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Thread: R1200R Final Drive

  1. #1
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    R1200R Final Drive

    Looking to clear up a bunch of misunderstandings on the final Drive of the R1200R.

    Does it need to changed after the initial 600 miles service?
    If so, what is the frequency?
    What gear lube is BMW recommending this WEEK?

    One would think BMW USA could ensure that the BMW dealers could all sing from the same play book. It is frustrating to get a different opinion from every dealer.

    73516

  2. #2
    Rally Rat
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    If they follow the same procedure for the RT, which I believe they do, the following is true;

    - Fluid change at 600 mi service.
    - 75w90
    - No further changes according to the service schedule.

    Some dealers are using 75w140.


    You can find the service schedules here - http://www.ascycles.com/bmw_motorcyc...schedules.aspx

  3. #3
    RIDERR1150GSADV
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    Personally I'd change that oil at least every 12K, as there is no such thing as life time oil. BMW initially stated that the new FD's needed no maintenance, but have come back on this rather quickly when it became apparent that the new design is not any better than the 'old' one it replaced.
    IMHO it is even worse, as seals are blowing out due to pressure build-up as there is no vent to alleviate this, unlike the older FD's. Think about a sealed container with fluid, being heated up without a pressure relief valve..... There is also LESS oil in the new FD increasing operating temps. Irishkev is in SA experiencing seal failure as we speak...
    I am donning my flame suit btw......
    Just my 0.02 cts. YMMV
    Last edited by riderR1150GSAdv; 02-13-2008 at 10:41 PM.

  4. #4
    Registered User marcopolo's Avatar
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    Both the repair CD (I'm told), and the online parts fiche (available online through several dealer websites) call for SAF-XO in hexhead final drives (and in new K bikes for that matter). According to the product data sheet, SAF-XO is a Castrol product (75W90 synthetic API GL-5) used in rear axles of BMW cars, and also truck and bus rear axles. As I understand it, the Castrol product is not available at BMW bike dealers in the US, though some have suggested trying car dealers. That said, BMW issued a 2005 service bulletin for the R12GS (dealing with the final drive). In that service bulletin, BMW USA "highly recommends" another 75W90 super synthetic (with a BMW part number). Presumably this BMW branded product is the equivalent of Castrol SAF-XO. Although some dealers have used a 75W140 oil, nobody has yet been able to show where -- in writing -- BMW recommends that.

    As to frequency of changes after 600 miles, BMW is silent. According to the SAF-XO product data sheet, it says BMW recommends rear axle oils be changed every two years, but that's in automobile applications, of course. I plan on doing mine once a year.
    Mark
    2015 R 1200 GS Adventure

  5. #5
    K Bikes Complex by Choice cjack's Avatar
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    Just wondering if anyone has any test results of synthetic gear oil breakdown and pressure build up versus temperature.
    BMWMotorcycles, fun when they're running...
    My other bike is a BMW.
    Jack Hawley MOA and RA #224, KE9UW ("Chuck")

  6. #6
    gulfcoastbeemer
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    I may not be a professional BMW Motorrad mechanic, but I've alway viewed "lifetime lubrication" with great skepticism -- more of a business stratagem than a sound engineering practice.

    In spite of any BMW maintenance schedule, I would highly recommend changing the final drive gear oil periodically -- perhaps annually or at least every 18,000 miles.

    Why do I feel such aggressive final drive maintenance is appropriate?

    There have been a enough cases of final drive failures to warrant vigilance; yet the design of the final drive doesn't afford you a convenient way to simply check the gear oil level or its condition -- ergo a periodic drain and refill.

    In a phone inquiry regarding availability of Castrol SAF-XO, BMW North America advised me to use "either BMW 75W90 or 75W140 Synthetic Gear Oil, or whatever my BMW dealer recommends."

  7. #7
    K Bikes Complex by Choice cjack's Avatar
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    I really don't think that the BMW sealed drive is requiring an oil change after the initial flush due to oil wearing out. BMW recommends synth 75W90 long drain oil.
    However, I do think that a periodic oil change, every year or two (depending on mileage), and inspection of what comes out with the oil if anything can be a good maintenance practice and avoid a failure out somewhere away from home.
    Also, I think the spline lube at the input to the final drive done at the same time is also worth doing the maintenance as well.
    BMWMotorcycles, fun when they're running...
    My other bike is a BMW.
    Jack Hawley MOA and RA #224, KE9UW ("Chuck")

  8. #8
    Danger: Keep Back 500 Ft FredRydr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 73516 View Post
    Looking to clear up a bunch of misunderstandings on the final Drive of the R1200R.
    As you can see, it is unlikely it will ever be cleared up on this forum!

    Fred
    '07 R1200R

  9. #9
    Registered User marcopolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FredRydr View Post
    As you can see, it is unlikely it will ever be cleared up on this forum!

    Fred
    '07 R1200R

    That's why I'd use what the manufacturer recommends, not what some guy/gal from the distributor says over the phone, at least insofar as the type of fluid is concerned. But if a bike owner doesn't care, he/she can use whatever they want.
    Mark
    2015 R 1200 GS Adventure

  10. #10
    Danger: Keep Back 500 Ft FredRydr's Avatar
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    Final word

    How about this:

    Would each person who claims they know the true answer please scan and post their dated document from BMW stating the maintenance instruction and fluid specification? Or post the link to the official BMW website with this information. The most recent document wins our approbation and appreciation. (Dealer hearsay and grumpy naysay will be soundly ignored.)

    Otherwise, this is all a lot of noise, and anyone in their right mind will go elsewhere (i.e., BMW) for advice. I sure am.

    Fred
    '07 R1200R

  11. #11
    Just remember, it wasn't that long ago that the official "true answer" from BMW was no oil changes - ever!

  12. #12
    K Bikes Complex by Choice cjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FredRydr View Post
    How about this:

    Would each person who claims they know the true answer please scan and post their dated document from BMW stating the maintenance instruction and fluid specification? Or post the link to the official BMW website with this information. The most recent document wins our approbation and appreciation. (Dealer hearsay and grumpy naysay will be soundly ignored.)

    Otherwise, this is all a lot of noise, and anyone in their right mind will go elsewhere (i.e., BMW) for advice. I sure am.

    Fred
    '07 R1200R
    Marcopolo has it completely correct. Lube at the 600 starting in '07, use BMW's synth 75W90, no subsequent lubes mentioned.
    And not on the bulletin, stock oil is SAF-XO 75W90, not available here.
    BMWMotorcycles, fun when they're running...
    My other bike is a BMW.
    Jack Hawley MOA and RA #224, KE9UW ("Chuck")

  13. #13
    Registered User marcopolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjack View Post
    Marcopolo has it completely correct. Lube at the 600 starting in '07, use BMW's synth 75W90, no subsequent lubes mentioned.
    And not on the bulletin, stock oil is SAF-XO 75W90, not available here.
    Yeah, I thought it was pretty clear. Check the BMW parts fiche online. It's available through several dealer websites, one of which is Max BMW:

    http://www.maxbmwmotorcycles.com/fiche/fiche.asp

    Select your model, then the build date/VIN; then find the diagram called "rear axle drive". For the R1200 R, look at serial No. 17 on that diagram, and you'll find it's final drive gear oil, SAF-XO, 75W90.

    I'm told you'll find exactly the same on the BMW repair CD.

    I also mentioned a 2005 BMW technical service bulletin. Seeing that you appear to be somewhat of a "doubting Thomas", I've copied it below in its entirety. You'll see that most of it has little to do with this discussion, until you get to the end -- where BMW USA makes a strong recommendation for the type of final drive gear oil to use in the R1200GS (same drivetrain as all hexheads). I presume they recommend a BMW-branded 75W90 synthetic (instead of Castrol SAF-XO), because the Castrol stuff is not readily available in the US (at bike dealers at least). SAF-XO is readily available where I live, and that's what my independent tech uses in the final drive of my R12RT.

    As for frquency of changes, ask your dealer to show you the technical service bulletin which calls for the FD fluid to be changed at the 600-mile running-in check, as you don't seem to believe anyone here. That's the sole FD change that I'm aware of that BMW recommends in writing. If your dealer says BMW calls for changes subsequent to the 600-mile service, ask him/her to show you where it says that.

    Now here's that service bulletin from 2005. Ask your dealer if he has it (I've heard of some who couldn't seem to find it). Ask if it has been superceded, if so by what.


    BMWMotorrad
    USA
    Service Information Bulletin
    Subject: Bearing play at the rear wheel drive
    Model:
    Details:
    Aftersales
    Solution:
    Dealer Operation/
    General Manager
    Sales-
    Motorcycles
    Sales -
    Used Motorcycles
    Business Manager
    (F&I)
    Service Parts & Accessories Administration
    Date: February 2005
    Bulletin #33 001 05 (011)
    Source: 33 74/2004
    BMW Motorrad USA Service and Technical
    Contact: Respective Aftersales Business Consultant
    R 1200 GS
    1: In the rear drive of the R 1200 GS the ring gear is supported by two types of bearings: one floating bearing and one fixed bearing without preload. Inherent in this design is a small amount of bearing play at the rear wheel. With all components manufactured and assembled to stated tolerances it is possible that play in these bearings can be felt and measured at the rear wheel. This type of bearing play has no effect on motorcycle handling or on the durability of the bearings.
    2: There is a possibility of play developing between the splined wheel flange (P/N 33 17 7 668 659) and the axle tube of some motorcycles manufactured prior to 08/2004, US VIN# ZL 76187.
    1: In the event of a customer complaint, an inspection and measurement of rear wheel bearing play is to be performed as described below. With cold components the total play (back and forth travel) allowable at the wheel rim edge is 1mm(maximum). Refer to the R 1200 GS Repair Manual CD for measuring procedures as well as temperature definition of "cold components". Replace the entire rear-wheel drive assembly if the play exceeds specifications.
    2: If the complaint is "bearing play at the rear wheel" you must first check that the
    splined flange is secure before performing the measurement noted in point #1. When rocking the rear wheel back and forth, you must first make sure there is no movement between the wheel flange, the rear wheel and the axle tube.
    If play is noticeable between these components you must replace the entire rear wheel drive assembly (complete with flange). Replacing the splined wheel flange only will not solve the situation, because in all probability the splines on the axle tube will have suffered some degree of wear as well. If you are in doubt, you are requested to contact your respective Aftersales Business Consultant.
    Warranty: Covered under the terms of the New Motorcycle Limited Warranty.
    Important Note: Screw 1 is a drain plug for repair-related oil changes; it is
    not for checking the oil level. When filling the rear drive assembly with oil,
    pour in the defined quantity (0.25 l for initial fill, or 0.23 l for oil changes)
    through the bore for the ABS sensor. We highly recommend using BMW
    Super Synthetic Gear oil. 75W 90, P/N 07 51 0 394 082
    Mark
    2015 R 1200 GS Adventure

  14. #14
    Danger: Keep Back 500 Ft FredRydr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjack View Post
    Lube at the 600 starting in '07, use BMW's synth 75W90, no subsequent lubes mentioned.
    Yes, this is what Bulletin No. 33 001 06 (049) says, from August 2006, a year and a half ago.

    Fred
    '07 R1200R

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