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Thread: Dgt = Gone

  1. #16
    Has the GS-Lust The_Veg's Avatar
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    I'm not really sure how I feel about this.

    Did it contain anything objectionable? The observation had been made that it really stayed pretty civil.

    On top of that, it was slightly more difficult to get into than the rest of our fora- it required a unique and deliberate series of clicks, at least on my computer.

    So it might not have 'fit' what we are about. By that measure, we should also abolish the Campfire forum.

    At the very least, those DGT threads were not offensive and included good reasonable dicourse should have been moved to Campfire before DGT was removed. Note that it was not merely closed to further posts, but removed altogether.

    So what would have made DGT a success? I think that question is rather loudly begged, since DGT has been deemed a failure.
    2012 R1200GS
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  2. #17
    BUBBAZANETTI
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapid_Roy View Post
    Fair enough, there is always C,S, and M at ADVriders.
    that's the spirit

    and besides, there's actually more than 6 people who use it over there and the "mental challenge" is considerably greater (some of those guys REALLY know their stuff)

  3. #18
    Registered User burnszilla's Avatar
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    So where am I not supposed to go now?
    Stephen Burns - 2007 R1200GS
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  4. #19
    JCABRANES
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visian View Post
    it sucked.

    ian

    forum liaison
    There goes any illusion that the membership has a voice in the way things are run here.

  5. #20
    univers zero tessler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burnszilla View Post
    So where am I not supposed to go now?
    Burnsie, you're late to the party...
    We've moved it down the hall, in the rec room, next to the foos ball table.

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by JCabranes View Post
    There goes any illusion that the membership has a voice in the way things are run here.
    I posted there myself sometimes (less and less, as of late), but I don't miss it one bit, and I don't blame them at all for removing it. I always thought about how a new member might join and see DGT on their first visit. We have had the luxury of being here before it was created and somewhat knowing how things work. Without that info, people could see DGT on their first visit and decide this isn't the place for them, without giving us a chance. The forum rules are in place. If I want to talk politics, I'll go to advrider.

    Also, just because he said "it sucked" doesn't mean he didn't receive lots of emails suggesting DGT be removed. It's very possible there was more "get rid of it" than "keep it", even if you didn't see it publicly. I know there was a lot of "this sucks" at the start, and then many people just stopped posting there. It doesn't mean their opinions changed, just that they didn't like it and were staying away. You may say "great, let them stay away and leave it there". Just because they ignore it doesn't mean it's not still a stone in their shoe.

  7. #22
    Registered User Rapid_Roy's Avatar
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    Let us not use the reason that this is a bike forum, otherwise Photography and Cooking and everything else we can relate to our bikes shouldn't be acceptable.
    There are forums all over the internet for those subjects too, but we can only talk about Motorcycles so much. I have my ideas why this section was removed, but only a few people acted really unreasonable IMO. It appears that people at Rallys are really on their best behavior. Let us just say it was removed because of democracy in action, and making the moderators work overtime.
    19 BMWMOA Nationals under my belt, and I have no idea what I am doing.

  8. #23
    Registered User Rapid_Roy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BubbaZanetti View Post
    that's the spirit

    and besides, there's actually more than 6 people who use it over there and the "mental challenge" is considerably greater (some of those guys REALLY know their stuff)
    True, but that still doesn't meant they are correct, just louder with facts.

    We have a diverse group here, and I am certain people didn't approve of the topics.
    Much like people don't approve of the National site, or the music picked.
    The majority rules.
    Last edited by Rapid_Roy; 02-08-2008 at 04:59 PM. Reason: to edit
    19 BMWMOA Nationals under my belt, and I have no idea what I am doing.

  9. #24
    Focused kbasa's Avatar
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    Even though I lobbied for it initially, I don't think it's a loss to see it go. If you want to argue that stuff, there are better, more challenging places to do so.
    Dave Swider
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  10. #25
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burnszilla View Post
    So where am I not supposed to go now?
    You, you can go riding I'm just going to continue trying to go to work.

  11. #26
    Still Wondering mika's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBasa View Post
    Even though I lobbied for it initially, I don't think it's a loss to see it go. If you want to argue that stuff, there are better, more challenging places to do so.
    Like the Rally Forum,

  12. #27
    JCABRANES
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdmetzger View Post
    I posted there myself sometimes (less and less, as of late), but I don't miss it one bit, and I don't blame them at all for removing it. I always thought about how a new member might join and see DGT on their first visit. We have had the luxury of being here before it was created and somewhat knowing how things work. Without that info, people could see DGT on their first visit and decide this isn't the place for them, without giving us a chance. The forum rules are in place. If I want to talk politics, I'll go to advrider.

    Also, just because he said "it sucked" doesn't mean he didn't receive lots of emails suggesting DGT be removed. It's very possible there was more "get rid of it" than "keep it", even if you didn't see it publicly. I know there was a lot of "this sucks" at the start, and then many people just stopped posting there. It doesn't mean their opinions changed, just that they didn't like it and were staying away. You may say "great, let them stay away and leave it there". Just because they ignore it doesn't mean it's not still a stone in their shoe.
    I know of no country in which there is so little independence of mind and real freedom of discussion as in America.
    Alexis de Tocqueville



    DGT started as a place where people poked at each other at first and then started evolving into less attack oriented discussion of the issues. DGT was killed to satisfy a few people (read whinners) who didn't or don't want controversial discussions on this board. Frankly, I would be stunned if the vast majority of the membership gave a rat's rear end that DGT existed. So be it. I'm disgusted by the whole thing and specifically by the unilateral decision to just blow it out without any warning to the people that actually used it. JD, I think you would agree with me that a few people posting that "this sucks" is not a good enough reason to kill it. What killed DGT was a few self important people on this board who decided that it had to go so it did. They have the power to do it so they did it. End of story, that's life. But just to remind everyone why DGT started... it was a way to segregate these discussions into an area away from the Campfire. My prediction is that you will see these discussions in the Campfire area again. Fact is that there is a segment of the membership that wants to discuss these issues. Blowing out DGT isn't going to change that.

  13. #28
    BUBBAZANETTI
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCabranes View Post
    I know of no country in which there is so little independence of mind and real freedom of discussion as in America.
    Alexis de Tocqueville



    DGT started as a place where people poked at each other at first and then started evolving into less attack oriented discussion of the issues. DGT was killed to satisfy a few people (read whinners) who didn't or don't want controversial discussions on this board. Frankly, I would be stunned if the vast majority of the membership gave a rat's rear end that DGT existed. So be it. I'm disgusted by the whole thing and specifically by the unilateral decision to just blow it out without any warning to the people that actually used it. JD, I think you would agree with me that a few people posting that "this sucks" is not a good enough reason to kill it. What killed DGT was a few self important people on this board who decided that it had to go so it did. They have the power to do it so they did it. End of story, that's life. But just to remind everyone why DGT started... it was a way to segregate these discussions into an area away from the Campfire. My prediction is that you will see these discussions in the Campfire area again. Fact is that there is a segment of the membership that wants to discuss these issues. Blowing out DGT isn't going to change that.
    here's an honest reply and opinion as to why DGT got canned:

    the truth is two fold. 1 i never ever received any sort of communication from a member that said "thank you, i'm glad DGT exists, thank you for your help." i received many communications stating the opposite, asking for elimination of DGT or a general disgust with the general direction and content of that forum. 2. DGT was becoming a huge drain on the moderating staff. i'm not afraid to admit that it definitely made my role as a moderator less enjoyable. i will let the others speak for themselves, if they wish. i'm still of mixed mindset on DGT, but will tend to agree with Dave that noble intentions led to less than what i had hoped for. i'm sorry, but it had nothing to do with "satisfying a few whiners" overall consensus was more against than for.

  14. #29
    univers zero tessler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCabranes View Post
    I know of no country in which there is so little independence of mind and real freedom of discussion as in America.
    Alexis de Tocqueville
    Great quote... from 1835.

    Quote Originally Posted by JCabranes View Post
    Fact is that there is a segment of the membership that wants to discuss these issues. Blowing out DGT isn't going to change that.
    No one is stopping you from starting your own forum and doing and discussing whatever it is you'd like to do or discuss there.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCabranes View Post
    I know of no country in which there is so little independence of mind and real freedom of discussion as in America.
    Alexis de Tocqueville



    DGT started as a place where people poked at each other at first and then started evolving into less attack oriented discussion of the issues. DGT was killed to satisfy a few people (read whinners) who didn't or don't want controversial discussions on this board. Frankly, I would be stunned if the vast majority of the membership gave a rat's rear end that DGT existed. So be it. I'm disgusted by the whole thing and specifically by the unilateral decision to just blow it out without any warning to the people that actually used it. JD, I think you would agree with me that a few people posting that "this sucks" is not a good enough reason to kill it. What killed DGT was a few self important people on this board who decided that it had to go so it did. They have the power to do it so they did it. End of story, that's life. But just to remind everyone why DGT started... it was a way to segregate these discussions into an area away from the Campfire. My prediction is that you will see these discussions in the Campfire area again. Fact is that there is a segment of the membership that wants to discuss these issues. Blowing out DGT isn't going to change that.

    Yes, there were little people who publicy would write "Good sir" and in the backrooms, call people names. I'm aware of a lot more than one person who did so. Such people are two-faced and liars. As such, they deserve no time from me or respect.

    Ironically, DGT was pulling in more postings and views than some of the "established" forums. There were a lot more people reading these threads than posting. This is similar to a newspaper. There are editorials, columnists, and opinion pages that all are eclipsed by the numbers of readers.

    If we were to go by usage, probably nearly 40% of the forums here would be removed and this is stunning given the short time that DGT was available.

    Yet, usage apparently was not a factor in the censorship. A few insecure vocal minority. When did the minority ever make decisions for the majority? The DGT poll a month or two ago had 2/3 rds of the members voting to retain DGT.

    To be consistent, since we are a motorcycle club, for that is the stated removal of DGT - I hope that those who see anyone posting a food thread, a gardening thread, a photography thread that does not have a motorcyle in the picture, or anything non-motorcycle related thread be immediately reported to the moderators for removal. Of course, the moderators should already have such threads removed.

    Be vigilant.

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