Almost 2 Months and still no membership materials

[jeffkruger]

I am not much of a "joiner", and I am not in to group activities like rallies. I did think the MOA forums, the magazine and anonymous book seemed worthwhile though, so after years of BMW ownership, decided to join.

I joined and paid on July 2nd, granted right before a holiday. I waited a few weeks to receive my membership materials since there was nothing about how long it might take when I signed up. After a few weeks of not receiving anything I contacted the MOA and told them I was getting ready to leave on a trip and was hoping to have my membership materials and a copy of the anonymous book. I was told the membership materials are printed once per month and that I would be receiving mine soon, but they would send out a copy of the anonymous book right away. I thought that was fair, and I received a copy of the book a few days later, and I was appreciative of having that for my trip. I also received my first copy of the magazine right before leaving on my trip.

As I was nearing the end of my trip I asked my wife if I had received anything in the mail from the MOA and she told me I hadn't. I again contacted the MOA via email and was told that when I joined on July 2nd I had just missed the printing for the month, but a new batch was printing and being mailed on August 15th. This past Friday (August 22nd) I received another copy of the anonymous book, but still no membership materials.

During my trip I was unable to take advantage of a motel discount because I didn't have a membership card to prove membership.

It's almost 2 months since I joined and paid, and I still don't have the majority of my membership materials. I paid for an annual membership but will obviously get less than a full year of value by the time (if?) I receive my membership materials. I think that in today's world most folks expect to receive things relatively quickly. If there is a possibility of a fairly long delayed shipping time I think it should be disclosed when a new member signs up. I have read the MOA isn't getting many new, younger members, and I can only guess that a younger person experiencing such a delay would probably be less than thrilled as well.

Maybe once someone is a member and renews early such things aren't a problem. I don't plan to find out though as I seriously doubt I will renew my membership. The forums are pretty cool, and the magazine is nice, but at this point I just don't feel that great about an organization that takes two months or more to get someone their membership materials.

 

[chasman]

Sent you a PM.

 

[jeffkruger]

I got the PM. Thanks Chuck.

As Ted said in an email to me this morning, I guess the club isn't for me.

 

[mikegalbicka]

As another new member who just paid up this is discouraging to hear.

 

[jeffkruger]

As another new member who just paid up this is discouraging to hear.

Hopefully you joined closer to the printing date and won't notice any type of delay.

In his first email to me Ted Moyer told me they are printed every 30 days. I am 8 week in and still don't have a membership card, decal, whatever comes in that package.

I will probably choose to not renew. I helped convince a brother in law and a neighbor to try a BMW recently. Both bought bikes and I certainly won't recommend joining to them.

I hope you have a good experience.

In an email today, Ted said that I am missing the true benefit of the club if it is about a membership card and a decal, and the club probably isn't for me. I submit that as a new member, getting materials in a somewhat timely manner, is one of the few things we have to initially judge the MOA on. I fully realize there is more to the MOA than a card and a decal, but again, at this point in my experience I have little else to base a judgement on. I can only imagine such things don't do much to bolster membership numbers.

 

[David13]

Jeff
It takes time for them to do the extensive background check, and interview the neighbors and all that.
I think my membership took at least six months, and then I had to go before the 'committee' in Washington and still it was questionable if they would accept me.
So, patience.
Oh, wait, I guess I was confused about which membership. You mean BMW MOA.
Yeah, that shouldn't take too much time.
As to the discounts, I have at least a dozen aspects with which I can get a discount, but they only ever give me one discount.
I think the membership fee is reasonably low, and you get the important things, the Anonymous Book (tho' I have never used it) and the forum.
I think those two items are worth the fee, no matter how long it takes. Many forums charge that much just to be on the forum.
And, when you find out how the members will help you if you need help, it is definitely worth the yearly fee.
dc

 

[jeffkruger]

Thanks for the reply dc

I do realize there are some other good perks. I have personally gone out in the middle of the night with a truck and trailer to fetch a broken down rider from another forum. Other folks from that forum have been of help to me more than once. That forum costs nothing, as do many other forums. I will rarely drive or ride past a broken down rider, no matter what brand of bike they are on.

I also have other affiliations that provide discounts. I doubt I waited two months for materials from any of them.

The magazine is nice, and the forums are great, and the anonymous book is pretty cool (and a great concept). I will probably enjoy them for the rest of my year and then choose to not renew.

 

[RandyBailey]

Jeff,

I'm a retread member, rejoining just a few weeks ago. I guess it's an issue with expectations... I know MOA doesn't have the staffing of the NRA, for example, and my materials will eventually arrive. What sold me on renewing was the online version of the anonymous book.

A couple weeks ago I picked up an RT in Philadelphia and knew if I got into a problem I couldn't handle I could get help from the online listing as I headed 2,400 miles back to Phoenix.

I'm not a big rally fan, but would attend if it's out my way. I have already gotten tremendous value out of information from the online forum.

I should mention that I would never join an organization that would accept me as a member, but in this case it's worth the small annual membership fee.

 

[t2moyer]

Jeff,

Inside your welcome package is a welcome letter, a membership card, a decal and a patch. The real value of your membership is your Anonymous Book, your BMW Owners News magazines, full access to the website and the forum where all of the information is located.

My comment earlier that you are overlooking the best part of membership refers to the interaction with the members, a club President who takes personal interest in your issue, a helping hand on the road when you need it, a group of people on the forum to commiserate with when things don't go as expected. The contacts and friendships you make along the way are the best assets we have and worth well more than anything in the welcome package.

That isn't to say you don't deserve your membership card and decal - you do. And, we agree. It has taken too long for you to receive those items. It definitely sets the tone for your experience here, but we also tried to go the extra mile for you by sending an Anonymous Book in time for your trip, getting your forum access activated and acknowledge we need to do a better job with the cards and welcome package. I even offered to extend your membership so that you could have full value for your $40 or credit your membership with the amount of the missed discount for the hotel room.

Honestly, I think you are overlooking the best functionalities of the club. I know I am likely well over the line that says "The customer is always right," but you really aren't going to be happy here if none of the above matters to you. Personally, I'd like to extend your membership for another three months, deliver your cards and let you experience the best the MOA has to offer.

Ted Moyer
BMW MOA

 

[okiegman]

Jeff,

My comment earlier that you are overlooking the best part of membership refers to the interaction with the members, a club President who takes personal interest in your issue, a helping hand on the road when you need it, a group of people on the forum to commiserate with when things don't go as expected. The contacts and friendships you make along the way are the best assets we have and worth well more than anything in the welcome package.


Ted Moyer
BMW MOA

I hope that you give Ted and the other staff members at the MOA Offices a chance to meet and exceed your expectations. I'm not aware of any other organizations of our size in which you make an informal complaint on the clubs forum and within 45 minutes on a Sunday you are sent an e-mail by the club President.

I know that if you will give us, all of us, a "second" chance the club will exceed the minimal cost of membership. My family and I have made more friends through this organization than probably any other we belong to. The members here care about not only each other but family members and other riders as well.

Thanks for being a member and give Ted a chance - take a deep breath and at the end of the year you won't pass at the opportunity to renew your membership.

 

[jeffkruger]

I genuinely appreciate your message and the offer Ted. It sounds like taking some time to get certain things routinely takes a while. I don't want anything over and above if that is just the way things are routinely done. I do appreciate the offer though.

I understand some of the other benefits of membership, and that will weigh on my decision at renewal time. Obviously one poster looked at membership almost like roadside assistance and renewed because of the online availability of the amonymous list.

There are a lot of great websites and forums with a lot of information/knowledge on BMW motorcycles. I am an IBA Premier member and enjoy their magazine and forum.

When it comes to motorcycles and riding I am not a really social guy. Its not why I ride. I do enjoy talking with other riders from time to time, and will always try to help a fellow rider if I can. I have a good relationship with a couple of dealers and carry a GS911. I know there are some great folks that ride BMW's. I filled out a listing for the anonymous book and realize that its a real benefit of membership.

I hope to receive the rest of my membership stuff soon. In ten !months or so I will decide if I want to renew. The magazine is very nice.

 

[rangerreece]

Well played Ted. Here's for hoping members see beyond the stickers and learn to value the commitment. I got an early edition of Jack Rippies book, "Conversations with a Motorcycle". It has some editing errors in the book and his personal signature up front. He offered to send me a later edition free of editing mistakes. I wouldn't trade the copy I have for the world mistakes and all. In our imperfection as an individual or as a collective, we find the soul. Judge that soul by its "desire" to rise above despite those imperfections.

 

[mikegalbicka]

"I think that in today's world most folks expect to receive things relatively quickly. If there is a possibility of a fairly long delayed shipping time I think it should be disclosed when a new member signs up. I have read the MOA isn't getting many new, younger members, and I can only guess that a younger person experiencing such a delay would probably be less than thrilled as well."

I appreciate Jeff's concern that this could impact new younger members who are used to instant results. It is a valid concern in my opinion.

 

[jeffkruger]

"I think that in today's world most folks expect to receive things relatively quickly. If there is a possibility of a fairly long delayed shipping time I think it should be disclosed when a new member signs up. I have read the MOA isn't getting many new, younger members, and I can only guess that a younger person experiencing such a delay would probably be less than thrilled as well."

I appreciate Jeff's concern that this could impact new younger members who are used to instant results. It is a valid concern in my opinion.

Thanks, I thought it was worth pointing out.

My intention certainly wasn't to whine. Ted is no doubt a great guy. I think 8+ weeks and not receiving the membership package is excessive. Ted's offer was very fair, but uneccessary. Hopefully if this has been an ongoing situation they can make changes for the betterment of the MOA.

I really like the magazine and the forums are great. The anonymous book is also a fantastic idea. I may or may not renew, In will decide when the time comes.

 

[David13]

Jeff
Here is the offer I will make to you.
When the time comes to renew, you renew.
Then, when that year is up, 364 days, you evaluate the year and determine if it was not worth the money. If you determine that it was not worth the renewal fee, and that you got nothing of value out of the membership for that renewal year, you let me know.
And I will reimburse to you your renewal membership fee.
That's how convinced I am that it is worth the fee.
dc

 

[jeffkruger]

Jeff
Here is the offer I will make to you.
When the time comes to renew, you renew.
Then, when that year is up, 364 days, you evaluate the year and determine if it was not worth the money. If you determine that it was not worth the renewal fee, and that you got nothing of value out of the membership for that renewal year, you let me know.
And I will reimburse to you your renewal membership fee.
That's how convinced I am that it is worth the fee.
dc

Thanks, I appreciate the offer but it is unnecessary.

I am the founder and CEO of a pretty good sized company. We develop real estate and build, commercial and residential. I am a hard core capitalist. I some times forget that some organizations/not-for-profits aren't run with the same type of staff and razor sharp focus I am accustomed to and expect of myself and my staff. I can tell you that I have asked a few folks what they would think if they signed up, paid and joined an organization and eight weeks later hadn't received their membership package yet and everyone has said they would consider that unacceptable. That was my only point, and wasn't intended at all as a rant or whine. I figured maybe it was an isolated case and not that common, but based on some other posts I am not sure that is the case. I didn't know that when I signed up, and went into it with what I think typical consumer expectations would have been. Now I know, and I can decide if it's a big deal or not for me. It probably isn't and I will probably renew. I do however believe that if it typically takes anywhere near that long to get a membership packet out that something should be disclosed when folks sign up to avoid disappointment or misunderstandings.

ON EDIT: After writing the above I checked today's mail. Almost 8 weeks after signing up/paying and I still don't have a membership packet. In an email August 12th Ted wrote: "You are correct. You just missed the previous printing batch. Another is scheduled to mail August 15." It is 10 days after the 15th and I haven't received anything yet. I get it, apparently this may not be that unusual, but without any type of warning/explanation I had no way of knowing that. When I receive my membership package I will post about it. I know if something like this was a recurring problem in my organization it would be dealt with.

 

[t2moyer]

ON EDIT: After writing the above I checked today's mail. Almost 8 weeks after signing up/paying and I still don't have a membership packet. In an email August 12th Ted wrote: "You are correct. You just missed the previous printing batch. Another is scheduled to mail August 15." It is 10 days after the 15th and I haven't received anything yet. I get it, apparently this may not be that unusual, but without any type of warning/explanation I had no way of knowing that. When I receive my membership package I will post about it. I know if something like this was a recurring problem in my organization it would be dealt with.

I'll have a membership package Priority Mailed to you tomorrow. You will have it by Thursday.

Ted

 

[jeffkruger]

Thanks Ted.

I, as are some other members that have contacted me, are curious as to why it has taken so long? When could I have expected to receive my packet if I hadn't started this thread?

In an email you told me that my packet was scheduled to be mailed out on August 15th. What happened to that? Why was it not mailed on the 15th, and now 11 days later you are mailing it because of this thread?


ON EDIT:

Here is my correspondence with Ted:

On July 14th I sent this message to Ted:

Hello Ted,

I joined the MOA on the 1st or 2nd of July. I haven't received my membership materials in the mail yet. How long does it typically take to receive those?

Thanks.

On July 15th I received this reply (notice he said I should receive my materials "soon":

H Jeff,

WE print the new member packets every thirty days. You should be receiving your membership materials and cards soon. I do see that your membership is active and your forum access has been granted. You can also view digital editions of the BMW Owners News online.

Let me know if you have any questions or need anything.

Ted Moyer
BMW MOA

On August 11th, while on a motorcycle trip, I sent this message to Ted:

Hi Ted,

I received the Anonymous book before I left on my trip and appreciate you sending it out.

I am still on the road but called home today and asked if I had received anything from the MOA yet, and I haven't. Since I joined on July 2nd this seems to be taking quite some time. I did receive my first magazine right before I left.

Do you have any idea when I can expect to receive my other membership materials. I realize you only print them once per month and I may have joined soon after you had done the last batch or something.

Thanks

On August 12th I received this reply from Ted:

Hi Jeff,

You are correct. You just missed the previous printing batch. Another is scheduled to mail August 15.

So on July 14th I was told I should be receiving my packet "soon". About a month later, on August 12th I was told it would be mailed on the 15th. 11 days later and it still obviously wasn't mailed for some reason, and so it is just now being mailed out. I have kept waiting for an explanation, assuming that something unfortunate happened to a key person, a printing shop caught on fire, something. I really do have to wonder, if I hadn't started this thread and things would have run their natural course, just when/if I would have received my packet?

 

[henzilla]

Does it really matter that much?

There is no secret decoder ring in the box

 

[t2moyer]

Thanks Ted.

I, as are some other members that have contacted me, are curious as to why it has taken so long? When could I have expected to receive my packet if I hadn't started this thread?

In an email you told me that my packet was scheduled to be mailed out on August 15th. What happened to that? Why was it not mailed on the 15th, and now 11 days later you are mailing it because of this thread?

Jeff,

Nothing has changed since we started this conversation. We have a printer that processes cards every thirty days. You joined the organization on July 2nd. You are in a batch of cards for the month of July that was downloaded and sent to the card printer on August 1. The card printer processes, prints, stuffs and mails those envelopes. Scheduled delivery of those welcome packets to the post office is the 15th of each month. Your batch was dropped at the post office on August 13th and I have checked to make sure your name is included. It is.

We utilize a USPS bulk mail permit to mail the welcome letter and card. USPS service standard for bulk mail is 7 - 14 days. That would put us at the 27th of this month for delivery and still be within the standards set by the USPS. Is that what we are hoping for? Absolutely not, but it is the system that is available at the moment. Is there room for improvement? Absolutely and we are currently working with our vendors and staff to improve delivery times.

Your email to me on Sunday said "I have zero interest in the reason for such a delay and have no intention of renewing my membership when it expires." Therefore, I didn't explain this process any further or move quicker to send a card since I believe it is in the mail, based on our current process. It wasn't until these posts that it became apparent that I need to get you a card at all costs. And that is what will happen today.

I am happy to bend over backwards for the members as is most of our staff, volunteers, Directors, etc. In my view, we are all one family and if you need something, I'll be glad to take care of it. After we are done, I'll be working to find a solution so that the same issue doesn't happen to another member. If any member needs something, just say it. "I haven't received my card. Can you send me a new one?" Sure can.

Ted