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Is BMW's 20W-50 a semi-synthetic?

hjsbmw

New member
That's what a salesman at a local BMW dealership told me. This was regarding the less expensive oil that sells for something like $8/liter. I always thought that was a regular, purely petroleum based stock.

Looking online I can't find any information that affirms or rejects the salesman's statement.
 
It depends on your definition of "synthetic" - almost every oil in the US could be called a semi-synthetic based on the rulings for using the word "Synthetic" in relation to oil. The 20-50 BMW oil may be a bit more highly refined then some other oils, but in the grand scheme of things, it's probably what most people would consider a non-synthetic oil.

I haven't had a Blackstone analysis done on it to see what the additive package looks like, or what the flash/ash point is after 6,000 miles of use, so I can't address if it's a good oil or a great oil. I have had them done on the BMW Synthetic, and that oil looks quite suitable for the application it's used for.
 
BS.

I have a case of the BMW 20W50 in the garage -- the "Special Performance" text on the label is marketing-speak for "a label that makes you think the extra bux you're spending is getting you something extra." The label sez it's packaged by Spectro; nothing on the label to begin to make you think it's semi-synthetic.

[EDIT] You really do get "something extra" for your extra cash: (i) a BMW-specified (and apparently better) additives package, and (ii) the ability, particularly while still under warranty, to say "what engine failure wasn't due to using a not-recommended oil."


Does your sales guy really think that BMWNA wouldn't be splashing "Semi-Synthetic" in big neon letters all over the label to justify another $3-4/qt. if it really was semi-synth??

I really appreciate straight-shooters in a showroom (fortunately, my dealer has 'em). This is the sort of exact opposite response that raises my BS-detecting antenna and makes me walk away from a salesman. If you don't know your product, you'll get a lot more respect if you are willing to say "I don't know," rather than try to fake your way through a conversation -- particularly with this audience, which is generally knowlegable enough to know the right answer and instantly detect the BS job.
 
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If it were a semi-synthetic, it would state so on the label.

It doesn't; it isn't.
 
Dunno if this is true, but I've been told that with a "semi"-synthetic, you can top it off with anything available. Hmmm... at < 30% synth (by the definition in the prior link), I have to wonder...

I stick with (pardon the pun) squeezed dinosaurs - I can top it off anywhere.
(two-thirds of a pun = P U)

Question: BMW's oil is made by Spectro, yes? Is this the same as "Golden Spectro"? Also - a couple of years ago, there was an oil comparison in the MOA News - I think it was by PAUL GLAVES? - that showed the official BMW oil had more of the requisite "motorcycle additives" than the standard Spectro ... Is this still the case?
 
Since WWII, all oil must be compatible, synthetic or conventional.
I'm sure BMW has Spectro make their oil to their specifications and additives package.
 
Question: BMW's oil is made by Spectro, yes? Is this the same as "Golden Spectro"? Also - a couple of years ago, there was an oil comparison in the MOA News - I think it was by PAUL GLAVES? - that showed the official BMW oil had more of the requisite "motorcycle additives" than the standard Spectro ... Is this still the case?

The 20W-50 is. Dunno on the 15W-50 synthetic. And it wasn't Paul who did the comparison.. it was Jeff DeCarlo who did it. Anyway - he'd managed to find a testing lab that was willing to do samples of oil at a reasonable price (free IIRC) for the article. I don't know of anyone who has tested Golden Spectro vs BMW's repackaged Golden Spectro to see if the additive package is different. If someone wants to pay - I'm sure Blackstone Labs would be happy to do it.

FWIW - Blackstone did do a sample of BMW's 15W-50 Synthetic (unused) for me. And I had them do a sample of oil after 6,000 miles. The comparison:

VIRGIN OIL SAMPLE:
BMW15W50VirginSample.jpg


6,000 MILE OIL SAMPLE:
BMW15W50-36000miles.jpg


If anyone cares to do the same with the 20W-50, it would make an interesting, and perhaps informative comparison.
 
Don, was your test their Standard Analysis?
I'm thinking of doing one for Mobile 1, 15W50.
 
Don, was your test their Standard Analysis?
I'm thinking of doing one for Mobile 1, 15W50.
The virgin sample was. The used sample had the TBN numbers run also (extra $15) - which helps determine if the suitability for extending the oil change intervals.
 
Geez, with results like these, why are we changing oil at 6K??

The 6K sample is darn near fresh oil for zinc, phosphorous, calcium and moly, has essentially no water, has picked up only traces of iron and aluminum, and has virtually no solids. At this rate it looks like at *least* 12K oil.

And to think, some folks start hyper-ventilating when they go 50 miles beyond the official interval.
 
You're right Mark. Plus I've never heard of an engine failure related to oil. Lack of maybe, but not old or synthetic versus conventional.
 
You're right Mark. Plus I've never heard of an engine failure related to oil. Lack of maybe, but not old or synthetic versus conventional.

That absolutely depends on what you mean by "engine failure."

If rings wear out at 150,000 instead of 300,000 miles?

If big-end rod bearings wear out at 100,000 instead of 300,000?

If cam followers wear and rock in their bore at 250,000?

All of these things are clearly lubrication related.
 
I know, but I'm saying where a mechanic wrote on the repair ticket the engine failure was because the owner used the wrong brand, etc.
I don't think anyone is going to destroy their engine because they used Castrol at $4 a quart versus Amsoil at $10 a quart.
 
I know, but I'm saying where a mechanic wrote on the repair ticket the engine failure was because the owner used the wrong brand, etc.
I don't think anyone is going to destroy their engine because they used Castrol at $4 a quart versus Amsoil at $10 a quart.
That's only partially true -- the issue will be whether the oil met the BMW requirements, and it was changed at the recommended intervals.

The problem will be one of proof -- and BMW is in the position of being "right" unless/until challenged. Not a good position to be in as the bike owner.

My issue is the recommended intervals. Paul is right, degraded oil may accelerate wear. But where the oil retains its qualities, the intervals don't make sense, except as a "catch-all" to cover bikes that don't get regularly run, run only short distances, etc. -- stuff I'd call "severe duty." Unfortunately, those of us that ride like Don E. have to abide by the OE change recommendations and throw out perfectly good oil if we want to be sure oil change intervals never become an issue during the warranty period.
 
That absolutely depends on what you mean by "engine failure."

If rings wear out at 150,000 instead of 300,000 miles?

If big-end rod bearings wear out at 100,000 instead of 300,000?

If cam followers wear and rock in their bore at 250,000?

All of these things are clearly lubrication related.

Even if your speculation is right, does it matter? 99.9% or more of motorcycles are wrecked, abused, neglected or something else fails to the extent that they are junkied before any of the above happens. How long do you plan on keeping your bike. I won't live long enough to wear out the engine on either of my bikes but I might want something else down the road.
 
Even if your speculation is right, does it matter? 99.9% or more of motorcycles are wrecked, abused, neglected or something else fails to the extent that they are junkied before any of the above happens. How long do you plan on keeping your bike. I won't live long enough to wear out the engine on either of my bikes but I might want something else down the road.

Not speculation, and it matters to me. My "new" R1150R is at 150K; my K75 died in an accident on a 10 day 49 state ride at 370K, and Voni's R1100RS is now at 350K. And there are many very high mileage Airheads still running around.

For the record, I use Castrol 4T SG rated dino oil and change at 6,000 mile intervals. But if any bike overheats as in stuck in traffic the oil gets dumped ASAP regardless of mileage.

I guessI just don't buy into the notion that BMW motorcycles are disposable items, like old VCRs or toaster ovens. YMMV
 
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