positions stress different muscle groups.
    Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
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  11. #11
    Back in the Saddle mcmxcivrs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PGlaves View Post
    In the past year Voni has ridden her F800S a bit over 30,000 miles - mostly touring. There is no way her back would take the spinal compression of stark upright seating found on a GS or typical RT configuration. I on the other hand can't take more than about 300 mile days on her S or K75S or R1100RS. My back and arms take it fine but I get stingers in the back of my neck from holding my head up to level the horizon. Different body positions for different folks. It is usually a matter of conditioning. Different seating positions stress different muscle groups.
    I'm trading up from my R1100RS for ergonomics too. Like Paul, i can't do the forward lean anymore, though for different reasons. For me its a nagging shoulder injury that leaves my arm and hand numb when I sit leaned forward on my RS. I would have really liked to add a third F800 to the stable and a second ST next to my wife's, but the bike just doesn't fit me any better than my RS. In fact, its a bit more cramped in the knees. I chose an 08 K1200GT as it has the styling and looks of the F800ST, but better ergonimics for me.
    Ed Miller, Calgary, AB
    2008 K1200GT, 2009 F800GS
    I can't wait to retire and have a fixed income. The one I have now is always broke.

  12. #12
    Registered User Anyname's Avatar
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    I swapped the leaned forward position of my K100 for the upright stance of the R1200GS because my hands were going numb. Unfortunately, I found no improvement. The issue seems to be pressure on the median (medial?) nerve in the palms of my hands. For me at least, they are more sensitive to handlebar angle than total weight on my hands. My R80 with flat "S" bars causes less of an issue than the high bars on the R1200GS. Someday I'll figure out what details of bar shape work best, but for now it's still a mystery.
    BMW R bike rider, horizontally opposed to everything...

  13. #13
    Back in the Saddle mcmxcivrs's Avatar
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    I only suffer from the numbness and discomfort on my RS. My GS's upright seating is fine for me. Hopefully the GT will be good too.
    Ed Miller, Calgary, AB
    2008 K1200GT, 2009 F800GS
    I can't wait to retire and have a fixed income. The one I have now is always broke.

  14. #14
    Registered User ANDYVH's Avatar
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    I made my own handlebar for my 94 RS, and used a set of Suzuki GZ250 handlebar mounts through the stock RS top plate of the forks. it gave a slightly more leaned into position like a RT. Result is much less hand/palm pressure, especially on the left hand which is constantly counterstering to make the bike track straight because of the off-center fuel tank on the old RS.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Anyname View Post
    I swapped the leaned forward position of my K100 for the upright stance of the R1200GS because my hands were going numb. Unfortunately, I found no improvement. The issue seems to be pressure on the median (medial?) nerve in the palms of my hands. For me at least, they are more sensitive to handlebar angle than total weight on my hands. My R80 with flat "S" bars causes less of an issue than the high bars on the R1200GS. Someday I'll figure out what details of bar shape work best, but for now it's still a mystery.
    look for a set of risers and some aftermarket dirt bike handlebars that are shaped more to your liking, like ProTaper. They make all kinds of bends and heights... if you have one near your house, best to go to a dirt bike accessory store to try out different options.

    this can make a world of difference for you.

    ian
    .
    Go soothingly through the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon.
    __________________________________________________ ________________________________
    '67 Trail 90 || '86 R80 G/SPD+ || '97 F650ST || '00 1150 GS || '06 HP2e || '07 Xchallenge || '14 Grom

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