K1600GT and GTL Official Announcement

Easy said:

I can't wait until April 2011 to get the full picture. It'll be interesting to test ride and read the reviews to learn how BMW deals with the additional weight, heat, transmission, final drive and cost issues. Depending on the approach it could be a big step forward or a big one back.

They'll have to keep the base price near the Goldwing's base of $22,899.00 to seriously compete.

The times are definitely changing. I can remember when I thought a 650cc Bonnie was more than enough.


Easy

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Issues? Please not yet. Especially leave the final drive be.
VegasRobdunno

Interesting thoughts expressed here…

I for one have no interest in this but then I don’t have much interest in the Honda ST or new Kaw 1400 though I might have had at a younger age… certainly when in my Yut I went after the speed/power bikes like many others so I suppose the new power bikes would be ones I’d go for now (if I was still a Yut!). Back then of course comfort/handling/features were pretty low on the list and not much was even offered...
I can see why they went this route, bigger motor/more power etc to contend with the other power bikes out there and the sport-touring machines being made by the competitors and certainly its not Just about power/speed but many other factors that make it (and the competition) outstanding machines with much much more to offer than Just power/speed (though that seems to be what many concentrate on)…
I do have to wonder if these will really do much to bring down the average age of BMW owners though, given its probable cost, the younger set (the 20-30 something crowd) will most likely stay with the liter sports bikes one can get for well under 10K. Perhaps it will lower the average some by bringing in more of the mid-40’s (and up) crowd that have the income and are now looking for more than sheer speed/power and can afford the time to really get into long haul touring and who have been leaning toward the offerings by Honda and Kaw, etc. in the sport touring venue and who also want comfort and safety features as part of the package. but lets face it when you build in this much technology its gonna cost and the cost limits who can afford it, just like luxury. cars or any luxury, its a niche market dominated by older folks who now have the means.
Still its going to be a really heavy machine just like its competitors with more power/speed than can ever really be used (legally, anyway) but then BIG seems to be the American trend so have at it I guess. I’d be willing to bet they could do everything this bike does in a one liter package and it would just as fun, just as safe, just as smooth, just as comfortable and probably a whole lot cheaper and less expensive to operate/maintain; but then so could all the other makes out there.
I do have to wonder where it will end (power/speed wise); will we be seeing 2 plus liter machines soon? Will being able to go near 300 MPH be the next the big Rave? Or will the next generation decide its really not about sheer size/power but all the other factors one has to consider when looking at the new top of the line touring machine, the factors that in the end will determine just how popular this machine will be. Hopefully the demographics this bike is geared toward will be able to make that distinction and not merely go for and be attracted to this current generation of sport/tourers for Power&Speed. Maybe even at some point the sport/touring crowd will say "Enough is Enough, I want this but can you drop it by a few hundred pounds and give me greater economy?"

RM

I have 3 Honda CBXes and a KZ1300. Once you have ridden an inline six, you will be hooked. And the whole is not so much about max hp, which you will not use anyway. It is about the smoooooth delivery of monster torque at roll-on and low end.
If the GT is anywhere near the weight and dimensions of the current GT, I will be spending some money on a new BMW next year. If it is just a slightly slimmed down GTL ("LT") I will pass.

I think this bike is aimed at the same audience as the 7 series BMW, Mercedes AMG CL series and similar cars. Some people demand the "best", fastest, most expensive, etc. They will never use their vehicles to their potential but they like to know that they could if they wanted to or they might want to brag about what they have. There is a market for the ultimate machine even if it cannot be used to its potential. Fancy and very expensive Harleys were once a status symbol for the "in" crowd but now that everyone and their brother seems to have one, they are not special any longer and a more exclusive replacement is needed.

osbornk said:

I think this bike is aimed at the same audience as the 7 series BMW, Mercedes AMG CL series and similar cars. Some people demand the "best", fastest, most expensive, etc. They will never use their vehicles to their potential but they like to know that they could if they wanted to or they might want to brag about what they have. There is a market for the ultimate machine even if it cannot be used to its potential. Fancy and very expensive Harleys were once a status symbol for the "in" crowd but now that everyone and their brother seems to have one, they are not special any longer and a more exclusive replacement is needed.

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You may be right about the target customer, but I would add that there is another group, a group of real riders that wants the creature comforts of a Goldwing, without the weight, something more nimble. That the new GT is a technical tour de force is a given; it has to draw the attention of the target audience, whether it be the Mercedes buyer you mention, or the Goldwing guy who loves the bike, hates the weight. I've no problem with BMW's approach with this bike. Those who might complain that its longer wheelbase means it won't handle as well as other bikes miss the point: GT stands for Grand Touring, a style that eschews some sporting characteristics for comfort, without compromising on power or agility. It's not meant to be an SS1000RR. The best analogy I can think of is my former BMW 635csi, a beautiful car, no sports car, but capable of delivering me and a passenger (and a couple of kids, for that matter) in considerable comfort without destroying the driving experience.

I tried the current GT on for size, and thought it had more power than I'll ever use...therefore the new 6 is even more excessive. But the current GT isn't to my mind really a Grand Touring machine as I'm describing the term. It's perhaps better described as a Grand Sport Touring machine, with the emphasis , and ergos, on Sport. I wouldn't want to ride one across the country without significant modifications for comfort.

I'm personally excited about the new bike. Doubt I'll buy one, my RT suits me and my wife just fine.

My next ride will be a two-up full touring rig but BMW will have to do a fantastic sales job to convince me that the new GTL is better than the near bullet proof GL1800 Gold Wing, especially given Motorrad's recalls, FD, EWS, corrosion, stalling issues . . . etc

Too bad really because I like my R12GS but am losing confidence in the company.

bullet proof goldwings

I have one and haven't had any problems. A friend however has an 09
and the transmission has been rebuilt.....twice. On the Honda forums there is a lot of talk about transmission problems on Goldwings. And heated seat/grip problems, old news about cracked frames etc. OH and I forgot to mention that changing the air filter is an all day job, or expect to pay in the area of $300 for the dealer to do it. Rediculous.

I bought one and it is now my next ex motorcycle.
I am tired of wrasseling the pig arround at low speed and in the garage. The GW becomes very light at speed for such a big motorcycle. But I was putting on way too many miles on my /6 because it is just so much more fun to ride.

Anyone want to trade a good GS for a Wing?

Oh by the way, the reason I started this post was to ask a question.
Is the GTL going to be the direct replacement for the LT?

I ride an F800S. I went from an R1200ST to the F800S because I felt the 1200 was too much. That pretty much sums up my opinion about 1600cc bikes in general.

Reminds me of the time I was at coffee, parked next to an S1000RR. 15 minutes later, a guy saw my helmet, said he had the BMW parked next to mine. I started asking him how smooth it was, and he mentioned his girlfriend loves riding on the back, and even fell asleep once crossing Iowa. Then he mentioned something about armrests and I became extremely confused.

Walked out to my bike, the S1000RR was gone, and in its place was a giant LT...

I owned an '84 Honda Interstate many years back. It was a great bike that was big for its day -- 700+ lbs. It came stock with a great touring seat and high-quality attached luggage. There was a radio option if you wanted one. The fit and finish was superb. I only made one long trip on the bike while I owned it and it performed flawlessly. You could ride that bike all day long and enjoy every mile. The fairing provided a great rider's pocket with little or no buffeting. While I enjoy reading about all the technology and gadgetry -- something in me wants it simpler. That old Interstate would suit me just fine -- with some updates, of course.

I'll wait to see just what's in store for the 1600 before making up my mind -- I'm mostly interested in the seating position, storage, fairing/windscreen, torque, wet-clutch, and some extra pillion room. I'm not really looking for a 7 series bike, but a competent tourer that won't break the bank. One that weighs in at 700 or fewer pounds, too. We want a long distance bike that gets us where we're going with no fuss -- and on time. If we don't find it -- we'll just keep riding the RT.

I have to admit, my one brief ride on a 1980 CBX was enough to sell me on a six cylinder bike. I think BMW is going to be paying the piper in the near future if their reliability doesn't keep pace with their technology. A lot of people, including myself, will not buy a BMW in the first year of production, and based the K1300GT I am beginning to think it wise to wait 2-3 years before buying a new BMW model. The reliability issues with BMW bikes are going to catch up with them.

carockwell said:

I have to admit, my one brief ride on a 1980 CBX was enough to sell me on a six cylinder bike. I think BMW is going to be paying the piper in the near future if their reliability doesn't keep pace with their technology. A lot of people, including myself, will not buy a BMW in the first year of production, and based the K1300GT I am beginning to think it wise to wait 2-3 years before buying a new BMW model. The reliability issues with BMW bikes are going to catch up with them.

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That was EXACTLY my thought. Wouldn't it be nice if people talked about BMW reliability in the same way they talk about Honda??
Sad, really is. When I was looking for my K75, almost EVERYONE, spline-lube aside, said they are as close to bullet proof as they come. 150k or more from the engine. Smooth as silk. 22 years later, that is still true of the K75, but not about BMW's new stuff...

carockwell said:

I have to admit, my one brief ride on a 1980 CBX was enough to sell me on a six cylinder bike. I think BMW is going to be paying the piper in the near future if their reliability doesn't keep pace with their technology. A lot of people, including myself, will not buy a BMW in the first year of production, and based the K1300GT I am beginning to think it wise to wait 2-3 years before buying a new BMW model. The reliability issues with BMW bikes are going to catch up with them.

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Sage advice!

I got a new RT in '06 waiting a year to give BMW time to work the bugs out of the new bike. I didn't realize it might take a little longer for some other problems to surface. But now that I've had the bike for 4 years and all the heretofore known bugs have been resolved including a new final drive installed under warranty, I feel like I have a new bike. It'll be a while before I need a replacement.

I will say this about BMW, they are the best I've seen at honoring warranty work. I can't tell you the number of times I've heard people with other brands tell me disturbing stories that end with them saying their service manager told them, "That's normal."

Easy

Easy said:

I can't tell you the number of times I've heard people with other brands tell me disturbing stories that end with them saying their service manager told them, "That's normal."

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....or my other favorite, "they all do that."

These comments all amuse me!

Come now boys you know what it is all about:

"Mine is bigger/better/faster/shinier/whatever than yours!"

BMW like all good marketers are playing right into this.

don't forget newer

fastdogs2 said:

Wow!


So, what do I do, in 2011, if I am considering purchasing the water cooled RT? Do I spend $22,000 for a fully equipped RT or do I go for the 1600GT?

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I really don't want to hijack this thread, but could you point me to a link for info on the water cooled RT? I have not heard of it.

txtinman said:

I really don't want to hijack this thread, but could you point me to a link for info on the water cooled RT? I have not heard of it.

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There's nothing hard out on it yet. The latest issue of BMW Magazine (now employing Sandy Cohen -- a *great* thing, IMO) had a brief article on discussions with a BMW official about future motors. He was cited as saying that water cooling will likely be the boxer's future in view of the coming emissions and noise requirements. A couple artist's concepts of potential arrangements shown (like top intake, bottom exhaust instead of the current rear/front arrangement), but that's it. At least a few years away would be my guess.

Inline 6

ima4nr said:

I have 3 Honda CBXes and a KZ1300. Once you have ridden an inline six, you will be hooked. And the whole is not so much about max hp, which you will not use anyway. It is about the smoooooth delivery of monster torque at roll-on and low end.
If the GT is anywhere near the weight and dimensions of the current GT, I will be spending some money on a new BMW next year. If it is just a slightly slimmed down GTL ("LT") I will pass.

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Yes the inline 6 power delivery is what will make this bike sell. Torque from 1500 RPM on up - never need to go over 5000 rpm. I love the Honda CBX the KZ1300 and the Benellie 750 this will make BMW stand out!!

Interesting...the comments. I like to have the latest thing. If you are not changing, then you are unique in life and the world. Ultimately, you're probably dead.

cjack said:

Interesting...the comments. I like to have the latest thing. If you are not changing, then you are unique in life and the world. Ultimately, you're probably dead.

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Kinda my take, too. While I appreciate the 70s rock that I listened to in high school, I also like lots of the new music showing up.

Same for motorcycles. While I love my old bikes, I'm pretty happy when I get an opportunity to ride something like a Ducati Streetfighter or an MV Agusta.

When your curiosity goes, you might as well be dead, IMHO.