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Thread: Another one bites the dust

  1. #76
    bmwmick
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    I'm picking up the parts tomorrow....I will post pictures of Exactly what is going on. From what he stated, the Shaft splines are "barely worn" and the clutch splines on the disk are gone.

    If that is true, then the clutch 'hub' was clearly defective. At 16K miles there should be almost imperceptible wear on the hub splines and the input shaft splines. I've had some apart that look like new at 110K miles.

    I will bet that there is significant wear on the input shaft splines, probably in a 'barrel' shape.

    Good luck!
    Last edited by bmwmick; 08-13-2008 at 08:39 PM.

  2. #77
    Seattle-area Rounder OfficerImpersonator's Avatar
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    I've scanned my copy of the MCN article - if anyone would like a copy of the PDF, send me a PM and I'll be happy to email you a copy.
    Last edited by OfficerImpersonator; 08-13-2008 at 08:38 PM.
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  3. #78
    Curmudgeon nrpetersen's Avatar
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    As a retired mechanical engineer, I really want to see detailed pictures please. At least then I'll give give you my opinion FWIW. Frankly I've never taken a BMW FD or clutch housing apart or even seen the inside of them (fingers crossed). But I have had a lot of experience designing and assembling other gearboxes and bearing systems etc including having a couple of experiences proving to me what doesn't work.

    Unfortunately, there have previously been indications of a random manufacturing quality problem involving engine/transmission alignment. What I can't understand is why BMW hasn't been able to correct this in later models. Or is it really something else? I find it hard to believe it is simply arrogance, as to me it would border more on manufacturing and warranty cost control stupidity.

    In the OP case, assuming it is still a spline problem, I can't give an opinion until runout of the engine/transmission is measured. It takes a jury rigged setup on the fully disassembled transmission to do this, to confirm a reason for premature failure.

    Remember spline wear rates are hugely dependent on shaft rotational axes (mis)alignments.
    Retired w 2005 K1200LT, 2000 R1100RT, & 1975 R90/6

  4. #79
    Rally Rat
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    I'm picking up the parts tomorrow....I will post pictures of Exactly what is going on. From what he stated, the Shaft splines are "barely worn" and the clutch splines on the disk are gone.
    Defective part, and I'd 2nd the advice to check out the input spline carefully for deformation.

    If you don't need to replace the spline, you can do the work yourself, check out ADVRider.com, they have a "wisdom" area that has step by step instructions for that sort of repair. You'll need to buy a clutch centering tool (or fabricate one), but not a whole lot of other special tools. If the input spline is bad, you'd need to open the transmission, a place I'm not comfortable going (but you may be).

    If you want BMW to listen, try the small claims route. Best $35 I ever spent!

    Good luck!

  5. #80
    Registered User StLouRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kentuvman View Post
    Is this problem inherent to the R1150 or all the newer oilhead models?
    +1.. I have a 97 GS. I had it at dealer yesterday for 72,000 mi service. I asked about the splines and was told that was only on the earlier model bikes..

    Should something have been looked at? My actual mileage is 79,000 (had 73,000 on it when I bought it in April.) Everything else looked good except the front brake master cylinder.. It's leaking arounf the site glass. Does not look "rebuildable."
    BMW will sell me a replacement for $400!!


    Holy Crap Batman!!
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  6. #81
    Registered User MOTOR31's Avatar
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    Clutch spline wear is neither an operator malfunction or a service error. It's a part defect or assembly problem. In either case BMW really "owns" the problem but is simply ignoring it whenever they can.
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  7. #82
    MOA,ABC,AMA,NEF,BREC,CCA brownie's Avatar
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    Gurus??????

    Didn't one of the gurus write about this recently in one of the Beemer pubs?????
    Words to Ride by: Patience, Anticipate, Paranoia
    Shep Brown MOA 27510
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  8. #83
    Seattle-area Rounder OfficerImpersonator's Avatar
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    Are you talking about Bill Shaw's article in this month's Motorcycle Consumer News, or are you thinking of something else?
    Seattle, WA
    2012 R1200GSA
    2002 R1150RT-P
    1992 K75S sold

  9. #84
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    Clutch spline class action suit nets owners and lawyers $$$

    I hope somebody out there finds that high-powered lawyer thats going to get all our bikes fixed! BTW, I am working on a Yamaha 49cc scooter that I bought as a non- runner and the rear wheel was a little loose and when I removed it , the wobble was coming from the wheel splines , not the drive shaft stub.Looks like soft metal splines isn't limited to the Teutonic types. Maybe I can use the same guy to help get the scoot repaired?I just got a $265 check from the Burley Tobacco Cooperative class action suit-the lawyer/s got $49 x198,000 people while we(the tobacco base owners) got the couple of hundred of our own $.
    I had to get this in, as I just can't miss a chance to dis a lawyer$ $

  10. #85
    johnnyjs1
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    Very impressive....The dealer offered me $2700 for my bike on trade. Again its an 04 Rockster 16K Bags, Mayer seats, touring screen, fog lights, lotsa other add ons, not a scratch on it. Pretty good deal huh?

  11. #86
    looking for a coal mine knary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    Very impressive....The dealer offered me $2700 for my bike on trade. Again its an 04 Rockster 16K Bags, Mayer seats, touring screen, fog lights, lotsa other add ons, not a scratch on it. Pretty good deal huh?


    Yikes

  12. #87
    bmwmick
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    Very impressive....The dealer offered me $2700 for my bike on trade. Again its an 04 Rockster 16K Bags, Mayer seats, touring screen, fog lights, lotsa other add ons, not a scratch on it. Pretty good deal huh?

    Johnny,
    Did you get your parts back yet? Can't wait to see the pics.

    If that $2700 had one more zero, I might take them up on it. What a bunch of bozo's

  13. #88
    ArthurKnowles
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    Very impressive....The dealer offered me $2700 for my bike on trade. Again its an 04 Rockster 16K Bags, Mayer seats, touring screen, fog lights, lotsa other add ons, not a scratch on it. Pretty good deal huh?
    Being in the market to sell my LT, I'd have to say the dealer offered you a fair price for it. The KBB trade in value is only 5.2 ~ 5.8 K and that for a motorcycle in operating condition. Your's needs some expensive work. So the dealer will take that in to consideration when making an offer. He probbaly just looked at the KBB trade-in value and subtracted the cost of the work to be performed. Granted, he probably pays less for parts & labor then you would, but it's still a fair value.

    You would probably be better off to restore your motorcycle to stock (you did keep the opriginal parts didn't you?) and sell all the farkles seperately. Plus if you sell your motorcycle to a private party, you can usually get more money for it

  14. #89
    johnnyjs1
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    GREAT NEWS!!! Not only are the splines on the clutch disk worn to the nubs, but the input shaft splines are gone too . From the original quote of $1280 to $2120. Naturally the Rep never even looked at the bike when he was there, no warranty, no help. What do you guys think I could make parting the whole bike out? Or do I fix it, ride it the rest of the season and sell it at the beginning of next season? Think I'm gonna throw up just thinking about it. One thing for sure though, I will never own another BMW again.

  15. #90
    bmwmick
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyjs1 View Post
    GREAT NEWS!!! Not only are the splines on the clutch disk worn to the nubs, but the input shaft splines are gone too . From the original quote of $1280 to $2120. Naturally the Rep never even looked at the bike when he was there, no warranty, no help. What do you guys think I could make parting the whole bike out? Or do I fix it, ride it the rest of the season and sell it at the beginning of next season? Think I'm gonna throw up just thinking about it. One thing for sure though, I will never own another BMW again.

    Another factory defect ignored by bmw/na Can you post some pics? Is the wear on the input shaft barrel shaped? Splines gone at front and rear but sort of OK in the middle?
    I think I would look for a used transmission and just put a new friction disc in it and ride it. Your engine-to-transmission alignment is most probably the cause of your problem. If you just replace the worn parts, it'll fail again in about the same number of miles. 16K is VERY low miles for this failure and you should be able to measure the mis-alignment.

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