This is going to be unpopular

ahpd1992 said:

I thank those of you who are sticking up for a persons right to state an opinion. That being said the rally was put together well, I just didnt think it was worth it. This is meant in no way to detract from anyone else's enjoyment of the weekend. To be fair I will tell you what I think were pluses of this rally.

-I loved the "recharging station" what a great idea for the campers and such. Most everyone has some electronic device to stay in touch w/ the home base...well done

-I was amazed at all the vendors willing to do on site installation, including complete exhaust systems. That was cool

-the facilities seemed nice and clean for a campground, though I will confess I no nothing of camping, its just not my thing

-again I will state seeing 5000+ BMW's in one place was something I wont forget soon, especially in the home state of The Motor Company

I hope everyone enjoys themselves, my criticisms were meat to be constructive, as a member and rally goer, I see myself as a customer. As a customer I feel I have a right to express what I dont like about a particular product or service.

Tom

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You are absolutely right Tom, you do have the right to express you opinion and I respect that.

I went on Monday to help set up and volunteer. I can do that because I'm retired. Could not have done so if I were still working.

Left Friday morning to take a sailing trip with my with to Canada.

Would I do it again? Yes. I enjoyed working together with other members to get things ready for the rally. I enjoyed working the communications both and helping others find directions/information.

I enjoyed meeting a few others guys Thursday night in front of a tent on the parking lot. Hope to see each of them in WY next year.

Camping is part of the rally heritage/history. I'm not a camper. However, I did buy and inexpensive tent just for this rally and would recommend camping for several reasons. A lot of the rally is meeting new folks. Easy to do if you stay there. For those who choose to have a cold one, you can walk back to your tent. It cost no more to camp but I don't think any of you $35.00 registration fee was for "camping" per se.


I'm sorry you were disappointed. There is more to MOA than the rally and I, for one, hope you will continue to be a member.

Regards,

Re: Sibud

I totally agree with you I am not planning on letting my membership expire. The monthly issues of ON magazine alone are worth the cost of the annual membership

I appreciate you being open-minded, as you said maybe rally's just arent my thing. When I think about I am somewhat of a lone rider, its hard to find people that ride the same way.

My idea of a good days ride is at least 500 miles, a decent hotel, and a few adult beverages when were done riding for the night. I prefer early morning starts to late starts. I would rather take the two lane twisties over the interstate any day. I believe in going with the flow, and not letting the inevitable delays, breakdowns etc... ruin a trip.

A lot of the rally goers probably agree with this, some may not. I went to the rally knowing what it cost mainly to see if it was worth it. I suppose in some ways it was worth it because at least I know what I dont like after giving it a fair try. Of course next year the rally will be far away and $35 for 3 or 4 days is not a bad price camping or not.

Regardless, SIBUD I appreciate your comments. When I first wrote this thread I figured Id get bashed, and I did, but its nothing I cant recover from. It does my heart good to see there are some that are willing to see both sides.

Thanks
Tom

Thread moved...

...because the discussion is better suited here.

Ian
Forum Liaison

ahpd1992 said:

...I pay $70 for the wife and I, so I can buy lunch and walk around for 3 hours looking at stuff to buy. ...

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Tom, maybe it depends upon what you're looking for. We've only been to 3 national rallies, and each one has been more fun than the last. That's because we meet friends at each rally we might not see otherwise, and at each rally we seem to make more friends. My wife and I volunteered to work on setup before the rally began, and it was a pleasure to work for Chuck and Julie Manley. Plus we met and made new friends on the crew we worked with. They treat volunteers very well, treating us to a nice dinner and recognizing all of the volunteers at the closing ceremonies.

If you're looking for a place to shop maybe it's not worth the entry fee. But if you want the rally "experience", then it's really priceless. And you don't have to camp there to enjoy it.

JMHO

Just got back from the Rally a few hours ago myself - 1314 miles and we had a blast! The venue for this year's function was by far the best as long as I've been attending (7 years or so). My only regret was not doing more seminars and demo rides. And since our motel was 24 miles from the site, we spent no time in the beer tent. Instead, I spent more time with vendors and went home with $400 worth of needful things.

The $35 registration fee was a bargain IMO, and BTW...I don't enjoy camping either, but at no time was I under the impression I was paying for a campsite that I didn't use.

Too bad you couldn't find anything of value there, Tom. I thought the MOA and its excellent staff and hundreds of volunteers did a fabulous job.

Some folks were just meant to enjoy motorcycling a different way.

I guess I have to agree with ahpd1992 on one point: there really should have been a "one-day" ticket available (say, for $20 or $25) for locals who could only spend one day there. Having said that, we had a great time there on Saturday. We tried to attend three seminars, one after the other. This didn't work too well, with the first one finishing just as the next one was starting all the way across the grounds, and so on. I understand about set blocks of time vs so many (too many?) seminars, etc. Still...

Otherwise, great grounds, great bikes, great weather, and great effort by all the organizers. Thanks to all from a "rally virgin"!

Great Time!

Well you're right - this topic is going to be unpopular.

Unfortunatly when you have a base of 35,000 members there's always going to be someone who has to crab about something - that's OK -it's a free country - have at it.

I for one had a great time and consider the $35.00 a bargin for all 3 days...live music, free camping, cheap beer, access to a huge knowledge base and great weather.

When we go up to Road America for a motorcycle race, it's $35.00 for one day so I'm not going to squawk about $35.00 for 3 days.

So you can only make it for one day? Well, quite frankly, that's your problem. Clear your schedule and come up for 2 or 3 days.

I found this Rally exceptional - even though I'm from Wisconsin and it was only 22 miles to the Rally site . The grounds were really first rate, the entertainment was fun as well.

Spent an hour outside the beer tent on Saturday afternoon, sitting at a picnic table enjoying a beer, listening to German music, swapping lies with some friends and lauging - that alone was worth $35.00.

I had a great time.

The Big Picture

The Big Picture requires one to stand outside the circle and look at what transpires inside the circle. I was only able to spend 5 hours at the rally even though I am local to West bend, but if you look at the aerial view of the rally you can get The Big Picture (Aerial View).

It looked like time and money well spent to me.

sjwwi2004r1150rta said:

..... get The Big Picture (Aerial View).

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The aerial views are wonderful! Thanks for the link.

Regarding entry fees, I like it that EVERYONE pays the same price for admission - BOD, vendors, volunteers, and all rally-goers. No one gets special treatment - the $35 is equally unfair to everyone.

Also, if we offered low price day passes, we might be attracting just anyone looking to do something for the day or somewhere to drink for the evening and I don't want that. I've always felt like me, my bike and my stuff in my tent are pretty safe at a National Rally and I want to keep it that way. We are throwing a party for MOA members and motorcycle riders, not necessarily for everyone in a 50 miles radius.

I hated this rally because we didn't see boxergrrlie or bmwrtgirl (who doesn't ride an RT anymore). Its not fair. Waah.

Thumbs up!

All of Tom's points are valid - both good and bad. I appreciate the perspective.

I spent two days at the rally. Am new to MOA and BMWs. I ride solo 99% of the time. Love my RT and I am very happy with ON and think it is worth the MOA membership fee alone. That said, quite frankly, I think this forum site is worth a membership fee. Great info/discussions/archives.

Rally cost was not a big deal to me. Being not much of a camper, I stayed at hotel (cost 3X Rally fee for one night) in West Bend where the Rally atmosphere extended. Other guests offered beers to anyone interested in exchanging stories, well into the evening. Couldn't have planned it better! Enjoyed the great Wisconsin roads (particularly that they are not that far from home!) Bottom line, I rode in alone and left having made some new friends and having an Autocom installed and hooked up to helmets. Friends and farkles made this a succesful and enjoyable experience.

Would I do it again? Well, next year's Rally is in some beautiful riding country and I'm already thinking about it.... So yup! I guess I would do it again.

Tom, thanks for starting a good discussion. Maybe we'll see you in Wyoming; never say never!


Mike
Wheaton, IL
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Gray 2006 R1200RT

Bar-goon

To me, this rally was a bargain. It was my third rally, and the best so far. I was there less than 48 hours, but I got to do the following:

-Camp w/ friends and strangers (OK, not for everyone, but I like camping)
-Demo ride on GS Adventure -- COOL!
-Buy a Kermit chair. Actually, they were sold out, but I got free shipping!
-Attend a seminar by Jim Ford on the Art of Riding Smooth -- and greatly improved my riding on the 470 mile ride home!
-See a real German band play German music
-Drink untold number of Spaten Oktoberfest beers (OK, I had to pay, but I can't get that beer on draft at home).
-Watch the hilarious Live Glockenspiel act
-Browse the vendor area and discuss the pros and cons of various types of straps to secure gear to your bike
-Meet and chat with great people standing in line (for food, demo rides, showers, etc.)
-Ride one of the suggested routes in the rally book (Holy Hill, ARts and Curves. What a great ride.
-See a Bluegrass Band
-Attend a Paul Glaves tech seminar.

There was so much to do. To me, that's what makes the rally a bargain. Sorry you didn't like it, but I'll be back.
-

KBasa said:

We all enjoy BMW motorcycles in different ways.

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I'm a KLR rider, so I'm cheap.. $30 pre-reg..

Anyway, Dave hit it on the head.. I didn't go to this rally to shop, for seminars, or to see BMW motorcycles.

I ponied up $30 nyah ) to BS with friends and make new ones. Sadly, BMW rallies have become captive shopping malls for BMW riders. Not a problem, since it's not why I go.. I did hit the vendor row and stopped at TwinHeadlightErnie's shop to BS and say hi.

Other than that, the camping was fine, the food vendors were pretty good, the people I was around were great!!, and I left with everything that I arrived with (minus my camping chair, since the other chairs in the area were looking bad, I wanted everyone to have something to sit on).

The rally to me was a complete success.. And it'll be the only BMW event I'll attend this year. The reason for the success is based purely on the people I spent time with while there..

ahpd1992,
If this rally wasn't for you, it's not really the rally's fault you didn't have a good time. The event is what it is. It's up to you to make it special.

The only thing wrong with this rally

Was that I couldn't go. Otherwise, $35.00 or $70.00 is cheap for meeting and greeting a bunch of like minded people and the entertainment of actually getting to meet D. Swider.

The man is a legend, and should remain so.

This was my first rally and I live less than an hour from the site. My wife only rides with me for short rides and didn't seem interested in attending so I went alone on Friday and met up with a couple of friends. The fee didn't bother me, but when my wife said she wanted to go on Saturday I didn't even tell her about the fee, I felt lucky that she "wanted" to go. We took our time going down, taking the north Kettle Moraine route. When we stopped in Dundee, we met a very nice couple from Maryland and we had some great conversations about everything from motorcycling to our families. We then headed to the rally, a little late (3 pm), registration had closed but the vendors were still open and there was still plenty to do. It worked out great!
I would prefer that the entrance fee had a 2 tier price, maybe just a little upcharge for the campers, a little lower for the regular registration, but I would still have paid the fee for the both of us. I also agree with the earlier post that the fee helps keep the event for the group and not just a bunch of others that want to use it as an excuse to party with us. It is a balancing act and I give my hats off to the organizers and volunteers, great job!

I was in the same position as the original poster. I had about a 90 minute drive from S central WI and paid the $35. AND didn't even get to turn my tickets in, get the patch or pin or any of that. Had a ball looking at the bikes and didn't even get around to doing it. I could only get Thursday off work, but I was really glad I went just to take it all in. But I do sort of "get it" and wish I could have stayed around at least a few days. For me it's better when it's farther away, so it's to the point that its dumb to just go for a day, like this time.

Gilly

ahpd1992 said:

Came in from NW Illinois a whole 120miles from the rally. This is the 1st BMW rally I attended. I attempted in the mid 90's to attend the Chicago Area BMWOA rally in Galena, Il and was so turned off by the attitude of the staff runnning the show I swore Id had it w/ rally's. Well its over 10 yrs later, Id so I figure Im back w/ BMW, Il go to the National seeing as its so close.

Well I gues I just dont get it, I have to pay for a camp site Im not going to use, full weekend passes only, no daily passes (what if I lived in West Bend, WI?) but I say to myself where else am I going to find all of these BMW oriented vendors right? I pay $70 for the wife and I, so I can buy lunch and walk around for 3 hours looking at stuff to buy. Im sure the vendors paid to be there, now why exactly did I have to pay all that money to come in? I just got back an hour ago, I loved to see so many BMW's in one place, but I wasted $70 and it wont happen again.

As I said this is not going to be popular, but let me point out some of the bigger turn offs for me.

- No daily passes for the locals. Being close to or near the host sight should have some advantage, but I guess not.

- Camping sucks, just my opinion, but Im not making you pay for my hotel room, why am I paying for a campsite Im not using

-Liability waivers! Let me tell you the next time I see a Harley bashing thread I will point out that I have never signed a waiver at a poker run. I dont see a half million waivers being passed out at the Sturgis Rally

Now I know everyone is all high about the rally, and I dont know where its going to be next year, but you probably arent goin to see me, as I see in ten years nothing has changed

Tom

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You are correct Tom. I have gone to 16 of them and nothing has changed. I ride during the day or vend, and people drink beverages and dance at night. I am going to keep going until they get it right!
Or until I win a bike. Then I will keep going to win another one.

We are a diverse group and day passes have been talked about for years. I like the fact that I can leave all my stuff out an nobody messes with it. (because they are honest) Day passes means that anybody can get in, especially people of questionable character.
Sometimes their main reason to be there is to steal things. I wouldn't like that.
As a cop, surely you understand that.

Also, a rally, while a party, is also a fund raising (usually) type event.

I know a person I ride with who says rallies are boring. He started camping with us and I was bored. Now that he doesn't go any more, I have found out rallies are what you make them. You obviously didn't expect to have a good time, and you were not surprised.
I go expecting to have a good time, and I always do.
If you are a non social person, I can see a Nat'l not being for you.
Thanks for your opinion, I won't dump on you for having a contrary view (it's happened to me enough here)

Ride safe and please come back in a few more years,(or sooner) the younger riders will be taking over things. Change is inevitable.

Here is a cool Link of the Nat'ls, when and where.

I was the registration volunteer that accepted Tom and his wife's rally fee. If anyone is interested in more details, contact me off list.

I could write a book!

Hear it comes! Complaints complaints complaints. Believe me Sue, Brian and her crew know how to organize and run a rally. My first rally was at Lake Placid and I had plenty of complaints but have since learned to keep my mouth shut. (Well, not really). I worked at registration at Charleston and met a nice young Police officer from Richmond VA who coughed up the fee and was tickled to death to be there and for only FRIDAY NIGHT as he had the weekend shift back in Richmond. Well that is just one story. Tom should wonder about the HUNDREDS of rally goers that stayed in Motel rooms. I didn't hear any of them complaining or asking for their camping fee back.
I worked at security in front of the main pavilion. 99% of the people were very gracious and obliging in showing their wrist bands. One percent complainers can make the job disagreeable. You would be amazed at the stories some would come up with to get in free and others that would try to skitter in while you were distracted. Oh Yes! "Why don't you have day passes?" Several people told me they were just driving by and wanted to take a look. I said fine and directed them to the registration tent where they could pay their $35 like everyone else did.

I have belonged to a Black Powder Gun club for 32 years and we have two invitational shoots per year plus monthly shoots. For years $15 ( I was told it costs $100 each to go to an NBA game including parking, food and souvenirs. How many take their kids to an NBA game?) got a family in for a weekend of camping, shooting, door prizes, night time campfires and music. Now one family had seven shooters, five kids and the parents that would shoot nearly all the matches plus camping there for the weekend. Another participant may have been a lone male who came to shoot only one match and then go home. He paid the same as the family. Many whined that was not fair. I am very proud of my work in that gun club because it was a family thing and none of those kids grew up to be criminals but learned safe and responsible gun ownership and how to be a family and learn how to camp. If we had started to prorate every event it would have been a bookkeeping nightmare as well as discouraging to the families.
Not only that, those families with lots of kids would have not been able to afford the weekend. My youngest son never started using drugs and I thank our gun club for that because we went together and worked, played, camped, and developed a common respect for each other.
There are many who come to cycle rallies with their children and even grandchildren who learn how to get along with adults, ride a motorcycle safely, and maybe even learn how to drink a beer now and then without becoming a criminal or abusive spouse. Looking around the rally grounds last weekend I saw many old timers, including myself that had trouble getting on and off their bikes or in and out of their tents. This organization is aging and if the Kids cannot be attracted to the world of motorcycling, who is going to keep the ball (or wheels) rolling? I keep wondering why I come back again and again then marvel at the nice couple I met this year that camped next to me, Walt and Nila, each riding their own 1995 RT-Classics. Another young fellow, I regret I never got his name but he drives a city bus in Urbana Ill. He camped by me because he had a police RT just like mine. We spent much time comparing notes on maintenance, mileage and accessories. He is 34 years old and we should do everything we can to make these youngsters welcome and want to come back. I think he had a good time.
End of rant.

120 miles

If it's any consulation (sp?), my wife and I took our 1st cycle trip to together from Chicago to the rally and had a great time. $35 to get in each did not seem excessive in this day and age and I did not feel like the food vendors were outrageous. The entertainment was good, the people attending, and working were all really freindly.

Maybe the original "poster" was at the wrong rally...I know the "Blue Knight" rally was in town too.

Thanks for the rally to all that set it up and helped